M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction

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harley.guy07

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #40 on: 11 Jul 2019, 04:30 am »
Clayton mentioned that in his opening post

"Spatial customers can contact me regarding M3 and M4 trade-in pricing."

Sorry must have missed that looking at the pictures and drooling!!!! :lol:

Vinnie R.

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #41 on: 11 Jul 2019, 04:41 am »
Congratulations, Clayton - the new M and X Series designs look amazing!  I love to see how they have
evolved over the last few years and how you keep pushing forward with innovative designs (and now your own OB woofers!).

Wishing you much continued success in getting them into production, and beyond.

I can't wait to hear them!  :beer:

Vinnie

brj

Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #42 on: 11 Jul 2019, 03:10 pm »
Looks like some nice updates, Clayton!  Perhaps we'll get to see them and their new X cousins at RMAF?

One question - just how rugged is the dome tweeter?  Domes aren't typically as fragile as ribbon tweeters, I realize, but I'm still a bit surprised that there isn't a cap in place to protect the dome against DC on the line, etc..  You never know what those crazy users are going to do once you release your design into the wild!  :lol:

(Stepping up to the Jupiter cap that I currently use on the compression driver tweeters of my active speakers was not inexpensive, and it's physically large to boot, so I certainly understand the appeal of avoiding the use of such a cap if you can.  But given that even with the caps, my previous - highly reputable - amps still caused a bit of a pop on turn-on out of the tweeters, I'd be quite cautious about not having the protection.)

SnowPuppy77

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #43 on: 11 Jul 2019, 03:41 pm »
Congratulations, Clayton - the new M and X Series designs look amazing!  I love to see how they have
evolved over the last few years and how you keep pushing forward with innovative designs (and now your own OB woofers!).

Wishing you much continued success in getting them into production, and beyond.

I can't wait to hear them!  :beer:

Vinnie

I see you are exhibiting at RMAF.  Will make a point to drop by and see you.  Hope you are showing a pair of Clayton's speakers for selfish reasons as I want to hear one of these new ones on excellent gear.  Either way look forward to hearing your gear.

yakbob

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #44 on: 12 Jul 2019, 10:53 am »
Clayton, I had called you earlier in the week with a bunch of questions on the new M3 Sapphire. I appreciate the time and detail you went into in answering them. I had a couple more questions that I thought I'd post here so everyone can benefit from your knowledge.

Please keep in mind, I know zilch about speaker design.😁

The placement of the tweeter in the current M3 (which I absolutely love), seems like it would provide a sort of time alignment (set back behind the top woofer). Maybe this is less important in open baffle designs, but does the face mounted mid-tweeter present a different presentation due to its location on the face?

BRJ raises a good question on the protection of the mid-tweeter. I currently use a 12v trigger to turn on my amp when my pre is turned on, unfortunately there is no delay in trigger action so I do get a turn-on "pop". Would this be a problem with the ceramic/sapphire dome?

When we spoke, you mentioned that the new design should require less toe in. I currently run my m3s with quite a bit so the drivers are aimed at my head, probably due to the directivity of the design. This creates a nice albeit small sweet spot. I would think the new design to have a wider sweet spot, since it's not as the upper/Mid is not a directed design?

Lastly (Probably a stupid question) would you be able to describe the overall sonic differences between the M3 and new Sapphire M3? I find the current model to provide an up close and intimate sound with just hint of warmth that isn't fatiguing. Does the ceramic driver impart a sound that is descibable?

Thanks for any knowledge you can share.



Spatial Audio

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 215
Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #45 on: 12 Jul 2019, 05:52 pm »
Looks like some nice updates, Clayton!  Perhaps we'll get to see them and their new X cousins at RMAF?

One question - just how rugged is the dome tweeter?  Domes aren't typically as fragile as ribbon tweeters, I realize, but I'm still a bit surprised that there isn't a cap in place to protect the dome against DC on the line, etc..  You never know what those crazy users are going to do once you release your design into the wild!  :lol:

(Stepping up to the Jupiter cap that I currently use on the compression driver tweeters of my active speakers was not inexpensive, and it's physically large to boot, so I certainly understand the appeal of avoiding the use of such a cap if you can.  But given that even with the caps, my previous - highly reputable - amps still caused a bit of a pop on turn-on out of the tweeters, I'd be quite cautious about not having the protection.)

The Sapphire dome driver is robust because of the design which uses a large dome (large voice coil), large surround and massive heat sinks on the rear. We have not had any failures or even distress during testing and listening sessions, so I don't have any concerns. The speaker is designed for music payback as opposed to home theater applications, where high SPLs and demanding program material might preclude it from being the best choice.

Clayton


Kaakatus

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #46 on: 14 Jul 2019, 10:56 am »
Hi Clayton!

The new M3 looks really cool. I wonder if the European partner will have it in it's selection?

One thing came into my mind when looking the specs. How is the directivity between 15" element and the small dome? I assume that at 500hz the 15" woofer's directivity is quite high but dome without waveguide is spreading sound more on those frequencies?

br,
Juha Eskola, happy owner of M3 TM

Don_S

Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #47 on: 17 Jul 2019, 05:01 pm »
I am having difficulty understanding how a passive driver works in an OB application.  :scratch:

Spatial Audio

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #48 on: 17 Jul 2019, 05:11 pm »
I am having difficulty understanding how a passive driver works in an OB application.  :scratch:

I think you are confusing a passively driven (not powered) woofer with a passive radiator used in some box designs. We are talking about non-powered woofers such as the M3/M5 models. Some of our models have built-in amplifiers for the bass range, such as the X3/X5.

Clayton

Don_S

Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #49 on: 17 Jul 2019, 05:18 pm »
I think you are confusing a passively driven (not powered) woofer with a passive radiator used in some box designs. We are talking about non-powered woofers such as the M3/M5 models. Some of our models have built-in amplifiers for the bass range, such as the X3/X5.

Clayton

Thanks Clayton but I am still confused.  I should have been more clear. I thought one of the woofers in the M3 Sapphire was not connected to an amplifier. I am not sure where I got that idea.

I understand passive (powered by an external amplifier) vs active (amplification is built into the speaker system).

kheidenr

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #50 on: 17 Jul 2019, 05:22 pm »
M3 is a passively (externally) powered speaker.  Both of the M3 woofers are connected to the external amplifer.

Don_S

Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #51 on: 17 Jul 2019, 05:27 pm »
M3 is a passively (externally) powered speaker.  Both of the M3 woofers are connected to the external amplifer.

Thanks, I do not know how I ran off the rails since the concept never made sense to me. My apologies for the confusion. This from Post #11 from Clayton (emphasis added).

"There is one inductor in series with the woofer on the M5. The M3 Sapphire has one inductor for each woofer. The lower woofer of the M3 is just that, its not a passive radiator. "

Birdbrain

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #52 on: 17 Jul 2019, 07:26 pm »
Are the M3 Triode Masters a thing of the past? That would be a shame.

musicdre

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  • diggin' vinyl and tubes.
Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #53 on: 18 Jul 2019, 05:33 pm »
Are the M3 Triode Masters a thing of the past? That would be a shame.

indeed it would.  the triode master is the speaker i am saving up for    :o

MONKEYWICKEDMONKEY

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #54 on: 22 Jul 2019, 07:25 pm »
Looks like the M3 Sapphire only comes in wood veneers. Any chance a white option may be offered or available as an option?

Tom419

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #55 on: 23 Jul 2019, 02:22 am »
 MONKEY  On page one Clayton replied to my same question. They also come in white add black which is good!

MONKEYWICKEDMONKEY

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #56 on: 23 Jul 2019, 05:31 am »
MONKEY  On page one Clayton replied to my same question. They also come in white add black which is good!

Saw that but website tells a different story.

http://www.spatialaudio.us/store/m3-sapphire

sumoking

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #57 on: 23 Jul 2019, 05:44 am »
It’s possible it could be a special order in white or black.
I’m sure Clayton will respond as to what’s possible.

md92468

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #58 on: 27 Jul 2019, 11:31 pm »
Hey Clayton - I hope you're well. Love the direction you've taken with the M5 Sapphire. Any plans to offer a 12" baby brother for the apartment dwellers among us?

jachinboazicus

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Re: M5 Sapphire - All new M design introduction
« Reply #59 on: 29 Jul 2019, 10:16 pm »
I'm only 6 months into my M3TM's, but the Sapphire tweak with the higher tweeter is really interesting/tempting. I had my M3 Turbo S's for a couple years before upgrading to the TM, and the improvement was huge.

Clayton, I'd love to hear your comparison of the M3TM vs the M3 Sapphire. What improvements/differences can we expect?

I'll definitely be in touch soon about the potential upgrade.

Bummed that you couldn't make it out to the Built to Spill show last weekend.