Ethan Winer Null Test

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Steve

Re: Ethan Winer Null Test
« Reply #60 on: 21 Nov 2018, 06:37 pm »
Years ago Hafler built an amplifier, the XL 280 that they claimed passed a null test from 20 to 20K Hz.

Our investigation showed that they had added a trimpot that flattened the frequency response at the very high end of its range.  However they did this by providing a bit of feed forward compensation that made the measured high end appear flat while adding a significant very high frequency resonate peak centered around 40K Hz.

This made the amp susceptable to out of band HF garbage such as cartridge mis-tracking, out of band distortion products from equipment ahead in the chain, etc.  The results was a unit that measured really good but sounded bright.

Passing a null test only measured in the audio range is not a useful criteria for perfect performance.

Frank

Thanks for that information Frank, and for also noticing the null tester's frequency response wall/filter and its
manipulation of the signal. Rise time, of course, being altered by the frequency response restriction.

Cheers and great Thanksgiving.

steve
« Last Edit: 21 Nov 2018, 09:29 pm by Steve »

timbley

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Re: Ethan Winer Null Test
« Reply #61 on: 9 Dec 2018, 08:25 am »
It may be difficult to pull off, but I think the place to do a null test like this is at the speaker level, recording the speaker playing a specific track with one cable hooked up, and then again with another cable hooked up, or maybe a different dac or whatever. This would test the cable's interaction with the complete system. As long as we were careful not to accidentally nudge the microphones or speaker position, I'll bet we could tell within 0.1 decibel if there were any actual spectral shift in the output.
If it's less than that, at least it gives us an idea of what level of subtlety we are dealing with. Even if there's no measurable spectral shift but a slight change in overall gain that could be telling. 

GRACE RUBY

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Re: Ethan Winer Null Test
« Reply #62 on: 19 Jan 2019, 03:01 am »
Nothing personal meant, I think everyone here values your contributions to the site.  And I do think we'll be educated, once again, but it won't be illustrative of anything but our differences.  I have great faith in the decorum and character of our membership that allows these cable debates to not devolve into personal attacks, however they are never anything but circular arguments.

Letitroll 
Zero exaggeration
Above is one of the best constructed paragraphs i have ever read in my life, and i study Thom. Jefferson all the time.

GRACE RUBY

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  • Posts: 187
Re: Ethan Winer Null Test
« Reply #63 on: 19 Jan 2019, 11:07 pm »
WOW man
earlier  back in this thread I complimented a MOD, for a exquisite comment they made on the useless-ness
and futility of ironing out certain audio debates on sound and/vs measurement of audio potential.
It was a lot to say, but said in a small space, and not with out some poetic forgiveness to all involved.

At that time I had not yet watched the "Null Test" which i just viewed and could not get thru more then 8 mins of.

It becomes most clear to me that it is most possible to Channel Water, thru boxes, pipes, ravines, with a almost, but never wholly predictable out come. but with the infinite quality's of water and all the things that effect it, which science now recognizes as one of the most complex and misunderstood substances on earth, its almost impossible to predict weither if at the end of that journey, you throw a cup of that water on the frozen ground ..........you will get beautiful lace like frozen crystals or dead black ice.

What even the UK's premier White Paper physical sciences magazine "Nature" cautiously but wholly admitted to- is the quality of that water is/will depend on,,,,drum roll please - 

The natures of the people standing around watching it.

Any one wanting to understand this fact may pursue this subject on their own, I take no great pleasure in debated this stuff, or at least don't anymore, as I find the same sensitivity that gives rise in me to differentials of wire sounds also inclines me to shy from combative exercises in trying to explain
"Colors in Numbers".

Ladies and Gentleman, I lay out this statement for us all, it's a poetry thing, and weither in delusion
or experiential fact of joy, The proof is in the pudding that, one side of this sound observation group is much more tolerant then, and of the other, I must wonder what it is the more tolerant side is hearing that gives them all the more patience.   

  GR
       

thyname

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Re: Ethan Winer Null Test
« Reply #64 on: 24 Mar 2019, 10:38 pm »
Ethan Winer is an imbecile to put it mildly, laughing stock in the audio circles, and can’t fathom why would anyone take him seriously