[ekovalsky]

My wife left to run some errands so I put on some music with DEEP bass and turned up the volume on the Alons.  I noticed that there was sound coming from behind me.  Turns out I have the disconnected RM/X in the rear corners and the woofers were moving like crazy from the pressure in the room!  Excursions were about as big as I ever saw them when directly driven  

Guess I've been cheating, having extra auxiliary bass radiators in the room without even realizing it  This weekend they're going back into the boxes and will be moved to the garage until ARAM is ready for them.

The TacT isn't recommended for anything less than a 4 ohm load and has a low damping factor.  So it is not a match for the Alon bass towers with their 2 ohm load, but in another week or so I should have a real subwoofer amp.  Probably a Crown K2 with a damping factor of 3000 (I assume into 8 ohms) and continuous 1250wpc into 2 ohms.  That should be interesting ...  there may be some seismic activity recorded in Scottsdale that day

[trekker]

I was wondering what that rumbling sound was!    This explains why the woofers in my VMPS Larger Sub moves when my system isn't even on.   Having just recently moved here from Calif I thought it was an earthquake or something  

Back to remodeling my house.

Arnold

[ctviggen]

Ok, I understand that your speakers are better than anything else ever made.  However, could you please stop posting this bs?  First, I will never be able to afford these speakers, so it's like reading a review of the latest Ferrari.  Second, this is becoming a peeing match between you and anyone else who likes VMPS.  I'm personally sick of it.  Seriously, this "my Ferrari is better than your Yugo" is beginning to get old.  So, your speakers are better than ours.  Having never heard the Alons, I state it anyway -- YOUR SPEAKERS ARE BETTER THAN OURS.    Now, please take this petty fight elsewhere.

[ekovalsky]

Ok, I understand that your speakers are better than anything else ever made.  However, could you please stop posting this bs?  First, I will never be able to afford these speakers, so it's like reading a review of the latest Ferrari.  Second, this is becoming a peeing match between you and anyone else who likes VMPS.  I'm personally sick of it.  Seriously, this "my Ferrari is better than your Yugo" is beginning to get old.  So, your speakers are better than ours.  Having never heard the Alons, I state it an ...

Sorry, obviously I touched a nerve. Having sold the VMPS I'll stop posting in this forum as I most likely won't have anything useful to contribute.

If it makes you feel any better, I still think very highly of the VMPS speakers.  No, they are not perfect but what loudspeakers are ?  Brian believes his speakers are far better than the Alons (and probably everything else out there) and who knows, maybe he is right.  As he and one other manufacturer were eager to criticize the design of my new speakers, I am happy to report that I believe my hard earned money was well spent ....  

PS -- take a valium

[Marbles]

I like to read about his speakers, but maybe his Alon posts should be in a different circle....

Anyway, I will never own the Alon's either...doesn't mean I don't want to know about them...it's like porn...I like to look even though I won't be screwing any of those skanks........

[Marbles]

Eric, you beat me by a minute...I hates when that happens  

[audiochef]

Yeah ,  what a wanker you've turned out to be! Personally ,I don't envy you one bit .

[mcrespo71]

Yeah ,  what a wanker you've turned out to be! Personally ,I don't envy you one bit .

Why?  Because he switched speakers?  

[F-100]

I like to read about his speakers, but maybe his Alon posts should be in a different circle....

Good idea Marbles.
Hey Eric, keep us update on the Alon. Eventhough I can't afford them, I do enjoy reading your post.    

[John Casler]

My wife left to run some errands so I put on some music with DEEP bass and turned up the volume on the Alons.  I noticed that there was sound coming from behind me.  Turns out I have the disconnected RM/X in the rear corners and the woofers were moving like crazy from the pressure in the room!  Excursions were about as big as I ever saw them when directly driven  

Guess I've been cheating, having extra auxiliary bass radiators in the room without even realizing it  This weekend they're going ...

Hi Eric,

Sounds like you're having fun.  Actually, while I don't think you are "cheating" you might find that having a "passive/reactive" system in each corner will "help" your bass.  

Using the RM/x for such a purpose might be a "little overkill" however.

I would face them "into" the corner and have at least 4-6" clearance.  The bass energy will then be directed into the corner, and rebound out into the RM/x.

This will cause the RM/x to block the compressed bass energy.  It will also "deflect" a good portion to another path other than diagonally expanding back into the Alon bass towers.

This should "theoretically" have a small affect in the interactive nodes of the Alons at the listener seat.

Additionally, the passive action of the RM/x woofer system will:

1) absorb/reduce some of that energy, and
2) the energy that is not absorbed and is passively "re-released" back via the front and side firing woofers will both diffuse/disperse that energy a bit.

All of these would add up to a positive affect (however probably rather small compared to more affordable bass traps)

Also it might not be unusual to see large excursions from an non-energized driver, since the energy of the voice coil "controls" its excursion to the frequency being produced, and it is not a reaction from the "largest" wave pressure, as in a mechanical activation vs and electrical activation.

I forget what your room looks like, but if there are any doors in the rear. opening them can also reduce the effect of reflected wave off the rear wall.

[ekovalsky]

Yeah,  what a wanker you've turned out to be! Personally ,I don't envy you one bit .

Glad to hear that, chef.  

So I buy new speakers,
They cost me the bank...
But they don't need tweakers
And now I'm a wank !

[shokunin]

Seriously, everyone needs to calm down.  I'm glad for Eric and his Alons, I think they look great in his room.  I can only dream of a dedicated room like his and the ability to build it out even further.  VMPS or no VMPS, we're a community here...

Every successful desinger is usually down right opinionated and stubborn about their products.  I call that Passion, and that's why they are successful and have been around for many years.  Sometime they are quick to criticize or throw something off as a fad.  In some cases, they're right and other times there not.  But if they had followed every "fad" they'd be out of business pretty quickly.

However, as consumer, there's a lot to choose from.  I own some RM/x's but that doesn't mean that I can't lust for other speakers or listen or even prefer other speakers to RM/x's...   I'm perfectly happy with my speakers and have no desire to upgrade.

I like Marble's analogy, Audio Porn, nice too look at and lust over, but at the end of the day, we get to come back home and listen to our systems w/ or w/o the porn on.

[shokunin]

Yeah ,  what a wanker you've turned out to be! Personally ,I don't envy you one bit .

IMO, That's totally uncalled for   .

[ekovalsky]

Hi Eric,

Sounds like you're having fun.  Actually, while I don't think you are "cheating" you might find that having a "passive/reactive" system in each corner will "help" your bass.  

Using the RM/x for such a purpose might be a "little overkill" however.

I would face them "into" the corner and have at least 4-6" clearance.  The bass energy will then be directed into the corner, and rebound out into the RM/x.

This will cause the RM/x to block the compressed bass energy.  It will also "deflect"  ...

Is this the patented John Casler "Ultimate Bass Trap" tweak  

Thanks for the input.  I'll try turning them around and see if I can tell a difference.

It would be interesting to compare the Alon bass to the quad VMPS larger setup you have.   Next time I make it to LA I need to block out time for an audition!

If you are in the mood to have some fun, it may be worth trying your four Largers as a "double bass array".  Two subs on the front wall, two on the rear wall (mirror imaged) with the rear subs run out of phase and delayed by the time it takes sound to move from the front to the rear.  In theory, and from a few reports in practice also, this cancels the bass wave at the rear wall -- behind the listening position -- before it can reflect off and head back into the room to cause cancellation or reinforcement nodes.  Think of it as a dynamic bass trap covering the whole wall.  There are some articles about this on the net but they are in Deutsche, so a translator is needed.  If anyone that has the necessary four subs wants to try it, I can post the links.

[John Casler]

Is this the patented John Casler "Ultimate Bass Trap" tweak  

Thanks for the input.  I'll try turning them around and see if I can tell a difference.

It would be interesting to compare the Alon bass to the quad VMPS larger setup you have.   Next time I make it to LA I need to block out time for an audition!

If you are in the mood to have some fun, it may be worth trying your four Largers as a "double bass array".  Two subs on the front wall, two on the rear wall (mirror imaged) with the rear  ...

I doubt that turning them around will make a "world" of difference, but my mind is always looking for the "n'th" degree of maximum potential.

My QUAD LARGER set up is always here for you to hear, however I don't use it for "beat you over the head and body" bass that most think, but for more accurate and realistic bass.

I already do have the subs in a rather loose "mirror image" (read my posts from a while back) and I have them out of phase with the fronts.

What I don't have (currently) is the ability to adjust or "fine tune" that phase to adjust for the distance between the front and back subs.

This will be even better in a week or two, when the RM30's arrive, since placement will be almost "exactly" a mirror image at that time.

Bass is a very strange animal, and is many times "hostile" to its environment, meaning it takes a lot of work to get it right.

You might even find that summing the lower bass and running it mono, in a push/pull might be fun and games too!

Or better yet, stack four LARGERs in the rear and suck your fillings out in the sweet spot during the cannon blasts on the Telarc 1812 Overature

[ARAM]

Ohh   Eric
  I  just  read  your  post..I  have  panicked  so  much..   Are  you  using  my  RM/X  as  rear  channels  or  something  like  that??   Man   don't  do  that..I  can  never  afford  them  again..
  By  the  way  I  like  Eric  posting  whatever  he  likes..it  is  nice  to  see  people's  feelings  or  experiences..there  is  nothing  wrong  with  that..
  Eric  please  take  care  of  my  speakers..Even  if  you  ask  to  buy  them  back  for  40%    less  than  the  MSRP,(which  is  around   10 000 $ )  I  won't  sell  them  back..  
   You  are  a  radiologist  aren't   you??Please   take  an  x-ray  of  my  RM/X   to  make  sure  they  are  ok..make  sure  they  don't  catch  cold..

[zybar]

Ok, I understand that your speakers are better than anything else ever made.  However, could you please stop posting this bs?  First, I will never be able to afford these speakers, so it's like reading a review of the latest Ferrari.  Second, this is becoming a peeing match between you and anyone else who likes VMPS.  I'm personally sick of it.  Seriously, this "my Ferrari is better than your Yugo" is beginning to get old.  So, your speakers are better than ours.  Having never heard the Alons, I state it an ...

Bob,

Who put the bee in your bonnet?

Seriously, I don't think Eric is bragging and he certainly didn't deserve the attitude.

Let's try and treat each other a little nicer than that.

George

[John Casler]

It is good to see people "passionate" about their hobby.  It is good to see people enjoying VMPS and other speakers.

Hey, it is only audio.

Just remember, while a system, speaker, car or house can certainly satisfy your listening preferences, or enjoyment of its use, it may not satisfy everyones.

I can sit in front of my system and honestly say, I have never in my life heard a system sound so good (according to my preferences).

That should not raise the cockles of anyone.

I hear other peoples systems all the time, and they might sound beautiful, magical, majestic, highly resolving, detailed, and delicate.

BUT... they don't sound as good as my system to me!!

Eric, should love his system, and while he sometimes does make a little back handed remark, I know he has liked most if not all the systems he has had in the past.

Would I chose his system over even what I have right now?

No, since it wouldn't meet my prefernces.  Mine will do things that some other systems will not do, but that is what this hobby is all about.

It isn't about having something that everyone agrees is better than everyone elses...It is about having what you like in relation to how much you can afford.

There is no "BEST" sound.  There is no "ultimate system", except that one that "blows YOUR hair back" or floats your boat.

We need to appreciate the sytems, equipment and preferences of others, and not feel threatened by them.  And maybe be a little more thoughtful in how we all state things.

I should also mention that B, and all the people with VMPS appreciate your loyaty, but demonstrating it by describing your listening pleasures is preferable to detracting from the pleasures of others.

And let me assure you, there are plenty of times when I read something and think of how deaf that person must be, but seldom would I post those thoughts.  

More than likely I would possibly question the experience if it added to the discussion, and might even politley disagree, but only you can hear through your ears and interpret through your brain.  Even the same room, ears, and cut, can offer wildly different results.

I know, I've heard them

[ekovalsky]

Ohh   Eric
  I  just  read  your  post..I  have  panicked  so  much..   Are  you  using  my  RM/X  as  rear  channels  or  something  like  that??   Man   don't  do  that..I  can  never  afford  them  again..
  By  the  way  I  like  Eric  posting  whatever  he  likes..it  is  nice  to  see  people's  feelings  or  experiences..there  is  nothing  wrong  with  that..
  Eric  please  take  care  of  my  speakers..Even  if  you  ask  to  buy  them  back  for  40%    less  than  the  M ...

Aram, they are in the rear corner but not even hooked up!  Just think of it as continued woofer surround break-in  

They'll be moved out of the room this weekend and re-crated.  I expect it to take several hours.  I am a radiologist, I assure you they are in the best of health !

[CornellAlum]

Does anyone else not find it remotely cool that Eric compares VMPS to speakers costing that much anyway!  I say, share away!!!