[ttan98]

My 2 cents take

Our Human ears are very smart, even with 2 or more pairs of well-designed speakers you would be able to tell their differences after you bought the best pair at the time after awhile a will be tired of them and wanted to change or swap.
So I normally don't buy them off the shelf just DIYs myself so that I can change the x-over or change the freq. resp. using either hardware Xover or active DSP. Better still build different configuration speakers, e.g. OB, horn base, Full ranger, etc.

End of the day, I get to hear a wide variety of speakers(they all sound different) and costs less overall.

[thetakeout]

AVSFAN

I would love to hear about your experience with the two Omega's you owned.  Any thoughts about how they behaved differently?  Any particularly strengths or weakness to their presentation in your opinion?

I've heard one set it was a fan of and would like to hear more of their offerings. 

I like the idea of one day buying Omen's for the upgraded bracing and cabling and then swapping out the drivers.  I have DW and also like them.  I have snubbers on them.  In my opinion they are wonderful at moderate to low levels but they get rowdy when I push them.  I am guessing some of that would go away with the bracing and cabling of the Omens.  Your paint job looks killer.  The build quality on Zus is out of this world imo.

[genjamon]

@thetakeout, which amp are you driving your DW's with?  And when you say they get rowdy when you push them, can you quantify what you mean by "pushing" them?  dB level?  Or volume level and gain of your amplification? 

The reason I ask is that I don't find my DW's to get rowdy, but am not sure how hard you mean when you push them.  And I also have highly upgraded caps on the DW tweeters as well as the snubbers.  But also am driving them with Odyssey Kismets which are rated over 200 watts into 8 ohms and much more into lower impedances.  What I'm getting at is I wonder if the rowdiness is truly attributed to the cabinet, or if it could be the amps not keeping up with the snubbers in the mix.  Or if you haven't upgraded tweeter caps, a bit of harshness in the tweeter that would get smoother with better caps. 

But maybe you just play quite a bit louder than I do and it is indeed the limitation of the cabinets. 

[RonN5]

@fullrangeman

I always thought the hickory dirty weekends were my favorite finish....but maybe now its the Ferrari Red.  How were you able to order the dirty weekends before the March sale....or were these ordered last year and just being finished now?

[mick wolfe]

AVSFAN

I would love to hear about your experience with the two Omega's you owned.  Any thoughts about how they behaved differently?  Any particularly strengths or weakness to their presentation in your opinion?

I've heard one set it was a fan of and would like to hear more of their offerings. 

I like the idea of one day buying Omen's for the upgraded bracing and cabling and then swapping out the drivers.  I have DW and also like them.  I have snubbers on them.  In my opinion they are wonderful at moderate to low levels but they get rowdy when I push them.  I am guessing some of that would go away with the bracing and cabling of the Omens.  Your paint job looks killer.  The build quality on Zus is out of this world imo.

I'm with genjamon on this one. If they get "rowdy" beyond moderate levels, best look at your source components, amplification, cabling and room acoustics before blaming the speaker. A modern DW with Clarity's or similar will play plenty loud with ease IF all the other above mentioned "ducks" are in a row.

[FullRangeMan]

@fullrangeman

I always thought the hickory dirty weekends were my favorite finish....but maybe now its the Ferrari Red.  How were you able to order the dirty weekends before the March sale....or were these ordered last year and just being finished now?

Ron I have not ordered any these.

[RonN5]

Yes... now I see... they belong to AVSFAN...

[AvsFan]

Yes... now I see... they belong to AVSFAN...

Yep! They’re all mine! And I ordered these a long time ago. About 6months ago. There were a couple of issues during the process, one of the cabinets had to be re-shot and buffed. But the wait will be worth it! Super excited!

[thetakeout]

I am fortunate to have access to lots of amps and sources to swap out.  One of the perks of living in a major metro area. 

I have also had two pairs of dirty weekends with the clarity cap upgrade.  With snubbers and without.

I’ve dealt with power and cables.  I’ve also loaned them out and gotten the same report back, rowdy when pushed but sublime at low levels. I have a daughter that is a light sleeper so their low level performance is the big priority. 

The snubbers help calm them down.  I have a friend that has Omens that behave the same way without the snubbers.  I haven’t asked how his perform when pushed with the snubbers.  I’ve also brought the point up to other Zu owners and this wasn’t a shock so I feel confident it is just a limitation of the design.  No speaker is perfect and I frankly I’ve them at moderate to low levels. 

I’ve had great amps.  First Watt M2, Decware Torii MKIII decked out with killer tubes , Alan Eaton 45 SET, Marantz 2230b, Yamaha a/s301. Probably five or six different tube amps push pull and single ended on loan from buddies.

[AvsFan]

I am fortunate to have access to lots of amps and sources to swap out.  One of the perks of living in a major metro area. 

I have also had two pairs of dirty weekends with the clarity cap upgrade.  With snubbers and without.

I’ve dealt with power and cables.  I’ve also loaned them out and gotten the same report back, rowdy when pushed but sublime at low levels. I have a daughter that is a light sleeper so their low level performance is the big priority. 

The snubbers help calm them down.  I have a friend that has Omens that behave the same way without the snubbers.  I haven’t asked how his perform when pushed with the snubbers.  I’ve also brought the point up to other Zu owners and this wasn’t a shock so I feel confident it is just a limitation of the design.  No speaker is perfect and I frankly I’ve them at moderate to low levels. 

I’ve had great amps.  First Watt M2, Decware Torii MKIII decked out with killer tubes , Alan Eaton 45 SET, Marantz 2230b, Yamaha a/s301. Probably five or six different tube amps push pull and single ended on loan from buddies.

I’ll respond more to this but a lot of the amps you just mentioned are good amps but not the kind of amps that are going to man handle the ZU’s the way they want to be. I had a pair of Alan Eaton 45 Monoblocks and they were horrible with the ZU’s when turning up the volume. Like you said shouty and a mess. So I know the sound you describe. But it’s NOT the speakers. Once I put good clean, quality power to the ZU’s, different ball game. Totally different sport. I abuse my ZU’s at times with concert level spl’s and the y stay cool, collected and composed with tons of slam and clarity. The ZU’s are some of the best speakers I’ve ever heard being able to crank the volume and still sounding spectacular. And as you’ve mentioned, tube amps sound great with the ZU’s at very moderate volumes but once I put some SS power and a damping factor of +2000, the ZU’s really opened up and came into their own.

[genjamon]

Hmm, alright, let’s see here:

First Watt M2 - 25 watts solid state
Declare Torii - 25 watts of EL-34
Marantz 2230b - 25 watts of 1970’s solid state
Yamaha A/S 301 - 60 watts of modern budget integrated (19 lbs likely means limited power supply)
Alan Eaton 45 - low single digits watts 45 tubes

I’m not seeing anything here that would put up with cranking the volume. I’m sure they are all very competent and would sound good within their power limitations. And with several of them you could go fairly loud without running out of steam. But I’ve had the Decware Torii Mk2 as well as SS 24 watt affairs in a system with 98dB Tekton Lores and reached their limits without too much trouble when cranking volume in a 12 x 20 ft room. 

You might want to try them sometime with an amp greater than 100 watts and with a beefy power supply.

[AvsFan]

I’ve had conversations with both Sean and Gerrit, multiple conversations. Sean LOVES high watts and power with his ZU’s. They completely change with amps that have muscle and authority.

Don’t take my word for it.....

https://youtu.be/Y8Ed2FNcMYg

[AvsFan]

Hmm, alright, let’s see here:

First Watt M2 - 25 watts solid state
Declare Torii - 25 watts of EL-34
Marantz 2230b - 25 watts of 1970’s solid state
Yamaha A/S 301 - 60 watts of modern budget integrated (19 lbs likely means limited power supply)
Alan Eaton 45 - low single digits watts 45 tubes

I’m not seeing anything here that would put up with cranking the volume. I’m sure they are all very competent and would sound good within their power limitations. And with several of them you could go fairly loud without running out of steam. But I’ve had the Decware Torii Mk2 as well as SS 24 watt affairs in a system with 98dB Tekton Lores and reached their limits without too much trouble when cranking volume in a 12 x 20 ft room. 

You might want to try them sometime with an amp greater than 100 watts and with a beefy power supply.

All good amps in the right situations. Amp synergy and speaker synergy is key. If you’re buying ZU’s, Omen Dirty Weekends to be specific, and you’re wanting to crank up the volume, those amps aren’t the solution.
I actually looked into a Firstwatt J2 at one point but the guy I was talking to about it  even concurred that it wasn’t the right amp for my application and musical demands.

[FullRangeMan]

You might want to try them sometime with an amp greater than 100 watts and with a beefy power supply.

In this case your only option are the Odyssey Khartago or Stratos. I peruse audio since the 1970s and have never seen a greater value amp, they are beautiful, hand made by Klaus and sound good.

[thetakeout]

Didn’t mean to start an argument here.  I actually chimed in to ask about the Omega speakers that AVSFAN tried.  I also was wondering what amps were used to success with the Zu’s.  I’ve owned two sets of these guys and love them. 

My priority is low listening levels.  So they have stayed. 

I will actually have a set of high watt cherry amps with all the dampening these 12ohm non reactive load speakers could ask for in the house soon so we will see how it goes.

[AvsFan]

I am fortunate to have access to lots of amps and sources to swap out.  One of the perks of living in a major metro area. 

I have also had two pairs of dirty weekends with the clarity cap upgrade.  With snubbers and without.

I’ve dealt with power and cables.  I’ve also loaned them out and gotten the same report back, rowdy when pushed but sublime at low levels. I have a daughter that is a light sleeper so their low level performance is the big priority. 

The snubbers help calm them down.  I have a friend that has Omens that behave the same way without the snubbers.  I haven’t asked how his perform when pushed with the snubbers.  I’ve also brought the point up to other Zu owners and this wasn’t a shock so I feel confident it is just a limitation of the design.  No speaker is perfect and I frankly I’ve them at moderate to low levels. 

I’ve had great amps.  First Watt M2, Decware Torii MKIII decked out with killer tubes , Alan Eaton 45 SET, Marantz 2230b, Yamaha a/s301. Probably five or six different tube amps push pull and single ended on loan from buddies.

I too am impressed with their low level playback abilities. They actually sound great at all levels of playback. Very impressive because a lot of speakers can’t pull that off.

With the amps that you have mentioned, I can see why you would say they are rowdy or shouty. I also found the bass sloppy, bloated and not articulate with lower powered tube amps. They were almost unlistenable. Now these low powered tube amps I had, weren’t bought for the ZU’s, they were  for some other crossoverless, high efficiency single small driver speakers, in which they sounded great with. They just didn’t sound good with the ZU’s. If low level listening on tube amps is really your end game, there are a lot of better options that will match up better with low powered tube amps.

[AvsFan]

Didn’t mean to start an argument here.  I actually chimed in to ask about the Omega speakers that AVSFAN tried.  I also was wondering what amps were used to success with the Zu’s.  I’ve owned two sets of these guys and love them. 

My priority is low listening levels.  So they have stayed. 

I will actually have a set of high watt cherry amps with all the dampening these 12ohm non reactive load speakers could ask for in the house soon so we will see how it goes.

Hey, it’s alright. No apology needed. I don’t feel this is an argument at all. It’s actually a great discussion. Because even I didn’t realize the full potential of the ZU’s until I gave the some real power and muscle. It was like an aha moment. Epiphany of sorts. 

[AvsFan]

Didn’t mean to start an argument here.  I actually chimed in to ask about the Omega speakers that AVSFAN tried.  I also was wondering what amps were used to success with the Zu’s.  I’ve owned two sets of these guys and love them. 

My priority is low listening levels.  So they have stayed. 

I will actually have a set of high watt cherry amps with all the dampening these 12ohm non reactive load speakers could ask for in the house soon so we will see how it goes.

You just nailed it! Guess what amps brought out the life in the ZU’s? Tommy’s Cherry amps! His amps are spectacular. I started with an STM and then moved all the way to his Golden Cherry Monoblocks. And man, that set up was a lot of fun!

[genjamon]

Didn’t mean to start an argument here.  I actually chimed in to ask about the Omega speakers that AVSFAN tried.  I also was wondering what amps were used to success with the Zu’s.  I’ve owned two sets of these guys and love them. 

My priority is low listening levels.  So they have stayed. 

I will actually have a set of high watt cherry amps with all the dampening these 12ohm non reactive load speakers could ask for in the house soon so we will see how it goes.

I also listen almost exclusively at low to moderate volumes these days. And am certainly not trying to get you to invest in something you don’t need.  And I’m not trying to start a fight either.  It just seemed like you had some concerns about high volume listening, which didn’t seem quite right given my own experiences. So if you’re good to go with low volume listening, more power to you (pun intended .

I’m glad you’ll get to hear them with some Cherries. Never heard those amps, but have been curious to do so. They might be able to show you a new side of the DW’s. But maybe not. Would be good to hear your impressions if you’re willing to share afterward.

[AvsFan]

I also listen almost exclusively at low to moderate volumes these days. And am certainly not trying to get you to invest in something you don’t need.  And I’m not trying to start a fight either.  It just seemed like you had some concerns about high volume listening, which didn’t seem quite right given my own experiences. So if you’re good to go with low volume listening, more power to you (pun intended .

I’m glad you’ll get to hear them with some Cherries. Never heard those amps, but have been curious to do so. They might be able to show you a new side of the DW’s. But maybe not. Would be good to hear your impressions if you’re willing to share afterward.

I agree with everything you just said. The subject of Dirty Weekends being harsh at higher levels was a concern and topic of conversation. So we were just giving you our opinions. I most certainly hear none of what you speak of with the electronics and amps I run with my ZU’s.

But I can give you first hand knowledge of Cherry amps and Dirty Weekend paired together. And they were spectacular!