[JLM]

Why didn't Emotiva choose to put an RCA connector on the back of this unit?

Because:

1.) Balanced is better   ; and

2.) According to the linked review they included a 1/4 inch to RCA adapter if you can't handle balanced.

[Letitroll98]

Why didn't Emotiva choose to put an RCA connector on the back of this unit?

They don't manufacture their amps, they have manufacturers put the Emotiva name on the front.  These monoblocks are obviously designed for professional use by somebody and rebranded, thus no choice for RCA sockets.  Emotiva used to source their amps from ATI, but have branched out in more recent years.  This doesn't mean they're bad sounding, I've heard great reviews about many of their products, but they won't have a house sound like a company with one designer or design team.

[timind]

I went to the ICEpower web site to check the module. The 300ASC module was renamed 300AS1 a few years ago. Odd that Emotiva isn't using the current nomenclature from ICE.

As for the no RCA jack, it seems easy enough to spec a jack and a switch into the build. How much could that add to the build cost?

[poseidonsvoice]

Emotiva has introduced a new monoblock, balanced amp using the asc300 module. $299 each, pretty reasonable.

https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/amplifier/power-amplifier/emotiva-pa-1-balanced-class-d-power-amplifier-review/

Very nice find Fred. So much more reasonable than the Jeff Rowland version, but then again, Jeff Rowland should have named his amp with this series of B&O modules, "Stealth" cause that definitely looks stealthy. But I choked when I thought I was paying about $1600 just for a chassis when the module is about $300 or so (retail is around $2K). It must be the diy'er in me.

That's a pretty high amount of voltage gain for an amplifier. 28dB. Doesn't need a preamp in virtually any system. One also has to be careful with DACs that have digital volume controls and medium to high output voltages (2V RMS and higher) since you will be attenuating the digital volume control so much since the intrinsic amp gain is so high.

Let's do the math. 140 watts into 8 ohms is about 33.4V RMS. The input voltage (or input sensitivity if you will) to reach 33.4V RMS in the setting of a 28dB gain amplifier is about 1.33V RMS. That's the input sensitivity if you want to reach 140 watts of power at 8 ohms. If you want just 1 watt of power (2.83V RMS into 8 ohms), the input sensitivity is dramatically less (about 0.1 volts or 100 mV). Now think about that for a moment and pause. You can see that the A weighted signal to noise ratio at 1 watt and 140 watts is decent but not great imho. This could be improved by decreasing the overall gain to something reasonable like 20dB overall. But I am sure for this design the open loop gain needs to be high, as we need to apply a generous amount of feedback to ensure lower distortion, and low output impedance, blah, blah, blah...

Of course I would love to see critical measurements done on the unit using an Audio Precision analyzer or equivalent. I am sure Amir will get a pair somehow...

It's also 3 pounds which is great and light. On the one hand that's a good thing. On the other hand, if you've got some bulky AC power cords, interconnects (preferably XLRs!) and speaker cables, the chassis might move around a bit. Put a weight on top to keep it down I guess.

Hard to criticize at $299.

Thanks,
Anand.

[tubesguy2]

I've had some Emotiva amps here (for an LX Mini system) and I can tell you that high gain (28 or more) is an Emotiva corporate choice. I agree that it is not a great choice for some, and that a gain of 20 would be more sensible for many.

[Doublej]

I've had some Emotiva amps here (for an LX Mini system) and I can tell you that high gain (28 or more) is an Emotiva corporate choice. I agree that it is not a great choice for some, and that a gain of 20 would be more sensible for many.

With their 300AS1 amp everything is provided to them. So either the manufacturer has set the gain high or Emotiva has programmed it to a high level. If it's the latter one might be able to lower it with the proper cable and software?

[fredgarvin]

Very nice find Fred. So much more reasonable than the Jeff Rowland version, but then again, Jeff Rowland should have named his amp with this series of B&O modules, "Stealth" cause that definitely looks stealthy. But I choked when I thought I was paying about $1600 just for a chassis when the module is about $300 or so (retail is around $2K). It must be the diy'er in me.

That's a pretty high amount of voltage gain for an amplifier. 28dB. Doesn't need a preamp in virtually any system. One also has to be careful with DACs that have digital volume controls and medium to high output voltages (2V RMS and higher) since you will be attenuating the digital volume control so much since the intrinsic amp gain is so high.

Let's do the math. 140 watts into 8 ohms is about 33.4V RMS. The input voltage (or input sensitivity if you will) to reach 33.4V RMS in the setting of a 28dB gain amplifier is about 1.33V RMS. That's the input sensitivity if you want to reach 140 watts of power at 8 ohms. If you want just 1 watt of power, the input sensitivity is dramatically less. Now think about that for a moment and pause. You can see that the A weighted signal to noise ratio at 1 watt and 140 watts is decent but not great imho. This could be improved by decreasing the overall gain to something reasonable like 20dB overall. But I am sure for this design the open loop gain needs to be high, as we need to apply a generous amount of feedback to ensure lower distortion, and low output impedance, blah, blah, blah...

Of course I would love to see critical measurements done on the unit using an Audio Precision analyzer or equivalent. I am sure Amir will get a pair somehow...

It's also 3 pounds which is great and light. On the one hand that's a good thing. On the other hand, if you've got some bulky AC power cords, interconnects (preferably XLRs!) and speaker cables, the chassis might move around a bit. Put a weight on top to keep it down I guess.

Hard to criticize at $299.

Thanks,
Anand.

I wonder if the gain is one reason some manufacturers use an input buffer in their Ice designs?

[poseidonsvoice]

I wonder if the gain is one reason some manufacturers use an input buffer in their Ice designs?

With their 300AS1 amp everything is provided to them. So either the manufacturer has set the gain high or Emotiva has programmed it to a high level. If it's the latter one might be able to lower it with the proper cable and software?

This isn’t a program issue.

And Fred, perhaps. Either a 0dB buffer or -3 to -6 dB buffers.

The actual gain I believe is intrinsic to the ICE module and was a design choice by ICE, and perhaps Emotiva custom ordered it for 28dB gain, perhaps not (I don’t have the measurements). Ordinarily these ICE modules are 26dB gain.

But whether it is 26 or 28 dB, my opinion is that for an amp that only puts out 140watts/ch, very high gain settings affects the SNR in a negative way. Even the 1200AS is 26dB gain which is quite reasonable and normal and that amp is 600 watts/8 ohms and 1200 watts/4 ohms!

Again it’s not impossible to design an amp that is 26dB gain AND low noise. There are many examples of such, like NCore, DAC, etc...

Anyway. It seems that reviewers like it and it is certainly inexpensive!

Carry on folks! Sorry for the intrusion!

Best,
Anand.

[OzarkTom]

 

A lot of Emotiva on Amazon, but no Stealths.

[poseidonsvoice]

A lot of Emotiva on Amazon, but no Stealths.

I found it!

Here it is 

https://emotiva.com/products/pa-1

Best,
Anand.

[Doublej]

Anand,

I don't consider your comments an intrusion but rather an education.

[maty]

I just read it:

https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/speaker/bookshelf/klipsch-rp-600m-loudspeaker-review/

The little Klipsch speakers had a particular affinity for the Emotiva PA-1 class-D mono-block amplifiers. These amps maximized the depth and detail that the speakers are capable of.

I initially listened to these speakers with my Arcam AVR-550 receiver. Now the Arcam is one of the very best-sounding AV receivers in my experience, but when I switched from the Arcam to the separate stereo components, the difference was jaw-dropping.

https://emotiva.com/products/pa-1

https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/amplifier/power-amplifier/emotiva-pa-1-balanced-class-d-power-amplifier-review/

[poseidonsvoice]

Anand,

I don't consider your comments an intrusion but rather an education.

 

Best,
Anand.