Dynavector XX-2 MkII, riding too low?

sunnydaze · « **on:** 25 Oct 2018, 01:57 pm »

When I lower it onto the record surface the cartridge body is very close to the LP......only a tiny crack of daylight.....maybe a mm or two of clearance. Is this normal? Is the suspension collapsed?

(Tonearm is level to LP and VTF is 2.0g)

TIA for the help.

dminches · « **Reply #1 on:** 25 Oct 2018, 06:19 pm »

Can you post a picture? I have mine mounting on my Denon DP-59L so I can compare.

toocool4 · « **Reply #2 on:** 25 Oct 2018, 06:37 pm »

From what you describe sounds like it’s collapsing on itself, how old is it?
Sounds like you need a new cartridge or a re-build on that cartridge.

Yes a picture would help.

2bigears · « **Reply #3 on:** 25 Oct 2018, 06:50 pm »

I love that cart. Have one that needs retip. Sounds like yours needs a tune-up for sure.

JakeJ · « **Reply #4 on:** 25 Oct 2018, 06:53 pm »

I know this is a silly question but is Vertical Tracking Angle correct? Agree that we need a pic, if you can, of the situation. I currently have a KARAT 17DIII mounted and Dynavector does use shorter than normal cantilevers so they do sit closer to the record surface. I'll check mine when I get home however that will be after 9:30 PM ET.

My preliminary dart-throw is presently leaning towards the collapsed suspension.

sunnydaze · « **Reply #5 on:** 25 Oct 2018, 07:23 pm »

Camera on my phone is probably too crap to get that kind of pic clarity. I'll try.

VTA: Jelco 750E arm is parallel to record surface.

I just took cart off the arm and measured it with my calipers. Best I can tell, diamond is about 2mm below cartridge body. Once tracking force is applied, that distance is less. So yeah.....definitely less than 2mm clearance when record is playing.

Jake: I also have the 17D2 mk2 with the 1.7mm long cantilever. Bitch to see and setup! XX-2 catilever is a different animal. One reviewer described it as taking up 2 time zones.

Thanks for all the helpful input. Keep it coming.

sunnydaze · « **Reply #6 on:** 25 Oct 2018, 11:42 pm »

Best I can do. Aimed bright light at it and placed a white index card behind to help the visual.

Couple more in my Gallery:

https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=gallery;area=browse;album=28086

dminches · « **Reply #7 on:** 25 Oct 2018, 11:44 pm »

It is definitely riding lower than mine. What VTF are you using? How old is the cartridge.

audio.bill · « **Reply #8 on:** 25 Oct 2018, 11:55 pm »

From that picture it looks like the arm is set too low (rear of cartridge too low), but it could just be the angle and parallax.

sunnydaze · « **Reply #9 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 12:04 am »

Quote from: dminches on 25 Oct 2018, 11:44 pm

It is definitely riding lower than mine. What VTF are you using? How old is the cartridge.

I don't know actual age -- bought it on AG 2 yrs ago from original owner. He described it as exc cond, about 200 hrs use. I have put less than 50 hrs on it. Seller has 113 completed txn on AG with 100% positive feedback.

VTF is exactly 2.0 grams.

sunnydaze · « **Reply #10 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 12:27 am »

Quote from: audio.bill on 25 Oct 2018, 11:55 pm

From that picture it looks like the arm is set too low (rear of cartridge too low), but it could just be the angle and parallax.

Using a lined index card, arm tube is basically parallel to platter.

dminches · « **Reply #11 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 02:22 am »

Am I correct in assuming this is a new issue or is it possible that you just noticed it?

sunnydaze · « **Reply #12 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 04:02 am »

Quote from: dminches on 26 Oct 2018, 02:22 am

Am I correct in assuming this is a new issue or is it possible that you just noticed it?

Since purchase it's been in storage past coupla years, didn't really use it, been messing with other carts. Only recently I've installed and started listening to it. Last night I gave it a good close eyeball for the first time only because when dry brushing the stylus I was having trouble locating it d/t how tight it was on cart body. Additionally, it just didn't sound right.

sunnydaze · « **Reply #13 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 04:07 am »

Quote from: audio.bill on 25 Oct 2018, 11:55 pm

From that picture it looks like the arm is set too low (rear of cartridge too low), but it could just be the angle and parallax.

Looks that way to me too when I get down low to view it, despite the lined index card showing arm parallel to platter.

Just raised rear of arm a bit. Arm tube still looks parallel on the index card, and clearance under cart now looks a bit better. At least the gap is even, front vs rear of cart body.

As a plus, it sounds better too. Much better! Thanks Bill. And thanks to everyone else for taking the time to give good input.

Johnny2Bad · « **Reply #14 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 05:34 am »

VTA looks a bit off, should maybe be higher at the tonearm base, but its not terrible.
How old is the cartridge, and what environment has it been in? UV light, and airborne contaminants (sulphurs from smog, contaminants from local industry, being close to the sea, etc) will all attack the synthetic or natural rubbers that hold the cantilever in place (some cartridges also have some form of support besides the rubber). 20 years out of the case it came in could be enough, and if you're in LA, a decade might be enough.

As I understand it, replacing the suspension is less expensive than a retip. Not everyone offers it. For such a good cartridge, I think sending it out for repair or retip is certainly cost-effective and justifiable.

I have seen poorly mounted cartridges (bad VTA angle) rub the body on the LP, so yours is not the worst I've seen, but I would at least have it checked out if you can afford it (or when you can afford it) if it were me, and if you can give it a better VTAngle, do so. It should sound better as a bonus.

toocool4 · « **Reply #15 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 07:16 am »

It should sound better after you raised it up, looking at your first picture I would say the SRA is way off. Your SRA should be about 92 degrees. Having the arm parallel to the record surface does not always give you the correct SRA depending on how the cantilever was mounted in the cartridge body.

bacobits1 · « **Reply #16 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 11:33 am »

You can't tell from either pict. on VTA. In defense of John, he has been doing this for 30+ years he knows what he's doing on setup. He's a geezer like me.

Looks like the suspension wire or surround is going even if it plays maybe not correctly. I have read in the past some Dynavectors have had that problem.

toocool4 · « **Reply #17 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 12:19 pm »

Yes you may be correct about the pics and i am not questioning his years of setting up, just saying the SRA looks off to me.

Most people think having the arm parallel to the platter surface is it, it’s just a starting point. Having a correct SRA is more important than having the arm parallel. If you have an arm that you can adjust on the fly really helps you experiment as you can hear what is going on as you adjust. Sometimes the arm may end up in a funny angle to achieve the correct SRA, it all depends how the tip / cantilever has been mounted in the cartridge body. It's not unusual for it to be off, even the azimuth can be off too.

JakeJ · « **Reply #18 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 01:24 pm »

I looked at my DV and it is riding higher than yours. One possibility is that the suspension has gone bad, not due to age but due to chemical exposure from cleaners used by the PO.

Just thinking out loud.

PierreB · « **Reply #19 on:** 26 Oct 2018, 01:44 pm »

If it can help, I find this photo.