Don Sachs preamp

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geerock

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Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #40 on: 21 May 2020, 10:29 pm »
Anyone with the new WE Shuguang plus tubes care to tell me what spacing is necessary for the tube sockets to avoid touching glass?  My DS pre is a few years old, and I've heard that older ones may not have wide enough socket spacing for these new tubes.  But I can't find any specs online that talk about width of the glass so that I can measure my socket spacing for compatibility.
I'd give Don a call or email.  He keeps records of his builds.  If it's only a few years old he was using the Shuguang Treasure series which are very similar to the new bottle shape.  Before that he used other 6sn7's that he may spaced differently.
The sockets right now are 2 3/8 inch apart center to center both going side to side and front to back. 

ArthurDent

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Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #41 on: 21 May 2020, 10:36 pm »
Anyone with the new WE Shuguang plus tubes care to tell me what spacing is necessary for the tube sockets to avoid touching glass?  My DS pre is a few years old, and I've heard that older ones may not have wide enough socket spacing for these new tubes.  But I can't find any specs online that talk about width of the glass so that I can measure my socket spacing for compatibility.

Spacing on the WEKT88 is roughly 2.5" c-c, with ~.25" clear between the glass on the amp.

genjamon

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #42 on: 21 May 2020, 10:49 pm »
Mine has the black bottle treasures, and they just barely fit. In fact, I slightly tilt the tubes in the sockets to create a mm or two more space, they are that close to touching when flush in the sockets. But if the width of the new bottles is pretty close to the black bottle Treasures, then it might work?

datman

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #43 on: 22 May 2020, 03:23 am »
The solution is two octal socket savers. Position one in the left front and one in the right rear. They raise the tubes enough that the Shuguang WE6SN7+ tubes sit properly in their sockets AND the tubes don't touch. They are significantly better than the Treasure CV181 and worth the trouble.

The socket savers are available on eBay.



screener

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #44 on: 22 May 2020, 12:14 pm »
The solution is two octal socket savers. Position one in the left front and one in the right rear. They raise the tubes enough that the Shuguang WE6SN7+ tubes sit properly in their sockets AND the tubes don't touch. They are significantly better than the Treasure CV181 and worth the trouble.

The socket savers are available on eBay.

With this method can I use 4 Shuguang WE6SN7 tubes in the preamp?

HT cOz

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #45 on: 22 May 2020, 12:44 pm »
The solution is two octal socket savers. Position one in the left front and one in the right rear. They raise the tubes enough that the Shuguang WE6SN7+ tubes sit properly in their sockets AND the tubes don't touch. They are significantly better than the Treasure CV181 and worth the trouble.

The socket savers are available on eBay.

This thread is making me want to buy some of these WE6DN7+ tubes!  :thumb:

datman

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #46 on: 22 May 2020, 08:30 pm »
The socket savers will let you use 4 Shuguang WE6SN7+. Raising two of the tubes allows the curves of the adjacent tubes to fit in together.

If you are thinking of buying the Shuguang tubes, do it soon. They are just restarting production so it may take awhile. I get mine from https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/en. The prices are excellent and the shipping by DHL is fast

mresseguie

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Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #47 on: 22 May 2020, 08:57 pm »
The socket savers will let you use 4 Shuguang WE6SN7+. Raising two of the tubes allows the curves of the adjacent tubes to fit in together.

If you are thinking of buying the Shuguang tubes, do it soon. They are just restarting production so it may take awhile. I get mine from https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/en. The prices are excellent and the shipping by DHL is fast

Great idea! They're sold out. In fact, every vendor appears to be sold out. Estimated delivery is in July.

Since I have an older Model 2, I'd have to use the socket savers if I had 4 of the WE6SN7 Plus tubes. Fortunately for me, I happen to own 4 matched WEKT88 Plus tubes for my Kootenay 120. I bought them last year and only just a couple hours ago (shocking, I know) rotated them in. Perhaps, it won't be as noticeable, but at least I have them.




sunnydaze

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #48 on: 22 May 2020, 08:59 pm »
The socket savers will let you use 4 Shuguang WE6SN7+. Raising two of the tubes allows the curves of the adjacent tubes to fit in together.

If you are thinking of buying the Shuguang tubes, do it soon. They are just restarting production so it may take awhile. I get mine from https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/en. The prices are excellent and the shipping by DHL is fast

The website says NOT AVAILABLE.  Are you saying to still make order and maybe get on waiting list?   :scratch:

https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&categories_id=&keyword=Shuguang+WE6SN7+plus



datman

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #49 on: 22 May 2020, 09:24 pm »
They were available a few days ago when I last checked. I am certain China Hifi will have them again as soon as Shuguang releases them.

geerock

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Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #50 on: 22 May 2020, 09:26 pm »
Great idea! They're sold out. In fact, every vendor appears to be sold out. Estimated delivery is in July.

Since I have an older Model 2, I'd have to use the socket savers if I had 4 of the WE6SN7 Plus tubes. Fortunately for me, I happen to own 4 matched WEKT88 Plus tubes for my Kootenay 120. I bought them last year and only just a couple hours ago (shocking, I know) rotated them in. Perhaps, it won't be as noticeable, but at least I have them.




Psvane has them at the Covid 19 / Shuguang fire sale price gouging cost of only $549 for a highly matched quad.  Incredible.

Mressiguie
Let me know how you like the changes in the Kootenay when you get a good listen on those WEKT88's.

sunnydaze

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #51 on: 22 May 2020, 09:49 pm »

mresseguie

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Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #52 on: 22 May 2020, 10:07 pm »
Psvane has them at the Covid 19 / Shuguang fire sale price gouging cost of only $549 for a highly matched quad.  Incredible.

Mressiguie
Let me know how you like the changes in the Kootenay when you get a good listen on those WEKT88's.

Since they're brand spanking new, I wasn't paying much attention to music quality. I did, however, notice that the top plate of the amp was HOT to the touch. It's been in SET Triode mode since January. <= Could this cause the amp to run hotter?
It didn't run that hot with the Shuguang Gold Lion's in.

I'll switch to push-pull  Ultra linear (UL) mode in a while to see if the temperature drops. Tubes all biased correctly.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
All this chatter about Don's newest Model 2 and preamp porn pushed me over the edge today. I sent Don an email telling him I want another Model 2 with all the bells and whistles. I'm going to need people's phone numbers (Shakeydeal, Geerock, etc.) because I will have to blame my purchase on someone when she discovers I have a second Model 2.  :thumb:
« Last Edit: 23 May 2020, 08:13 pm by mresseguie »

geerock

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Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #53 on: 22 May 2020, 10:49 pm »
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
All this chatter about Don's newest Model 2 and preamp porn pushed me over the edge today. I sent Don an email telling him I want another Model 2 with all the bells and whistles. I'm going to need people's phone numbers (Shakeydeal, Geerock, etc.) because I will have to blame my purchase on someone when she discovers I have a second Model 2.  :thumb:
You ain't giving her my number!  I get enough grief on my own end here about equipment.  Actually....I used to.  Now it goes in one ear and out the other.  I'm too old for that nonsense.  And the few times I get frisky anymore is when we are having a bourbon or three and we are listening to music.  Besides, she knows I'm full of it after telling her over the years I'm selling off some stuff (almost never do) but still have enough equipment laying around to open my own audiophile shop.  Give her Shakeys number.....or one of the other guys.  : )
« Last Edit: 22 May 2020, 11:51 pm by geerock »

genjamon

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #54 on: 22 May 2020, 11:58 pm »
Psvane has them at the Covid 19 / Shuguang fire sale price gouging cost of only $549 for a highly matched quad.  Incredible.

Mressiguie
Let me know how you like the changes in the Kootenay when you get a good listen on those WEKT88's.

Psvane offers a real warranty plus much better matching, and they claim to be testing at the factory and only make available the cream of the crop tubes.  So they charge a premium for the supposedly better measuring tubes and for the actual warranty.  And $189 a pair is equal to $380/quad.  So $550/quad is definitely more, but it's not that extreme provided the additional quality/warranty.  I've taken advantage of their warranty before with expensive Psvane 845WE's before, so can definitely see the value of spending a bit more for some assurances. 

Looks like my socket spacing is only about 2 inches max.  My only hesitation about the socket extenders is whether they impact sound quality negatively.  I mean, what's the point of using expensive ceramic tube sockets with gold plated copper pins if you attach a socket extender with inferior materials?  And then there's the issue of yet one more set of connections to muck with the signal a bit.  Don's preamp is transparent enough that it really responds to all the little refinements, and it would grate me to go in the opposite direction.  But I guess if the new WE plus tubes are that much better, maybe the socket degradation tradeoff is smaller than the improvement from the better tubes, so still a net benefit overall.

datman

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #55 on: 23 May 2020, 12:24 am »
I am using WEKT88+ tubes in my Kootenay amp. They sound absolutely wonderful. I used the same socket saver trick to fit the WE6SN7's in my amp



Sorry about the sidways image. Don't know how to fix that one.

the socket savers are available at:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1pcs-Gold-Octal-8pin-EL34-KT88-6SN7-6V6-GZ34-6L6-5Z3-Tube-Socket-Saver-Base/283301306810?hash=item41f612e1ba:g:234AAOSwD3Behv7y

genjamon

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #56 on: 23 May 2020, 12:37 am »
Thanks Datman!

mresseguie

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Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #57 on: 23 May 2020, 12:45 am »
I am using WEKT88+ tubes in my Kootenay amp. They sound absolutely wonderful. I used the same socket saver trick to fit the WE6SN7's in my amp





Sorry about the sidways image. Don't know how to fix that one.

the socket savers are available at:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1pcs-Gold-Octal-8pin-EL34-KT88-6SN7-6V6-GZ34-6L6-5Z3-Tube-Socket-Saver-Base/283301306810?hash=item41f612e1ba:g:234AAOSwD3Behv7y

Datman,

Does your amp get extra hot with the WEKT88+ tubes in there? Have you tried the SET triode mode setting with them?

Michael
« Last Edit: 23 May 2020, 02:13 am by mresseguie »

datman

Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #58 on: 23 May 2020, 01:14 am »
I haven't noticed it runs particularly hot. I don't think set/ul would make a difference in heat output.

olesno

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Re: Don Sachs preamp
« Reply #59 on: 24 May 2020, 12:30 pm »
I have Don's preamp and amp for few months now and I am enjoying both very much.  One of the WEKT88Plus tubes on my amp went bad few days ago.  Don is sending me a replacement tube but in the meantime I had to scramble to get new tubes as I didn't have any spares.  So I bought a quad of Genalex Gold Lion KT88 and use them now.  They are very good.  Not as good as my original tubes but really good.  I will definitely keep them as my spare set and honestly I don't think it would be that easy to tell the difference between the sets.  Worth looking into for less than $200 for a matched quad (from Viva Tubes).
Different subject.  I've been experimenting with different interconnects for between the source and the preamp and the preamp and amp.  So far my favorite brand is Acoustic BBQ.  They're made from Duelund wire and match nicely with the DS units.  Don uses Duelund internally as far as I know, so maybe the synergy just works well in this case.  Any other ideas or experience with cabling worth looking into?