[wushuliu]

Yes, another clone thread . Came across a couple YTube reviews recently about the Transound D5 Pro, a Chinese amp based on but not identical to the $18,000 DartZeel NHB-108 released in ~2004. Both reviews are from overseas where perhaps it has a larger following or less angst about Chi-fi products. Both reviewers were suprised and taken aback by the performance. So I took a chance and ordered one.

Let's get some stuff out of the way first: The NHB-108 is for all intent and purposes 'vintage' at this point and the schematic has been publicly available for years. So money isn't being taken out of anyone's pockets. Even more fascinating the amp started out as a DIY project that was documented by the designer in Stereophile before it ever went retail (I'll add a link if I remember). A lot of Chinese audio gear are now being made by real audio enthusiasts who are putting real effort not just trying to make a buck, let's not paint them all with one brush. Disclaimer over.

The Transound D5 clocked in around $666(!) dollars shipped to the U.S. from AliExpress. I stupidly forgot to include a coupon for $80 off that was right there in front of my face so you can get it cheaper. November 11th is apparently a mega sale date for AliExpress for those who celebrate. Arrived in 2 weeks, well padded. Took it out. Pleasantly surprised as we say in this hobby.

The build quality is stellar for the price or maybe any price under $$$. Gone are the days of Chinese amps made with thin flimsy metal or just plain jane aluminum. This thing is *heavy* at 30ish pounds. The fins are thick and rigid. The cover is thick and unbendable (and a bear to remove). Admittedly I don't have experience with mega buck amps but as far as the stereotype goes the D5 Pro feels like it should be double if not triple the price+.

As far as external features thankfully they kept it simple: Power button, RCA inputs, Binding posts. That's it. Internally, gain is ~25DB. Soft start. At least 4 to 8ohm. I'm pushing 3 ohm speakers with it no problem. 800W Transformer. 120,000uf PS Capacitors. One of the YT reviewers bench tested his amp and it met exactly as specced (by Transound not the original NHB-108): ~150W 8ohms, 200w 4 ohms (or thereabouts too lazy to double check).

Yeah yeah howz it sound: With only a few hours on it, pretty frickin' great. Caveat 1: I listened to it stock for a bit, loved what I heard, then opened it and started tinkering. I have toned down on the tinkering these days though and just did some basic 'upgrades'. Anyway, stock: Stock the D5 Pro with just a few hours on it warm and smooth with a Class-A like sound that reminds me of tube amps. Its standout feature so far is a holographic presentation and surprisingly snappy dynamics. Excellent low level detail. Great control of my ~87db MTMs.

Not stock: The binding posts are the super cheap 'gold plated' trash that's super popular right now. I personally think they are worse quality than the generic posts you'd find on a $300 Yamaha receiver but such are the times. I replaced them w/ KLE copper posts which I intended to buy anyway and I replaced the internal speaker wire w/ some 16awg UPOCC wire I had on hand. RCA inputs are inexpensive but high quality AECO copper from Korea. RCA wiring VHAudio Airlok 24/26awg(?) I had on hand. $120 for the posts I felt was justifiable on the stock amp, that's how much I like it. HOWEVER, as I said this amp is very well built.

The cover is tightly placed and needs a little effort to remove. All wiring inside is very neatly arranged and access to certain areas required dismantling more than I thought. I expended more time than I thought and left the amp a little less neat than I found it. Replacing the binding posts is fairly easy, the RCA wiring not so much. The Youtube reviewers do a great job showing the internals if interested.

With these simple 'upgrades' done the sound took a bit of a 180. The slight upper end rolloff and warmth has given way to upper end clarity and extension in highs. Not that they were lacking before just now it's a bit more 'modern' or 'hifi'. Not sure which change had the most effect though if I were to guess it's the internal speaker wire. More likely it's all of them combined.

Comparisons: Since I'm in the middle of rebuilding my 2-channel set up I have a bunch of 'cheap and cheerful' amps on hand. Yamaha AS-301? Nice backup unit for $350, doesn't come close. DIY TPA3255 Class D amp? Very nice, has a hint of the smoothness but doesn't deliver on the holographic without a tube pre and lacks the grip of the D5. $1300 Topping B200 Monos? Mmmm. Really nice amps y'all. Like really good. Shocking for a Topping. Smooth, clean and clear. They're on to something. No 3-D pop though, if anything a little too laid back. Neurochrome Modulus-86 (~$700 - $2500)? Lest I invoke the wrath of the measurementophiles I'll just say - terrific amp (really), but I prefer the D5 Pro. The Mod-86 isn't far behind though, it's just not as engaging.

Apparently a lot more time is needed for the amp to settle in so I'll see what happens over the coming weeks. But as of right now for <$700 the D5 Pro is *excellent*.

Lastly, the D5 Pro is as far as I can tell a 'compromised' NHB-108. It uses a few more transistors and  ironically the D5 Pro has a bunch of safety features the original doesn't have. The original doesn't have all the fuses and relays and uses an expensive circuit instead for shutdowns. Because of this the original also has a strict protocol for powering on and off and speaker connections and individual tuning of the transistors for optimal performance. It's a powerful but delicate little flower. That said, a more faithful replica is also available - but at much higher costs from $2k-4k depending. That's more than I'm willing to spend on AliExpress/Ebay but others have and said it stomps the D5 variants.

I'm content with this bargain as is.

Youtube Bench test here (Long, German, select English CC for subtitles)
https://youtu.be/Od4e51LmIwk?si=OUSHFaMzdGw2GFvZ

Youtube review (shorter)
https://youtu.be/6pcKmWrwWhg?si=_nXIguhd_Q8UkQYV

Original Stereophile DIY article here:
https://www.stereophile.com/writer/194

AliExpress link here (has most reviews): Select D5Pro pic, not the regular D5
https://tinyurl.com/Transound-D5Pro

[mresseguie]

Thanks for the write up. It's been ages since I surfed audio gear on AliExpress <I'm in new grandpa mode.>, so I haven't paid attention to what's available.

I clicked on the last link you provided <to AliExpress> and discovered three things: The price is listed as $356.44 for one unit now. If someone were to buy two units, one could save an additional 9%. That's $324.36 each!  That's insanely cheap. Lastly, shipping is listed as $145.63. I'm guessing your $399 price doesn't include shipping, yes?

I got to hear a DArtzeel amp several years ago in Taipei powering a big pair of Lawrence Audio speakers. The speakers sounded wonderful with a wide 3D soundstage. Lawrence offered to sell me the speakers at full price (something like $30k USD!) and he'd include the amp free of charge. I declined his offer without mentioning how insanely expensive his speakers were.

Now I get to spend the morning perusing AliExpress audio gear and trying to not salivate too much.

[Jon L]

Youtube review (shorter)
https://youtu.be/6pcKmWrwWhg?si=_nXIguhd_Q8UkQYV

I follow that Youtube channel and have been waiting for him to finally compare the multiple clones, as he has said positive things about clones for Dartzeel, Burmester, Accuphase, etc.  I do worry about amps with multiples of those (clone?) relays, as I have read reports of those relays failing over time. 

How do you find the Topping B200 vs Modulus 86, apart from the obvious difference in power rating?  I did find Modulus 86 quite neutral, but after inserting a Pass DIY (upgraded) Korg Nutube preamp, the involvement factor came back in spades..

[wushuliu]

Thanks for the write up. It's been ages since I surfed audio gear on AliExpress <I'm in new grandpa mode.>, so I haven't paid attention to what's available.

I clicked on the last link you provided <to AliExpress> and discovered three things: The price is listed as $356.44 for one unit now. If someone were to buy two units, one could save an additional 9%. That's $324.36 each!  That's insanely cheap. Lastly, shipping is listed as $145.63. I'm guessing your $399 price doesn't include shipping, yes?

I got to hear a DArtzeel amp several years ago in Taipei powering a big pair of Lawrence Audio speakers. The speakers sounded wonderful with a wide 3D soundstage. Lawrence offered to sell me the speakers at full price (something like $30k USD!) and he'd include the amp free of charge. I declined his offer without mentioning how insanely expensive his speakers were.

Now I get to spend the morning perusing AliExpress audio gear and trying to not salivate too much.

The $356 is for the regular D5, the D5 Pro is $465. You have to click on the thumbnail pics on AliExpress to change the models. There really is some cool looking gear on AE these days.

[wushuliu]

I follow that Youtube channel and have been waiting for him to finally compare the multiple clones, as he has said positive things about clones for Dartzeel, Burmester, Accuphase, etc.  I do worry about amps with multiples of those (clone?) relays, as I have read reports of those relays failing over time. 

How do you find the Topping B200 vs Modulus 86, apart from the obvious difference in power rating?  I did find Modulus 86 quite neutral, but after inserting a Pass DIY (upgraded) Korg Nutube preamp, the involvement factor came back in spades..

Yes, I've seen mention of relay issues with Chinese amps here and there. Thankfully those should be replaceable without too much fuss if something happens IIRC.

B200 vs MOD-86 is a tough call as to me they have different signatures. The B200 is more laid back, mids somewhat recessed. Very pleasant, smooth, clean, relaxed presentation. Mod-86 is punchy, more forward and IMO a little lean in the bass. Both have dark background and clear imaging of low noise amps, with MOD edging out the Topping. I could see how a tubeish pre would complement the MOD. I do have some Burson V7 Classic opamps on hand to swap in to the MOD-86. Tom (of Neurochrome) said the v3.0 allows for experimentation and is "fair game" for the U2 opamp changes.

Great time to be an audiophile with a modest budget.

[Jon L]

Mod-86 is punchy, more forward and IMO a little lean in the bass.

Yeah, then B200 won't work for me, as I constantly try to get non-SET amps to have that forward and present female vocals of my 300B and 2A3 SET's. 
The greatest surprise of Korg Nutube preamp was how the bass did NOT suffer from a bit too much bloom and loss of iron-fist definition of many traditional tube preamps.  The combo's bass is killer 

[wushuliu]

Yeah, then B200 won't work for me, as I constantly try to get non-SET amps to have that forward and present female vocals of my 300B and 2A3 SET's. 
The greatest surprise of Korg Nutube preamp was how the bass did NOT suffer from a bit too much bloom and loss of iron-fist definition of many traditional tube preamps.  The combo's bass is killer 

Cool. The Nutube B1 is on my list, just need to decide if I can add a remote or live without one. These knees aren't getting any younger!

[Padizo]

I just came across this product and I'm very intrigued. I have been underwhelmed by my recent fezz titania (tube amp) which costs a lot more.

I wonder if this is going to have a better bass response, as I listen mostly rock and metal, and the fezz feels like lacking quite a bit.

Also I am very intrigued by other chinese products like the denafrips ares 15th.

Would you recommend any other products as stellar as this one? By that I mean, delivering much higher than it's price point?

Maybe a chinese pre amp? Speaker?

[alexbpm]

Just a warning to other forum members, I too purchased this amp from the link the OP provided, the AliExpress store called FunKenya HiFi Store.  The seller sent me an invoice outside of Aliexpress and I paid it.  The amp did arrive, but after 300 hours of burn in I found it veiled, muddy, with rolled off highs.  The seller agreed to refund me if I shipped it back.  After already spending over $500 on the amp, it then cost me $250 to ship it back.  As soon as it arrived in chinese customs, the sellers asked me to lower the claimed value so he could collect it..something that cannot be done after an item has already been shippped.  The seller stopped responding to messages and kept my money after 3 months. I'm out $800. You've been warned

[Jon L]

Just a warning to other forum members, I too purchased this amp from the link the OP provided, the AliExpress store called FunKenya HiFi Store.  The seller sent me an invoice outside of Aliexpress and I paid it.  The amp did arrive, but after 300 hours of burn in I found it veiled, muddy, with rolled off highs.  The seller agreed to refund me if I shipped it back.  After already spending over $500 on the amp, it then cost me $250 to ship it back.  As soon as it arrived in chinese customs, the sellers asked me to lower the claimed value so he could collect it..something that cannot be done after an item has already been shippped.  The seller stopped responding to messages and kept my money after 3 months. I'm out $800. You've been warned

That's a darn shame    Hopefully you left a review at Aliexpress also.
Yeah, this is pretty much why I have a limit on the price I would ever pay on Ali..

[jankovic]

Hi everyone, I'm very tempted to buy a d5 D5 Ultra NHB-108 or a Breeze NHB 108 Circuit Version 4. Has anyone had the chance to do a comparison? the price difference is not excessive

[bkatbamna]

Has anyone bought a Orsefon tube?

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803523861422.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt

[niekos]

The cover is tightly placed and needs a little effort to remove. All wiring inside is very neatly arranged and access to certain areas required dismantling more than I thought. I expended more time than I thought and left the amp a little less neat than I found it. Replacing the binding posts is fairly easy, the RCA wiring not so much.

I replaced the speakerposts as well on my Dartzeel (transaudio) NHB108 clone, and added some bypass caps. Also took a look at how to replace the RCA cabling, but was not sure how to proceed. How did you do this? Did you remove the top board and desoldered the RCA from the top? Or did you remove the bottom board as well  and disconnect it from the cooling ribs? My board and RCA cable is shown in the picture.

[niekos]

To answer my own question: it was not that hard to do. I removed the cooling fins and disconnected the top board from the stack. This gives room to the input cables from above. I was able to remove these cables, since there is also a solder pad on the top. I removed the solder and resoldered some mogami cable (with shielding). I have the shielding floating at the board side. See pictures for some detail photos for those that might be interested.