Lii Audio Crystal-10 Drivers

guf · « **Reply #20 on:** 29 Sep 2019, 09:40 pm »

Quote from: nature boy on 22 Sep 2019, 11:23 pm

FullRangeMan,

Remember video and audio were taken with a cell phone. Not the best quality. Source was reel to reel tape. There have been several Crystal 10 OB speakers built by posters on the Decware forum. Most of these builders are claiming they are the best full range single driver speaker they've ever heard.

There will be "live streaming" of Steve Deckerts upcoming Decfest get together on Oct. 3-5 which will feature the Lii Audio Crystal 10 driver in an OB configuration and with the driver in a custom cabinet designed and built by Lii Audio. This event will be live streamed in HD video with a professional stereo mike set up to capture the audio.

Feel free to tune in for a better listening experience.

NB

i spent a few hours reading that thread. It has me really intrested. i love a low power amp option. quick question here... so that shape of the betsey is important because why?

This could be an easy first speaker build project? I have some woodworking skills. Just get some plywood or mdf or hardwood and cut and install drivers and enjoy?

nature boy · « **Reply #21 on:** 29 Sep 2019, 10:08 pm »

The open baffle barrel shape (Betsy Baffle) and dimensions were developed by Randy of Caintuck Audio, after a lot of trial and error. He designed the baffle to incorporate the Wild Burro Audio Betsy driver (8") and has been selling them for several years.

Randy's good friend, Steve Deckert of Decware upscaled the design dimensions to accommodate the larger Lii Audio Crystal 10 & F-15 drivers. Steve refers to the F-15 OB as the "Big Betsy' and the Crystal-10 OB as the "Big Betsy Juniors".

NB

FullRangeMan · « **Reply #22 on:** 30 Sep 2019, 12:20 am »

There is other OB classic design simpler than Betsy, here w/the Super10CF:

Woodsage · « **Reply #23 on:** 9 Oct 2019, 03:01 am »

The Crystals look like beautiful drivers and well suited for OB. I’m looking forward to seeing some used ones come up for sale.

Russell Dawkins · « **Reply #24 on:** 21 Dec 2019, 08:46 am »

I just bought the last pair of Fast-10s. Looking forward to seeing how they sound.

ebag4 · « **Reply #25 on:** 21 Dec 2019, 05:48 pm »

Quote from: Russell Dawkins on 21 Dec 2019, 08:46 am

I just bought the last pair of Fast-10s. Looking forward to seeing how they sound.

I have about 80 hours on my Fast-10S, they are sounding very good on open baffle, they definitely improve with break in, they had a “honkiness” at some frequencies where they seemed to accentuate the note early on. I am playing with them in OB on top of my H frame servos at the moment, using cardboard to vary the width of the baffle, I started with a winged baffle initially, running full range with no baffle step compensation. I am also using a dome tweeter firing up, I have disconnected ithe tweeter a couple of times but prefer it with the tweeter.

I will probably throw together the Crystal-Mehnir cabinet over the holiday to try out. It is still early, but a worthy candidate I believe.

Best,
Ed

BTW, I thought I bought one of the last 4 sets, then when I checked again they had added 6 more, their little scheme worked, I jumped a little sooner than I might have otherwise, haha. One other note, be sure to refer to the Fast 10 cabinet to get the driver cutout dimensions, it is apparently a little smaller than the Crystal 10.

Russell Dawkins · « **Reply #26 on:** 26 Dec 2019, 06:52 pm »

Quote from: ebag4 on 21 Dec 2019, 05:48 pm

BTW, I thought I bought one of the last 4 sets, then when I checked again they had added 6 more, their little scheme worked, I jumped a little sooner than I might have otherwise, haha. One other note, be sure to refer to the Fast 10 cabinet to get the driver cutout dimensions, it is apparently a little smaller than the Crystal 10.

Hmmm. I wonder if I've been caught in the scheme, too. Now I see there are 6 more available after briefly showing "sold out"...
https://www.lii-audio.com/index.php/product/full-range-speaker-10-inch-hi-end-99db-hifi-speaker-driver-for-tube-amplifier-xizi-audio-2pcs-fast-10/

uncola · « **Reply #27 on:** 27 Dec 2019, 01:38 pm »

haha it's smart marketing. on their facebook group they show an upcoming model called the Fast10-B that's black and has an updated whizzer that uses what they learned making the big 15 incher. more relaxed highs I think they said.

I have the Fast8 and am waiting for a couple of 10" dipole woofers to make my first speaker. Gonna try to make my own version of the caintuck betsy and buck type baffle. with active crossover dsp..

Russell Dawkins · « **Reply #28 on:** 11 Jan 2020, 09:54 pm »

Well the drivers arrived undamaged in spite of marginal packaging and early results are very promising. I ran a frequncy sweep through them and they were subjectively very smooth with little in the way of peaks. High frequency extensio does not sound curtailed in any way my ears can discern (my hearing falls off around 10 kHz). They are still without panel or enclosures, just sitting naked on my desktop.

I'm very happy with the purchase so far. Time will tell once they're broken in and in boxes.

tooppy · « **Reply #29 on:** 14 Jan 2020, 02:50 pm »

Hi,

I run the F15 for 33hours now. First I just lay them bare on the floor 1 to 2 feet away from the walls....surprising.
Now I mounted them into a Caintuck barrel shape OB rather big size (40cm/65/105)...no spectacular improuvement.
From that I believe the small Caintuck OB is adequate if you place them near the walls and the bigger sizes if you place them "in the midddle of the room" so to speak.
My running period is probably too short to have real feeling of what this driver is capable of.
I run these beasts with a FW F5 + Sys.

I placed it in the corner for the picture but with such a big OB, it isn't adequate.

nature boy · « **Reply #30 on:** 14 Jan 2020, 04:53 pm »

For those of you who are interested in Lii Audio drivers with open baffle set ups, I encourage you to check out the extensive user information on the Decware forums. Steve Deckert and Randy Bash (Caintuck Audio) were early adopters of these drivers and waded through a lot of OB design elements (will save you a lot of time & $). These forums are chocked full of helpful information on drivers, open baffle implementation, and room positioning.

FWIW, from my direct communications with the company, the Lii Audio F-15 drivers were designed specifically for open baffle use. The Lii Audio Crystal 10's were designed primarily for box implementation, although sound very good in OB designs.

https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1561942815

https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1563675938

Also for full disclosure, I purchased a pair of Caintuck Audio The Lii 15 open baffle speakers from Randy. I've been using these in my dedicated two-channel system for over 2 months. Randy's Lii 15 baffles are available for under $1K shipped for those of you who are not DIY'ers. They sound absolutely stunning with proper placement and some diffuser room treatments. I have not affiliation with Caintuck Audio other than having met Randy @ two Decfest events and being a very satisfied customer. Below is a link to the Caintuck Audio F-15 webpage & a shot of my listening room FYI.

http://www.caintuckaudio.com/Lii_15.html

NB

Slam · « **Reply #31 on:** 21 Jan 2020, 11:38 am »

These look very interesting. How are they holding up for you?

nature boy · « **Reply #32 on:** 21 Jan 2020, 01:55 pm »

Slam,

If you are inquiring about the Lii Audio F-15 drivers, mine are holding up perfectly after about 5 months of regular, daily use. They communicate recorded music in an exceptionally realistic & musical way.

As I have previously noted they are the very best full-range driver I've ever heard.

NB

FullRangeMan · « **Reply #33 on:** 21 Jan 2020, 03:19 pm »

As expected I supose.
Did you ever hear any Nirvana from CommomSense?
A comparison would be interesting.

nature boy · « **Reply #34 on:** 21 Jan 2020, 05:19 pm »

Quote from: FullRangeMan on 21 Jan 2020, 03:19 pm

As expected I supose.
Did you ever hear any Nirvana from CommomSense?
A comparison would be interesting.

No, I have not heard any of the CommenSense offerings. I have listened to a dozen or more full rsnge, single driver speakers.

NB

Wig · « **Reply #35 on:** 21 Jan 2020, 05:27 pm »

I'm using Commonsense full-range drivers, 15" Classic Alnico Audio Nirvana and love them. I have had mines for 9 months now and they are a beautiful and engaging speaker.

Wig

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #36 on:** 21 Jan 2020, 05:31 pm »

NB,

How far back is the listening position from the drivers to the ears? With the drivers that low to the floor do you get the sense that the higher frequencies are somewhat attenuated?

FullRangeMan · « **Reply #37 on:** 21 Jan 2020, 05:35 pm »

Quote from: Wig on 21 Jan 2020, 05:27 pm

I'm using Commonsense full-range drivers, 15" Classic Alnico Audio Nirvana and love them. I have had mines for 9 months now and they are a beautiful and engaging speaker.

Wig

Thanks boys for your input.
Awesome enclosure congratulations.

nature boy · « **Reply #38 on:** 21 Jan 2020, 06:03 pm »

Quote from: Wind Chaser on 21 Jan 2020, 05:31 pm

NB,

How far back is the listening position from the drivers to the ears? With the drivers that low to the floor do you get the sense that the higher frequencies are somewhat attenuated?

WC,

My listening position is ~8' from the speakers. I hear no attenuation or exaggerated higher frequencies from the drivers due to the low driver position. I also heard these F-15 drivers in taller, similar barrel shaped OB design (Decware Zen OB's) at Decfest in October, 2019. These Decware OB's were not only larger & wider but hardwood panels were thicker at 2".

The larger baffles had slightly tighter bass notes and a taller soundstage image. I did not hear a difference in treble response between the two in a carpeted room. The larger, much heavier Decware F-15 offering are priced substantially higher (4-5X) than the Caintuck Audio baffles. I opted for the Caintucks because they lthey delivered ~95% of the performance of the larger ones, IMHO.

NB

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #39 on:** 21 Jan 2020, 06:28 pm »

My understanding is they float the images above the speakers, which is pretty interesting especially if you can be only 8’ back from the drivers. I think I’d still be inclined have them on a baffle closer to ear level at the expense of some bass. Years ago when I was experimenting with the Visaton B200 I mounted two drivers on each baffle, one at ear level and the other down low driven with a plate amp for bass reinforcement. It seemed to work quite well with the 8” drivers.

Still I’d like to hear the 15” drivers in the Betsy baffle arrangement as illustrated above. So you don’t feel the need for a tweeter and you don’t perceive the soundstage as being too low?