LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?

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dspringham

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LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« on: 26 Mar 2018, 10:57 pm »
Just wondering how many LIO users are using the internal Mosfet amp versus an external amp utilizing the LIO as a Pre.

I just connected my LIO with newly installed DHT with my Harbeth 40.1's and have tried a couple of external power amps. In the case of both externals I seem to prefer the built in LIO stage. Apart from less power overhead, the on-board amp just feels more transparent with all the full and robust tonal qualities I value.

My external amp comparisons are no slouches... Rogue Audio Stereo 100 (with KT 120 o/p tubes) and a pair of NORD Acoustics One UP Hypex nCore monoblocks with custom input buffers.

Of course the Rogue has some of that tube "air" and maybe a bit more weight at the cost of 4 x KT 120's dissipating all that heat.

The NORD's are mostly neutral (with Sonic Imagery op amps), run cool and have 10X's the power available but still require two good quality external power cords along with interconnects. They do however, convey the qualities of the DHT pre stage very well without adding any sonic artifacts of their own.

As I said, within their respective power limits I prefer the direct signal path with the LIO running full integrated in spite of the fact that the Harbeths are not overly efficient. They are however an easy load and in a somewhat near-field position and at the lower SPL's I listen at, the internal amp seems to do just fine. No doubt, the Ultra Capacitor supply is performing it's magic.

What say you???

Regards,
Dave






TomS

Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #1 on: 26 Mar 2018, 11:01 pm »
I ran mine with the internal amp and preferred it, even on power hungry speakers (TAD Evolution Ones) in a large space. One has to overlook the fact that it's just a few watts, doesn't measure particularly well on a bench, but there is something about the integration and innovative power supply that just seem to work  :thumb:

dspringham

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #2 on: 20 Apr 2018, 09:45 pm »
Wow, pretty quiet here on the VR circle.

Just to add to my original post (and answer my own question), I have recently acquired a JOB 225 amplifier and can report that it is an OUTSTANDING performer fronted my the LIO DHT.

There was some questions with regards to the high input sensitivity with this amplifier and the accompanying concerns over low volume control range, noise etc. I'm happy to report that none of these concerns have been a factor. Thanks to the ultra-quiet operation of Vinnies's circuit I hear no extraneous noises, tube rush or hum at within inches of the Harbeth drivers. I'm sure that the relatively lower efficiency of the big Harbeths has something to do with this. Everything is dead quiet. The volume control range is perfect, even though I listen at relatively low SPL's.

Also, there was some trepidation regarding the direct-coupling of the JOB circuit but Vinnie confirmed that the LIO line outs are capacitor coupled therefor no issues at all with turn-on/off thump (LIO mute circuit is great).

The the LIO DHT and JOB into he Harbeths I'm getting the best sound I have ever had in my room. The JOB has displaced my Rogue Stereo 100 and NORD Acoustics One UP NC500 mono's. The speed of the JOB perfectly compliments the slightly layed-back nature of the 40.1's and creates a 3D layered presentation and natural tone like I've never had before.

With the right speakers (Harbeth) I highly recommend the JOB 225 as an external partner with the LIO DHT. Ohhhh mama!



Bones13

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #3 on: 21 Apr 2018, 02:31 pm »
Planning on getting a DHT LIO a bit later this year. (Hoping my finances survive my daughter’s wedding) I will be using a pair of McIntosh MC60 monoblocs that are being reconditioned right now. I have Zu Audio Druid V speaker with an Undertone sub from Zu for speakers.

Vinnie R.

Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #4 on: 21 Apr 2018, 09:20 pm »
Just to add to my original post (and answer my own question), I have recently acquired a JOB 225 amplifier and can report that it is an OUTSTANDING performer fronted my the LIO DHT.
With the right speakers (Harbeth) I highly recommend the JOB 225 as an external partner with the LIO DHT. Ohhhh mama!

Hi dspringham,

Glad the Job is doing a fine job with the LIO DHT PRE and your Harbeth 40.1's!   :thumb:

Quote from: Bones13
Planning on getting a DHT LIO a bit later this year. (Hoping my finances survive my daughter’s wedding) I will be using a pair of McIntosh MC60 monoblocs that are being reconditioned right now. I have Zu Audio Druid V speaker with an Undertone sub from Zu for speakers.

Hi Bones13,

Congratulations to your daughter! (sorry for your wallet  :oops:).  I've heard the LIO Integrated driving the Zu Druid V's when they came out - it made for an excellent pairing, and I"m sure LIO would also be a nice match as a preamp into the MC60's and then into the Druids. 

Vinnie

dspringham

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #5 on: 21 Apr 2018, 10:34 pm »
Thanks Vinnie,

Now all I need is a pair of KR PX4's...

czubero

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #6 on: 22 Apr 2018, 12:02 am »
Hi dspringham,

I am selling a new matched pair in audiogon, in case you are interested.

dspringham

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #7 on: 22 Apr 2018, 04:24 pm »
czubero,

Sent you a pm.

czubero

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #8 on: 23 Apr 2018, 01:07 am »
Dave,

It's been a great placer talking to you this afternoon. I have read your first post and in my experience I feed my T+A PA 3100 HV with the variable RCA output from the LIO (Volume at 58), It is the best sound I got out of the LIO, even better than using the variable LIO XLR. This way the DHT tubes are in the signal path.

Best,
Carlos

gene9p

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #9 on: 6 Jul 2018, 01:53 pm »
I have an LIO pre amp en-route without the Mosfet that I plan to use with my Macintosh MC152 amp. I probably should have included it as I am using Harbeth C7's to compare the sound difference. Perhaps down the road a bit once I check it out with my existing separates I might order one. I have a lot of great gear and it would be nice to simplify things but one step at a time. Vinnie made me an outstanding offer on a trade in that he could have made even better by adding more modules. If the LIO does for me in my home as it did when I first heard it at the audio show in NY I will then consider trying it with additional components. Monday's arrival date get can't get here soon enough!!   :D

gene9p

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #10 on: 9 Jul 2018, 10:58 pm »
the LIO pre amp arrived and is singing, minus the stock tubes for some EH ones that came originally with my phono stage . I am using the 12v trigger from my Krell CD to activate the Mac amp. First impressions are top notch sound and combo.


Yomaha

Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #11 on: 17 Jan 2020, 07:49 pm »
Anyone tried a Firstwatt SIT-3 as an external power amp?

coldfogey

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #12 on: 18 Jan 2020, 05:07 pm »
 
 I have been using a Vision SET 120 Amp from VanAlstine for about 6 months .  It is 60 watts per channel into 8 ohms and 120 into 4 ohms.
The SET stands for Single  Ended Transistor.  It is a MOSFET  Amp.  The price is  $899.00 and has a 30 day home trial.  That is not a typo.
I am using it with my LIO/DHT  and could not be more pleased.  It really plays way above its price point.

gene9p

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #13 on: 18 Jan 2020, 08:07 pm »
does it have a 12v trigger or do you have to manually turn the amp off and on?  :D

coldfogey

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #14 on: 18 Jan 2020, 10:52 pm »


  It has a power switch.

Yomaha

Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #15 on: 10 May 2020, 02:40 am »

 I have been using a Vision SET 120 Amp from VanAlstine for about 6 months .  It is 60 watts per channel into 8 ohms and 120 into 4 ohms.
The SET stands for Single  Ended Transistor.  It is a MOSFET  Amp.  The price is  $899.00 and has a 30 day home trial.  That is not a typo.
I am using it with my LIO/DHT  and could not be more pleased.  It really plays way above its price point.

I’ve been around the bloc several times with Van Alstine gear and agree that it is very well built and excellent sonic value, no question.

Any further listening impressions from others with external amps?  As posted above, I’ve been curious about the First Watt SIT-3. Saw recent listing for a 2018 used one above original msrp. Hmm

gene9p

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #16 on: 10 May 2020, 02:58 pm »
I just added a PS Audio Stellar s300 amp. 140 Watts per channel, 8ohms, 300 per channel  , 4ohms ,hand built in Colorado, 12 volt trigger, dual outputs for bi amping, 30 day returns. This is quite an amp for use with the LIO. Great detail and wide soundstage and that extra oomph needed for certain speakers. It was on sale for 1199 shipped, . Exception build quality and great customer service too. I use it for my Bryston speakers where as the mosfet amp works great with my older Snells. The Stellar s300 is very cool running as it is a Class A+D but sounds nothing like any D amp I heard b4. It's thin and easily stackable, fits nicely under my LIO. Right now I am using some Amperex 7308 green label tubes in the LIO and it is a killer  combo with the the s300 amp IMO.

https://www.psaudio.com/products/stellar-s300-power-amplifier/

lancelock

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Re: LIO users - internal Mosfet amp or external?
« Reply #17 on: 19 May 2020, 03:32 am »
I have a new Coda No.8 SS amp to pair with my LIO DHT and it blows away the internal mosfet amp. It’s an amazing amp driving my TAD ME-1 speakers. I have heard the internal amp driving a Harbeths at an audio show and it was very impressive but this a Coda amp with the DHT is unreal.