My Pride arived today

Florian · « **on:** 22 Jul 2005, 07:20 pm »

My Pride and Joy arived today. Actually we carried it and used a Transporter. Fellow members know what it is

Current equipmet is the Pathos Acoustics Classic one with the Unison Research Unico CD all balanced. I will have my Sphinx PJ2 back by end of this week in which case i will use the Sphinx PJ2 MKII and PJ18

ekovalsky · « **Reply #1 on:** 22 Jul 2005, 11:48 pm »

Very nice! Wish I still had my pair

What kind of crossover are you using ? I wish I had the TacT RCS back when I had my Divas and the Muse subs...

How do they compare with the Scintillas ? I won't ask how they compare with the RM30's, I already know the answer to that!

Florian · « **Reply #2 on:** 23 Jul 2005, 12:08 am »

Thanks my friend !

I am still using the Apogee external passive x-over since i dont have anymore money to buy the DAX3. But in good time.

Well i think that the DIVA is in a different leauge than the Scintilla. The speaker simply have no character, it plays what you put into it. Its the closest i have ever heard to real.

-Flo

PS: I can get you a DIVA from italy if ya want

Bingenito · « **Reply #3 on:** 23 Jul 2005, 12:14 am »

Hey buddy the system looks great

I wish I could swing by for a listen like in the old days

I know we have talked about this before but why not loose the glass coffee table?

Have you listened with and w/o the table?

Take care!

Bryan

Florian · « **Reply #4 on:** 23 Jul 2005, 12:20 am »

Thanks Bryan !!

Dont worry, the Table will leave soon....well this one at least

PS: Hop on a plane, we can drink some beer and eat some good Bratwurst under the trees LOL

Here are some more pics.....see the fat x-over box

You can adjust the bass, upper midbass, midbass and tweeter

ekovalsky · « **Reply #5 on:** 23 Jul 2005, 12:59 am »

Quote from: Florian

PS: I can get you a DIVA from italy if ya want

Okay, I'll take the bait. How much? And how much for the real Grands that I hear are in Italy too ?

Flo, I wouldn't bother with the Apogee DAX or DAX3. They were great crossovers in their day, but technology has left them behind. Depending on budget, consider a Marchand, Bryston, Audio Research, Krell, or Accuphase. Even better, a DEQX or TacT multi-amp setup

Once thing you've probably already noticed, the Divas are a piece of cake to drive compared to the Scintillas. Any amp that doubles down into 4 ohms should handle them fine. Their impedance curve is amazingly flat, varying from 3-5 ohms. Powerful tube amps will work too -- I had Sonic Frontiers Power3 for a while and they were spectacular on the Divas.

Enjoy

Florian · « **Reply #6 on:** 23 Jul 2005, 01:03 am »

Well the DIVA in original condition for 4200EUR + shipping and stuff. Completely rebuild like mine for aprox 9000 EUR + shipping. The GRAND will set you back 47K plus a airplane to move them 250KG for the SUB alone !!!

-Flo

PS: My friend heard the GRAND and said it was "DIFFERENT" LOL

wshuff · « **Reply #7 on:** 23 Jul 2005, 01:58 am »

When you say the Grand, is that the Apogee Studio Grand? I have a friend that has a pair of the Studio Grands. The first time I heard them they were pretty impressive. Certainly it was the most expensive setup I'd ever heard. The next time I heard them I think one of the ribbons had been abused a bit. But my friend is nearing 80 and he obviously didn't hear what I heard, so I wasn't going to tell him, especially since it was my understanding that Apogee was out of business.

But maybe not?

So where do the Studio Grands fall in comparison to the Divas and Scintillas?

ekovalsky · « **Reply #8 on:** 23 Jul 2005, 02:15 am »

Here is a picture of the real Grands in a room, so you can have a point of reference. The "little" amps between the speakers are actually the monstrous dual-chassis Krell Audio Standards. Each speaker is 88"H x 32"W x 39"D and 650lbs. They are BIG, but like the Von Schweikert VR-11 and Wilson X-2 they are a single piece per side full range system, unlike the flagships from Martin Logan, Infinity, Genesis, Nola, etc. which use separate main and subwoofer towers.

Here is a picture of the Studio Grands and Mini Grands side by side

The Studio Grand is 73"H x 28"W x 25"D and 180 lbs per side. The Mini Grand is 50" x 20" x 20". The top of the Mini Grand is the Stage. The depth of the Grand Series is from the subwoofer bases, the planars top sections are only about 3" deep. The planar portion of each fo these is a two way design, rather than the three way design used in the Diva, Scintilla, Grand, and the initial Full Range model.

For comparison, the Diva is 74"H x 32"W x 3"D and weighs about 150lbs each. Although a simplification, you can consider the Grand a Diva sitting atop subwoofer bases, with dual 12" drivers powered by a built in Krell amp. Strangely there was also a built-in Krell amp for the tweeters. The owner provided an amp for the midrange ribbon and planar bass panel.

The Scintilla is about the same width as the Diva but only about 58"H, yet it is heavier at about 180lbs each. I've moved or helped move several Divas and Scintillas, the Scintillas are very dense!

The Divas have been reincarnated as the "Definitive" by Perigee, an Australian company. Graz (the owner) has physically separated the bass section from the mid/treble section, and each fits into an extremely heavy base. This is very similar to the design of the Martin Logan Statement E2 mains. Unlike the original Apogees, which had sensitivities in the low-mid 80dB/w range, the Definitives are about 100dB per 1W! If the Definitves were priced less than a Mercedes-Benz SL55AMG I may have flown to Australia to audition and buy a pair ...

Florian · « **Reply #9 on:** 23 Jul 2005, 07:40 pm »

The DIVA is the newest and most expensive Fullrange system they made actually. It was a second edition of the Fullrange

Personally i think that its on paar with the FR and the GRAND will beat it in sheer volume and bass power, but i think thats about it.

The Definitve will need to prove itsself, but my 2 friends who have heard it said that it was the best they ever heard.

-Flo

ekovalsky · « **Reply #10 on:** 23 Jul 2005, 08:01 pm »

Quote from: Florian

The DIVA is the newest and most expensive Fullrange system they made actually. It was a second edition of the Fullrange

Correct. It was designed to approach the performance of the Scintilla and Fullrange while presenting a reasonable load to the amplifier(s). It was also the last three way planar Apogee made.

Quote

The Definitve will need to prove itsself, but my 2 friends who have heard it said that it was the best they ever heard.

-Flo

Obviously I haven't heard the Definitive, but it very well may be the best available. I know the Diva is right up there, and according to Graz the Definitive is way beyond the Diva. All it takes to own it is $108k USD plus freight charges from Down Under for about 1500 lbs.

Florian · « **Reply #11 on:** 23 Jul 2005, 08:56 pm »

Yeah well GRAZ has to say that since he sells them. But its not easy to beat the DIVA and the Fullrange plus Scintilla. We will have to wait and see what it really sounds like. My other buddy heard his small FK1 which Graz says they are better than the Scintilla, and my friend found that holarious

-Flo

PS: I am sure the Definitiv is damn good and most likely is the best, but the question is by what margin and the price is simply insane,

sonicboom · « **Reply #12 on:** 24 Jul 2005, 08:21 pm »

Flo,

I know it's a silly question, but how do the Divas compare to the MG 3.6R? Congrads on a very fine speaker.

Florian · « **Reply #13 on:** 24 Jul 2005, 10:59 pm »

Well its definetly a fair question since Magnepan is the only alternative. First let me start by saying that i have owned two 3.6's and a 1.6 and still have my .5 Maggie so i definetly have grown attached to them. The Maggie can throw a very mild and friendly yet precise soundstage that is addictive. It is very very hard to find a speaker more sonically pleasing than the 3.6 and 20.1 if setup right. The DIVA on the other hand is in a different leauge when setup right. To me its the end of the line as far as speakers go. I have to add that i have a DIVA with new ribons which are technically better than the factory ones and i have not heard a stock DIVA yet. The DIVA has no character at all, it transports the signal it is given. Directly compared to the Magnepan MG20.1 the DIVA is faster in all areas, and i am lighting quick. The bass is extremely powerfull and well extended yet controlled and not fat. The purity of the sound and the perfect integration of drivers is just mind boggling. The speaker is physically very large and has a larger surface area than the 20.1 but is even more transparent than the Maggie. Its very hard to describe but maybe when our friend Bruno_B returns from his germany visit he can describe it a bit more. He said it was the best system he has ever heard and i am glad to hear such compliments. Also the soundstage depth and sense of space is unparralled. There is a enourmas depth, layering and natural space that is amazing and you can clearly hear scipt pages being turned, the inhaling of air before playing an instrument and the initial strike of the drumstick before the bass rolls of the instrument. In other words i have found my dream speaker. The DIVA is on the other hand not for everyone. She is very large and does require very good equipment. I dont think that the new age digital amps will sound great on these, since they reveal ALL equipment in a very unforgiving way. They do like space around them and they want to be treatet as DIVA's with respect, care and luxury. But once all the critiria is met the sound that you will experience will not be forgotten and sets a old and new benchmark of what is possible from a loudspeaker.

-Flo

PS: And doesn't she just look glorious, the majestic yet elegant form?

PPS: Here is a personal touch

arrakian · « **Reply #14 on:** 25 Jul 2005, 12:56 am »

Florian,

How does the Pathos sound? I've never really liked hybrid amps, but have recently heard some combo's well matched, and sounding great.

Florian · « **Reply #15 on:** 25 Jul 2005, 12:59 am »

The Pathos is really a exeptional unit which is manufactured in Italy. The first revision sounds more organic than the second edition. I dont like Hybrid speakers, but it (hybrid designs) works great on the Pathos AMPs

Sounds very tube like but with a nice solid grip and bass foundation. Also it is exeptionally well build with a nice wooden remote and is quite affordable for around 2400$ new. (2000EUR)

-Flo

PS: You are welome to stop by and have a listen.

arrakian · « **Reply #16 on:** 25 Jul 2005, 02:09 am »

That'd require a vacation

Florian · « **Reply #17 on:** 26 Jul 2005, 11:29 am »

Quote from: arrakian

That'd require a vacation

Well hop on a plane and exit where it says "Land of the Beer"

arrakian · « **Reply #18 on:** 27 Jul 2005, 01:18 am »

Florian,
You must REALLY be proud of your system; I'm jealous

BrunoB · « **Reply #19 on:** 2 Aug 2005, 07:49 pm »

Quote from: Florian

Quote from: arrakian
That'd require a vacation

Well hop on a plane and exit where it says "Land of the Beer"

There is another land of beer ...

BTW, I visited Florian last week and here are some pictures:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=gallery;area=browse;album=610

More later ...

Bruno