Gravity Well Of A DarkStar

Dmason · « **Reply #460 on:** 16 Aug 2005, 01:48 pm »

You will love what you hear, the implementation is outrageously good with well recorded live albums, high ticket film soundtracks, ambient, stuff with alot of environmental cues, but merely jaw dropping on everything else.

I hope to get to Denver, yes, but it depends on work scheduling, weather, coastal bathymetry, and local shoaling conditions, where I live.

Besides, shifting gears from sea level to Denver in the fall had an effect on my system that was about as subtle as a train wreck

If I do go, I hope to finally meet you, and all the otherz. I recommend to anyone going to RMAF to really listen to the Bastanis, many are finding dipole systems their ear's calling. And a reminder that Louis and I are coming up with a finalized DarkStar design, which is guaranteed to exceed.

mcgsxr · « **Reply #461 on:** 3 Oct 2005, 02:08 pm »

Had a good friend come over yesterday, a guy who asks me audio questions at work quite a bit. I helped him pick out a Panasonic HTIB early in the summer - we went and listened to a host of things at a local A/V store, and that pricing and sound struck him as the best option for his family room.

He is not a big audio guy, just someone who wanted a starter system for his family etc.

He sat down and heard the JVC EX-A1, running through my new Felicia balanced power conditioner) and the OB Visatons.

"I cannot believe how clear and lifelike that is" is the statement that came out over and over again.

It is such fun to share stuff like this with people, and always makes me smile to see someone experience really good sound - even better to know that it is something that most folks can afford too!

Thanks again Dmason, you have touched more ears than you know!

gilbodavid · « **Reply #462 on:** 3 Jan 2006, 03:16 pm »

Hello all. what happened to this thread. Just read the whole wonderful thing, and 20 people were about to order, and the whole thread grinded to a halt. is it continuing elsewhere. If anyone has expereience of Quad esl57's that have been repanneled ( I use these, and have not found better) and the OB Visitron B200's, would you et me know how they compared for you. Thanks

corloc · « **Reply #463 on:** 10 Jan 2006, 08:32 pm »

Wow, I just finished too. Mybe the darkstar turned into a blackhole, and stucked them all into audio Narvana. Too bad the tread was really moving along.

mcgsxr · « **Reply #464 on:** 10 Jan 2006, 09:12 pm »

Well, I am not sure what happened to the other folks - I moved, and we had our second daughter only 7 weeks ago, so I barely have time to listen much, let alone experiment with new baffles or anything!

I like the b200's, but in my case, with my musical prefs and ears, in my system, it is critical to match the amp, or bass is just unacceptable - I have tried matching in a sub, but the big ported sub I built for HT, is well, just that - good for HT...

Perhaps in time I will be able to build some stereo subs, for music, and I bet that would really get the job done...

-Richard- · « **Reply #465 on:** 10 Jan 2006, 09:27 pm »

I am actively working with Roger Modjeski on designing a "subwoofer" for the
B200's in OB...and to that end we have begun to measure the B200's
frequency curves...please see my thread A TRUE REVOLUTION IN
S.E.T TUBE DESIGN...page 9 shows our first foray into
measuring the B200 in my OB application...

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=23867&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=80

This investigation should develop interesting insights into subwoofer design
parameters...

Warm Regards -Richard-

corloc · « **Reply #466 on:** 11 Jan 2006, 12:34 am »

Mark,

Congrats!! Just had my second daughter about a year ago. If I remember right you were listening in the basement and had some wicked bass nulls? I was just going thorugh my Parts express cataloge, and Dayton makes some 12" IB subs, I think $119 es, QTS of .69. I wonder if a couple of thoughs in dipole would work for you.

I got cought in the OB web breaking in some Tang Band W4-1320's. With a QTS of .37 shouldn't produce much bass, but they did a good job and the rest of the sound was great. They are now in TomZ's Pawo cabs.

Needless to say I couldn't froget the sound of OB. I got soem extra cash from Santa this year so I have bought some B200's. They shipped today. I found the Darkstar Thread after I purchased them, and now I can't wait to hear them.

Anyway thank you all for the thread, and I hope I will have something to contribute.

Chris Hess

nodiak · « **Reply #467 on:** 13 Jan 2006, 06:44 am »

Hi all, I'm pretty seasonal about listening to music the last couple of years, haven't turned on my system for months. I expected the usual winter indulgement but hasn't happened yet. Have a pair of B200's for ob, and plans for an MTL cabinet for 12"sub driver. When I get them built I'll report in. Also have a Teac to send in to Vinnie to mod. I check in here every so often and will be interested in any other reports. Take care, Don

-Richard- · « **Reply #468 on:** 13 Jan 2006, 05:35 pm »

It may be of interest to note that there is new thread started on the
2 channel audio forum that is addressing the B200 topic...

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=24588&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

jkelly...B200 Open Baffle Dimensions...

Warm Regards -Richard-

corloc · « **Reply #469 on:** 13 Jan 2006, 10:05 pm »

Thanks, that is helpfull.

I'm a little more limited in size and configuration. The OB's are going to be reborn out of the carcasses of my fe206e mltl's.

JLM · « **Reply #470 on:** 14 Jan 2006, 12:15 am »

No! Don't destroy a MLTL!!

Bob Brines does FE206E based floorstanding MLTLs. Haven't heard them, but I love te floorstanding MLTLs he did for me with Fostex F200A drivers.

Open Baffles can be too cheap and easy to build to rip perfectly good MLTLs apart (if they're perfectly good).

corloc · « **Reply #471 on:** 14 Jan 2006, 05:42 am »

MLTL is now broken down. To be reused probubly for some thing other than the OB.

I fell in love with the Fe206e, and it lasted for about a year. I could never get used to her high freq. chatering, but her mids and detail always kept me coming back.

I started useing a Tang Band W4-1320. Not a detailed, but fuller in texture. I tryed the fe206e again, and now it practicly burns my ears off high freq. She might go into horns later on in life.

corloc · « **Reply #472 on:** 21 Jan 2006, 02:15 am »

the b200 have been running for 15 hours or so now. I have to say they are incredible. I have them in a OB center 11" to side wing at 60 deg. of 9" and 7". They so far sound the best almost backed up against the wall.

-Richard- · « **Reply #473 on:** 21 Jan 2006, 02:42 am »

Hi Corloc,

Congratulations!!!!!!!!!!

You are beginning to get the OB magic into your life...let the B200's burn in for
at least 200 hours...stiff spider...the sound becomes startling open...spatial...
like giant horn speakers...just wait!!!!!!

...you have no idea how many people have read this thread and thought 'how
can this is OB thing really be as good as they say it is (?)' and
never go on to try it...

Your adventurousness is now paying off with the paradigm shifting excitement
of the B200 in OB...great going!!!!!!!!

It sounds like you are using wings...can you be a bit more specific in your
description of what your OB baffles are like? Also what amplification are you
using?

I have purchased Hawthorne Audio's Silver Iris 15 inch OB coaxial drivers from
Darrel...and as soon as I have them up and running for a while (they should
arrive by the end of next week perhaps) I will report what I am hearing...and
contrast them with the B200's...

http://hawthorneaudio.com/index.html

Give them time to burn-in and then...well...you will see for yourself!!!!

Warm Regards -Richard-

corloc · « **Reply #474 on:** 22 Jan 2006, 01:48 am »

Amp: 10W EL84 PP in ultralinier. (Simple EL84 DIY Paradice)

OB: Main section 11" wide, wings both at 60 deg. 9" and 7"
Driver about 24" from floor, with about a ten deg. tilt.
Height 48"

Room: 14' x 24' open into foyer and kitchen at opposite ends.
speakers are in corner. faceing into the room. Post pitcure later.

I have about 15hrs. on the driver and already have notice a big shift in bass and smoothness. I figured it would take about 100hrs to break in. 200hrs is doable. At least it isn't th 1000hrs of break in someone posted for the Fostex FE108Esigma

Ya, Hurdy_Grudyman at the fullrange forum post about the Silver Iris's a day or two after I recieved my B200's. Grrr.

O'well I really want to stay with the single driver thing anyway, but I hear coaxis sound very nice too.

Cant wait for the B200's to open up more.

-Richard- · « **Reply #475 on:** 22 Jan 2006, 02:14 am »

Hi Corloc,

We are educating ourselves by finding out what the potential is for OB to deeply
affect our audio lives...you did quite right to start with the B200's...

In the next few weeks I should have something to report about Darrel's new
Silver Iris 15 inch coaxial drivers (Hawthorne Audio)...

Meanwhile you are going to experience a paradigm shift of major proportions...

The modest money these drivers and simple baffles cost should allow us to feel
comfortable to try several driver solutions...

May I suggest you see it as a learning experience...and on the cheap...a work
in progress...each driver will have its own sonic characteristics which is wonderful...

Thanks for sharing the dimensions of your baffle with us...sounds most promising...

The use of felt has been suggested by Darrel as absorbing resonances that
find their way back to the front of the baffle reflected off room surfaces...
after careful experimentation he feels it works quite well...

That is an option I am looking to try very soon...

Please keep us informed...

Warm Regards -Richard-

-Richard- · « **Reply #476 on:** 22 Jan 2006, 02:41 am »

Hi Frank,

I inquired into the MiniSolos with Darrel...Darrel was incredibly honest and
helpful...he has followed a number of threads here on AC and he felt that
for those of us who have already experimented with the B200's in OB
it was not entirely necessary to purchase his complete speaker system...

He seems to be content to sell his drivers to us, so we can experiment with them
for ourselves...

So I purchased just the drivers...for those of us that do not have the where-with-all
to put together reasonably finished baffles, then you could not go wrong with
Darrel's incredibly cheap offerings...apparently Darrel is a master craftsman...
and his speakers should be of the highest order of good design and reliability...

But if you have some skills and access to power tools...or if you know someone
who can help you build these simple baffles that the Silver Iris 15 inch coaxial
drivers should go in...then you only need the drivers...

I will have more to report soon as to what they sound like...using baffles that are
not entirely different than Darrel's...

Please remember...we are essentially talking about cutting a hole in plywood board...

Sound to simple...ahhhhh...but wait until you hear what OB's sound like!!!!!

Warm Regards -Richard-

fabaudio · « **Reply #477 on:** 22 Jan 2006, 03:42 pm »

Quote from: -Richard-

Hi Frank,

I inquired into the MiniSolos with Darrel...Darrel was incredibly honest and
helpful...he has followed a number of threads here on AC and he felt that
for those of us who have already experimented with the B200's in OB
it was not entirely necessary to purchase his complete speaker system...

He seems to be content to sell his drivers to us, so we can experiment with them
for ourselves...

So I purchased just the drivers...for those of us that do not have the where-with-all
to put tog ...

Richard, I'm a little surprised that you or anyone else would choose to purchase only the drivers and not the finished product since Darrel went through the trials and tribulations-mistakes here and there to finally come up with what I would assume a well adjusted finished-end product. In the case of, say, using Lexan which is something that fascinates me I would then of course have to buy the drivers and deal with trial and error since Darrel has no experience with this material. But, then again maybe it's just me 'cause I have limited carpentry skills

-Richard- · « **Reply #478 on:** 22 Jan 2006, 07:39 pm »

Hi Fabaudio,,

Perhaps the way I wrote my post has left some confusion...sorry about that!

Darrel seems to feel that anyone who has already worked with OB designs...
meaning...cut a hole out in an appropriately sized plywood board of 3/4 inch thickness
and placed a driver like the B200's in position and found a reasonable way of keeping
the board at the angle that seemed to work well in your room...I have a moving "foot"
in the back of mine that allows me to adjust the angle for example...will find that his
Silver Iris 15 inch coaxial driver will work quite nicely with a similar treatment...

In other words...we have all been conditioned to believe that speaker cabinet design
is sufficiently difficult to be out of the reach for us less-than-sophisticated builders...

Open Baffle is different...

In the Open Baffle approach a very simple panel of plywood cut to the right size
is all you need to get started...yes of course one could use very fancy materials
in the construction if you wish...Vinnie Rossi used a plexiglass material for his
version for example...but for the initial period of experimentation it is not necessary...

This does seem anti-intuitive on first consideration...

It is not easy for the mind to bend around the simplicity of this idea...which is why
DMason got upset with naysayers in some of these threads...let's look at this thing
a bit closer shall we?

Open Baffle designs use the entire room as huge baffle and in essence YOU ARE
INSIDE THE BAFFLE...this is not entirely correct...but it is close to being correct...

Open Baffles actually interact with rooms with less problems than conventional
front firing baffles...and the back wave follows the front wave in a manner that
creates a sense of spatial-ness I have only heard on huge horn speakers...
very convincing and seductive...more than that...they render music with the same
energy as live performances...something to do with the way they "charge" the air
in the room and their characteristic "penetration" of sound waves...

Yes...there is a cancellation of some sonic information...especially the low
frequencies...40 Hz travels 25 feet for example...so Open Baffle designs...even
if they use OB dipole dedicated woofers...will never give you thunderous bass...
So what? I don't like thunderous bass...it does not sound like music to me...
and Deb recoils from it...

However what I heard at Roger Modjeski's house/lab (and from what DMason
has told me)...a simple boxed woofer that is well integrated with the Open Baffle
driver sounds incredible...I am speaking of Bach's organ works that could shake
the cells in ones brain to new levels of synaptic gyrations...

The Silver Iris should prove to be able to reproduce the lower frequencies
much more easily than the B200's which are not designed to go lower than
say 80 Hz (actually Roger and I measured the cut off at around 200 Hz)...

However JohninCR has designed a baffle...it looks like a half of a barrel but is 5 sided...
that he measured as reproducing frequencies down to 30 Hz for the Silver Iris...
rather astounding really!!!!! And all that I will ever need...

So, Fabaudio, it is a matter of getting involved and not allowing oneself to feel
unequipped to handle it...it really works!!! I designed my baffle but had a friend here
in Ojai who is a master cabinet maker actually "build" it for me...we are talking about
a very very modest cost here...

Can I help further?

Warm Regards -Richard-

RoadTripper · « **Reply #479 on:** 22 Jan 2006, 11:31 pm »

-Richard- and whoever else may know:

Will an OB design function well enough in a small room, ie an average bedroom? The Visaton was nearly in my possession but I was off-put by the ordering process via Europe. This new 15" driver you are referencing is interesting me. Rather than fight this audio addiction, I figure I might just give in to it again.