[GregC]

I had a dedicated Windows machine streaming via USB that I have used since 7 to 8  years ago.  I used to run it with a USB de-crapifier (powered by a linear PSU).  I also ran it with a Kitsune SU-1 to up-sample the USB from the computer to 352.1 KHz or 384 KHz (in even multiples), and output from the SU-1 via I2S output into my DAC.   

Now I run USB directly from the computer to my DAC, and I can still use up-sampling if I want.  I also am able to run the I2S from the Mano Ultra Streamer if I want and not even turn on the Windows music server. 

Team Viewer is easier to remote into a Windows machine because drivers do not need to be handled like they do from a remote desktop connection.   

I still use my Windows music server for recording vinyl and splitting tracks, or for impromptu streaming from sources such as Amazon Music HD. 

Some high-res music files are from a lower bitrate source that were up-sampled to a higher bitrate.  Unless the music is recorded in analog and directly transferred to a high bitrate file, you cannot get more resolution than what is contained in the the original recording.  Everything else relies on DSP to fill in gaps.

I just listened to a lowly MP3 played back on my W4S DAC.  W4S has technology to make MP3 files sound good.  Leonard Cohen, If it Be Your Will (Live in London) just knocked me over with its emotional impact. 

I moved from my remote Windows music server to an Ultrarendu with a linear PSU for streaming.  The Ultrarendu is a computer in itself, but it cleans up the USB output and is dedicated to music playback.  The Ultrarendu and linear PSU are comparable to the sound I hear from the Mano Ultra Streamer, but the Mano reduces my component count without sacrificing sound quality. 

I opted for the Mano Ultra Streamer as opposed to an expensive dedicated music server such as Innuous, Melco, or Antipodes.  I am happy with my decision,   

[newzooreview]

it would be a shame to put a limit on potential fun with a under powered, low-res server.

I stream native DSD512 to the Holo May KTE from the Intel NUC all the time. You don't need much processing power to stream DSD.

Fabricating a DSD stream from a non-DSD file, however, would require processing power.

[WGH]

I stream native DSD512 to the Holo May KTE from the Intel NUC all the time. You don't need much processing power to stream DSD.

Fabricating a DSD stream from a non-DSD file, however, would require processing power.

I'm always pleasantly surprised how little power is needed to play music without upsampling. Making a DSD stream from 44.1kHz maxes out my computer so I never do it. A NVIDIA RTX 3080 (GPU) works best, which is too many fans for me, I like zero fans.

I was referring to the the Mano ULTRA mkIIA, sorry for the confusion.
"The one downside is it only supports a max of 192/24 KHz PCM, or DSD 64 via DoP (not DSD Direct)"

[newzooreview]

I was referring to the the Mano ULTRA mkIIA, sorry for the confusion.
"The one downside is it only supports a max of 192/24 KHz PCM, or DSD 64 via DoP (not DSD Direct)"

Got it. It also has no USB output (which may explain the sample rates available).

[Rich Carlson]

This is a timely thread for me.  I was just about to order a Roon Nucleus, but being unable to play my own ripped files when my internet connection is down makes it a non-starter for me.

[Saturn94]

…Roon, by the way, has prohibited users from voting to restore offline playback. It was by far the most requested feature after less than a day of voting and they suddenly "closed" voting and declared that it's "not on the roadmap." They have not done this with any previous feature request…

Roon has reopened that Feature Request thread.  They said closing it prevented voting, which was not their intention, so it was reopened to allow users to vote.

Personally, I think the full time internet access requirement is a done deal and no amount of voting in the Feature Request will change that.

[GregC]

Got it. It also has no USB output (which may explain the sample rates available).

For excellent USB output and a higher bitrate capacity, I was happy with an Ultrarendu.  It supports up to 384 KHz PCM and Native DSD 128 from what I tested.  Also it can be used for MPD local playback, a DLNA endpoint, a Squeezelite endpoint, a LMS Server, a HQ Player endpoint, or a Roon endpoint. 

[newzooreview]

Roon has reopened that Feature Request thread.  They said closing it prevented voting, which was not their intention, so it was reopened to allow users to vote.

Thanks. They succeeded in their goal. The vote total has stagnated because it was closed for so long. Now they can claim that it's just a handful of disgruntled users.

I did add a vote, but they are not willing to discuss the issue so it's an empty gesture.

Thanks again, though. It's just shocking how badly they are behaving.

[GregC]

To stop local streaming when an internet connection is unavailable seems like a big takeaway.  I had one week where an Xfinity equipment failure affected several houses in the neighborhood.  If that stopped me from playing local files I would have been an unhappy camper. 

[newzooreview]

For excellent USB output and a higher bitrate capacity, I was happy with an Ultrarendu.

Thank you.

I paid for lifetime Roon in the first year or so of their operation. So, it is free to me to stick it out until their next atrocity makes it unfeasible.

As I have been pondering jumping ship, there are a few things that hold me up.

1. The user interface. I have looked at others and with all of its limitations and omissions, the Roon interface is overall better than what I see elsewhere. The fonts and layout are clean and fairly well organized. Others look more cluttered and amateurish. Some are just an eyesore.

2. The metadata. The artist info, cross referencing of session players, album write-ups and bios, etc. are unique. Obviously that is a reason it was popular in the early days. It seems to be maintain a lead still.

3. The native app for each OS. Although they are just using a .NET development platform to compile a binary for each platform, it works better than a website. It gives you all of the keyboard shortcuts you are used to and fits into the workflow better than having to tab over to a website. It also doesn't disappear if you need to restart the browser. It sits in its own sandbox regardless of what else you are doing on the computer.

4. Friction to migrate. That's not a consideration for anyone choosing a LAN-local file streaming setup, but obviously it is if Roon is up and running.

It would be a difficult decision to choose Roon at this point, as a new user. But it is also hard to see a better alternative, despite their animosity towards their own users.

I think that for the costs involved, it's a coin toss between Roon and other options. If your internet is sometimes down, then it's really no choice. Roon fails.

[artur9]

Question about this (not being a "real" roon user).

local playback means playback on the phone when you're in the house?
or
local playback means playback on any zone in the house?

[newzooreview]

Question about this (not being a "real" roon user).

local playback means playback on the phone when you're in the house?
or
local playback means playback on any zone in the house?

Local playback means playing back the files stored on a hard drive (or solid state drive) in the house. You can control (start/stop/queue) that playback from a phone, computer, or tablet.

If your external internet is down, you cannot play any of your music using Roon. It stops working. You paid for it, and it used to work without internet, but now there's a kill switch.

The music is on your hard drive (or NAS), all the devices for controlling playback (phone, tablet, computer, whatever you prefe) are in the house, all of the equipment to play the music (DAC, preamp, amp, speakers) are in the house. If Roon cannot connect via the internet to the Roon servers, no playback of your own music on your own equipment will work via Roon.

[Saturn94]

…I did add a vote, but they are not willing to discuss the issue so it's an empty gesture.

Thanks again, though. It's just shocking how badly they are behaving.

Agreed.  I voted as well in case by some miracle it matters.

Unfortunately, this isn’t new behavior.  Seriously, they need to get someone other than Danny interacting with customers.  His communication style often isn’t, umm, very “customer friendly”, shall we say.

[Saturn94]

Thank you.

I paid for lifetime Roon in the first year or so of their operation. So, it is free to me to stick it out until their next atrocity makes it unfeasible.

As I have been pondering jumping ship, there are a few things that hold me up.

1. The user interface. I have looked at others and with all of its limitations and omissions, the Roon interface is overall better than what I see elsewhere. The fonts and layout are clean and fairly well organized. Others look more cluttered and amateurish. Some are just an eyesore.

2. The metadata. The artist info, cross referencing of session players, album write-ups and bios, etc. are unique. Obviously that is a reason it was popular in the early days. It seems to be maintain a lead still.

3. The native app for each OS. Although they are just using a .NET development platform to compile a binary for each platform, it works better than a website. It gives you all of the keyboard shortcuts you are used to and fits into the workflow better than having to tab over to a website. It also doesn't disappear if you need to restart the browser. It sits in its own sandbox regardless of what else you are doing on the computer.

4. Friction to migrate. That's not a consideration for anyone choosing a LAN-local file streaming setup, but obviously it is if Roon is up and running.

It would be a difficult decision to choose Roon at this point, as a new user. But it is also hard to see a better alternative, despite their animosity towards their own users.

I think that for the costs involved, it's a coin toss between Roon and other options. If your internet is sometimes down, then it's really no choice. Roon fails.

Good points.

I’m also bought a Lifetime License (2017).  I’m past the break even point, so it’s not costing me anything to stick with it until it really no longer serves my needs.

[Yog Sothoth]

Wow!  This is all terrible.  I had considered Roon at one point but it's stunts like this that make me glad I chose a different path.  You all have my sympathies!

[Rusty Jefferson]

I gotta say, this seems like a nothing burger. I live in a working/middle class neighborhood where the power seems to go out regularly if the wind blows. In 20 years of having internet service here with 2 different companies, it has never to my knowledge gone out.

Why would you suffer all the time with an inferior server/controller software because "someday" the internet may go out for an hour? The simple answer is people don't like change. When they switched from 1.7 to 1.8 last year people went nuts. A month before this announcement, nobody was complaining about 1.8.

I still have a copy of Minimserver installed on my NAS and the old Android tablet I controlled it with that I can fall back on to play local files in the event my internet goes down for an hour sometime.

[newzooreview]

I gotta say, this seems like a nothing burger.

Yes, I suppose if everyone had uninterruptible internet it would be just fine.

[Rusty Jefferson]

Yes, I suppose if everyone had uninterruptible internet it would be just fine.

Apologies to folks who have that problem. I didn't know that even was a common problem for people, especially for folks who are technology oriented, would be interested in something like ROON and have whole house networks and switches and NASs, etc. that requires a pretty large stable internet connection to stream Qobuz/Tidal over. How many existing ROON customers around the world have unreliable internet connections? I'll assume if I didn't have a reliable connection I'd revert to Minimserver or something else, but if you have a good connection why stop using the best program for the purpose out there?

I'm not a ROON fanboy either. They annoy me because I'm not a technology person and I'm old. I'm still wishing I could vote somewhere to get hand crank car windows and actual ignition keys again.

[Nick B]

I bought a lifetime license in 2016 or so. Don’t really have power outages and can’t remember the last time my power went out. Roon has its issues with support, but it’s the best music platform I’ve seen and there’s nowhere else to go…..

[Yog Sothoth]

I gotta say, this seems like a nothing burger.

Interesting.  Our fails quite frequently.  I usually need to tether to my phone then (and not for music services) and it's low bandwidth make it barely usable.