Dmason and his endless hyping of the Clari-T tripath amp

Zero · « **Reply #80 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 02:42 am »

Wonder how this pup would sound with the Totem Acoustic Sttafs and the Vandersteen 2CE Sigs.

Gotta cover from some purchases.

This may have already been asked, but do batteries on this thing burn up fast?

audiojerry · « **Reply #81 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 03:26 am »

Quote from: ndpjr

I am new to this forum and have been reading it for the past few weeks. I just received my Clari-T amp...

Thanks for your input, and welcome aboard!

Bemopti123 · « **Reply #82 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 05:19 am »

A6M-Zero, for what I have read, due to the fact that the ClariTamp is based on the chip set from the Sonic Impact, your choice of speakers, both the Totem and also the Vandersteens? are definetly NOT compatible with the power provided. The question in regards to battery consumption is that it is directly related with the load and the sensitivity of the partnered speakers. The following analogy might apply to the battery life of almost any audio or video device, if you drive a car that has four cylinders and such car is compact, small, light, then you will be able to travel further without refueling, or recharging, but if you put such engine in a much heavier car, it will travel, not too fast, but definetly, not too far without needing refueling, recharging.

Returning to your question, you will not be able to run those speakers with this amp, 5 watts, I think is what is available at 8 ohm, that is very little power for anything less than perhaps 94 dbs of sensitivity.

-Richard- · « **Reply #83 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 08:13 am »

Bemopti 123...

It is my understanding that you do not actually own
a ClariT amp...and therefor your observations about
its ability to drive certain speakers is based strictly on
the data you are looking at...the relationship between the
ClariT's watts and the efficiency of various speakers.

There is a something intrinsically simplistic is this approach
and fraught with a great deal of potential for misinformation.

Scientists studying the Bumble Bee have surmised that given
its weight, size, wing span and the beats of its wing per minute...
that it cannot fly...

This is a very instructive analogy for allowing oneself to indulge
in what at first may appear to be common sense and perhaps some
previous experience with amps and speakers...

My ClariT arrived several days ago and I intend to use it with the Omega
Grand 8 R's which is based on the Fostex 8inch 207E paper cone
full range driver with a sensitivity of 96db...a match that appears to be
made in heaven according to a growing chorus of music lovers that
have put this combination together and feel they have found a bit
of musical bliss...

However my Omega's will not arrive for perhaps 2 more weeks...so I
am currently driving a pair of emphatically inefficient British speakers...
The Ruark Crusader 2, 3 way floor standers...they have a rating of only
84db's...we are talking about behemoth's here that one might ordinarily
think would need a muscular amp to drive them correctly...

However the ClariT drives them beautifully...with just 6 watts!
We are not talking about head banging volume here but
the "natural" presence musical instruments and the voice
would make in most settings...

I have only 40 hours of actual use on the ClariT so the full
"bloom" that Vinnie Rossi, the designer, feels opens up after
about 100 hours is still to come...

The ClariT takes the Ruark's in hand and compels them to
deliver electrostatic speed...a profound clarity that I have never
heard before on these speakers...and I have heard many of the
"stars" that are offered up in the audio magazines and shops
as de rigeur...layer upon layer of detail that entirely serves the music...
a very s-m-o-o-t-h presentation with the blackest background imaginable...

With the ClariT one must readjust their perceptions of what an amp
can actually do to assist and reveal the "intent" of the composer, or the
musician or singer...

In fact the ClariT is the most "intelligent" amp I have ever
heard...which is to say that the music reveals itself as it was
meant to be heard...the spirit of the music is rendered with
seemingly every thread of sound intact and everything
inherently musical is flowing together...

The bass is just now becoming noticeably fleshed out...
in fact the amp is changing its character daily...as it burns in...

Deborah has never remarked so favorably on any amp she
has ever heard...she keeps pointing out things that delight
her about it...and her hearing acuity is far more sensitive
than mine...

Naturally the ClariT was not designed for speakers as inefficient
as the Ruark's...I can only imagine the synergy they will have
with the Omega Grand 8 R's...but the fact they the ClariT drives
the Ruark's with such utter aplomb...such sophistication
and refinement is proof that looking at data alone is not a
reliable method to make up ones mind about the ClariT or other
possible synergies in audio...

I shall write a full account of my observations of the ClariT
and the Omega's after the Omega's have burned in a bit...

I may be mistaken, Bemopti 123, but it seems as if you have
a very biased feeling that always seems to migrate toward
the negative when it involves the ClariT...an amp you seem to
have actually never heard...and do not own...

One is left scratching their head. Perhaps you feel that playing
Devil's advocate is an intellectually viable position given the
hype that is thrust on us from all sides in the "commercial"
audio world with its overripe prose and leaden adjectives slung from
every lamppost...

However I can assure you that what we have here is a legitimately
well designed amplifier that defies all preconceptions of what is
possible...that uses state of the art technology...and is reasonably
priced given its level of refinement.

Bumble Bees cannot fly indeed!

Warm regards -Richard-

smargo · « **Reply #84 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 12:10 pm »

Quote

With the ClariT one must readjust their perceptions of what an amp
can actually do to assist and reveal the "intent" of the composer, or the
musician or singer...

In fact the ClariT is the most "intelligent" amp I have ever
heard...which is to say that the music reveals itself as it was
meant to be heard...the spirit of the music is rendered with
seemingly every thread of sound intact and everything
inherently musical is flowing together...

My thoughts exactly - very well spoken - and great rebuttal!

regards,
smargo

gary · « **Reply #85 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 01:10 pm »

I'm not sure what the efficiency of the Totem's or Vandy's are, but fwiw the Clari-T drove my 88dB/W Onix Ref 1 monitors beautifully. They'd play at volumes well beyond my normal listening level, and I never head to turn the dial past about 11 o'clock. Usually it was more like 10 o'clock.

Gary

Vinnie R. · « **Reply #86 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 02:06 pm »

Quote from: A6M-ZERO

This may have already been asked, but do batteries on this thing burn up fast?

Hi A6M-ZERO,

Here is how I came up with my recommended 6-hour limit between charges:

I ran a fully charged Clari-T-Amp with 4-ohm load resistors (constant 4-ohms) at fairly loud level (around 10am on the volume, with a standard 2 Vrms source connected) and I found that after around 6 hours, the battery level was just starting to dip below 12V. My 6 hour rating on a fully charged battery is conservative. If you use, say a pair of 8-ohm speakers, and do not have the volume up loud, don't be surprised to get 8 to 10 hours of use before charges. Higher efficiency speakers will not need as much power to play loudly, so they will allow the batteries to go longer between charges.

Because everyone's speakers (impedance, sensitivity) and listening preferences are different, I cannot give an exact duration of listening time between charges...it is very variable! I chose to be conservative (play it safe) with my 6 hour rating.

The IMPORTANT thing here is not to drain down your battery by accidentally leaving it on, as this can hinder the battery's ability to hold charge, and thus, draining faster than normal. You also want to keep the charger connected at all times so when you turn the unit OFF, it recharges the battery.

Just like other battery powered audio gear (ex. the Ack! dAck), as long as you have good charging habbits, it is a piece of cake! I believe the benefits of battery power far outweighs the extra care required...

Regards,

GHM · « **Reply #87 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 02:38 pm »

If Richard doesn't secretly write novels he should be ! Geeeezzzz
This mans words flow like water ! I wish I had that talent .

Dmason · « **Reply #88 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 03:37 pm »

So much for "meta-analysis" from the liberal arts community, or to those with a keen-ness for intellectual weight, ....to our AMAZEMENT, the ClariT drove a pair of Dynaudio Contour 1.8 MkII on the weekend, notoriously difficult speakers, which are hooked up to a Bryston 4BST, 250 watts. Ergo, the whole power/sensitivity thing gets thrown out the window with this one.

I suggest anyone confused by these observations study the Tripath White Papers explaining the use of feedback with this architecture.

Sean: the ClariT drove my Vandersteen 1C "okay" but it is not the best fit.

"Stay in the shallow end, the water's warmer" -Hunter S. Thompson

MttBsh · « **Reply #89 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 03:37 pm »

Once again Bemopti123, this is not your best day on this board.

I'm quite sure at this point we've all come to suspect you of "Clari-T envy" after watching each of your confidently worded objections summarily shot down. Just take the plunge and buy the amp will ya? considering the other gear you've bought this is pocket change. Once you have the Clari-T set up with a few hours in your system your observations will merit our undivided attention - and who knows? you too may come to understand why bumble bees can fly.

Matt

Zero · « **Reply #90 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 03:59 pm »

Gary,

Do you enjoy your new speakers now? It is a damned shame that I couldnt take the REf1's off your hands in time.

Bemopti123,

You certainly seem to be the minority with your feelings, but I do thank you for your response just the same.

Vinnie,

Whats up guy, still enjoying the NAD / Tosh combo? Looks like another great creation has come out of the woodwork. I gotta recover from a slew of purchases I've just made - once that is over - I gotta get me a piece of this Clari-T.

Richard,

Very well spoken. There are few individuals who I've stumbled across in these years that posess your talents. Thank you for your response.

DMason,

I currently have some Danes as well... the Contour 1.1's. I've actually found them incredibly easy to drive. It's those Totem Sttafs that eat up every single bit of juice the amp has to give.

The only way to know is to find out.

RoadTripper · « **Reply #91 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 04:02 pm »

OK,

I am now on record as promising to hook up my Clari-T to my RM40s. The problem is that the Clari-T is such a beast to lug around that it might take me a bit of time to haul it to the next room.

I will let you know how it drives the big rig.

JLM · « **Reply #92 on:** 1 Mar 2005, 05:32 pm »

Being an engineer I can relate to how much the simple math speaks to me and my resistance towards accepting this bumble bee (Clari-T) amp.

Having been interested in SETs for years I've learned the value in getting familar with a sound pressure level meter in order to find out just how loud I listen. Before having a meter or test tone CDs I thought that I was a bass brute and a big spl kind of guy. Now I know that I'm a wimp on both counts. But I also know that I'm not so different from others and am still a bass hog compared to the SET crowd.

For critical listening most folks listen to around 75 dB with 10 dB peaks (jazz) or 70 dB with 20 dB peaks (classical). Using 90 dB/w/m speakers with a Clari-T in a 2000 cu. ft. room, you should be able to reach 98 dB and have about 10 dB headroom to spare for typical listening.

gary · « **Reply #93 on:** 2 Mar 2005, 03:53 am »

Quote from: A6M-ZERO

Gary,

Do you enjoy your new speakers now? It is a damned shame that I couldnt take the REf1's off your hands in time.

Yeah, you missed a good deal... and man do I ever regret selling them

My new speakers still really aren't completely broken in, but I'm liking them so far. Unfortunately my amp had to go back for some minor repairs and now I'm in St. Louis for a week so I haven't had much of a chance to listen to it. Hopefully in the next couple weeks that'll change though.

Gary

RoadTripper · « **Reply #94 on:** 2 Mar 2005, 04:28 am »

OK Folks,

I did it. I hooked up the Clari-T to my RM40s. Originally, I didn't hold out much hope for this working cause I already tried my Norh SE9 which are, as I recall, 8 WPC, and it didn't cut it. No impact and it clipped now and then on big orchestral climaxes. Overall, they sounded like they were sucking wind - kinda like the Lakers in last year's championship series vs. Detroit.

So, I figured the Clari-T wouldn't cut it either.

Well, so far I was wrong. Way wrong. I can sorta tell there isn't the power (and impact) available but I have it turned up to about 12:30 and it puts out quite well. And the all the benefits that I have been reaping on my Omegas are there on the RM40s.

In short, the detail, the speed, the black background and the humans are all there. I am screwed. I don't want to be unhooking the amp from one system to the other.

The amp being bested by the Clari-T is the modded Panny XR45 which is running in the all digital path - party mode - meaning it is bi-amping 4 channels at supposedly 100 per.

Given that the above is being replaced by 6 WPC, what I am hearing ain't supposed to happen. The performances are what I would call relaxed - a kind of "matter of fact" presentation. Because of the extreme clarity, you can hear the performances and the emotion being put into the music (if any).

JLM says he looks for tonalities (timbres, I guess) rather than clarity. Well, I believe that with clarity comes reality - tonal reality. I think I've got that too.

Maybe Vinnie can explain why this setup - 6 WPC into 90dB 4 ohm speakers ain't clipping.

In conclusion, I am finally starting to accept that I have a good stereo and that my ears aren't fooling me.

JeffB · « **Reply #95 on:** 2 Mar 2005, 07:39 am »

I imagine that Vinnie is getting tired of the Sonic Impact being mentioned or substituted for the Clari-T, but here it goes anyway. I feel that the Sonic Impact has clarity but innacurate timbre. I think the JVC RX-F10 has much more accurate timbre, but loses out some on the clarity due to AC noise. However, I don't see why the Clari-T could not better the RX-F10 in timbre and still have that awesome black background. By timbre being off, I mean that instruments just don't have a realistic sound to them. By clarity, I mean you can hear every little nuance of string volume changes and tone changes and placement of instruments in a volume space like nothing I have heard before.

JLM · « **Reply #96 on:** 2 Mar 2005, 11:15 am »

Another lesson from my time around SETs is the advantage of simplier speaker designs. Anything that can waste electricity, like a crossover or an extra driver, is to be avoided. Again this is wisdom beyond what the numbers would indicate. Single driver speakers are ideal and by definition provide an active speaker scenario where the amp "sees" the driver load better and can "relate" to it more synergistically.

The VMPS speakers certainly don't qualify on that count. But the numbers on the RM-40s would suggest that you should reach 99 dB in a 2000 cu. ft. room, which is really loud. I had a 12 wpc tube amp in house last fall with my 89 dB/w/m, 8 ohm speakers (that should reach the same 99 dB peaks) and I wouldn't turn it up past 12:00 (90 dB according to my RS spl meter).

Tonal clarity/reality, that's a good way to describe my #1 audio priority. The is in the details (a hoot to hear but distracts from the musical essence and makes poor recordings unlistenable). So few recordings image well that I can't make it a high priority either. That makes dynamics my second priority.