[macdane]

If the problem is the Hegel's preout is too low, adding gain (preamp) to bring it up to the level needed is no different than having enough gain in the preouts in the first place.

Yep, makes perfect sense. As I said, I just don't know what risks might be involved in potentially overloading those inputs or what warning signs there might be. Obviously, if during the course of nudging the Meier volume control up everything starts to sound like crap, I'd back off.

I do the opposite, I have a preamp that I really like, but with most amps I can hardy use the v/c.
I put a unity gain tube buffer between my 2v CD player and the pre to reduce the output to @1v, more complicated but sounds better to me than just the tube buffer alone and it allows me to turn the preamp v/c up to 40~50 %.

Sounds like a good solution.

Sorry my reply was a bit harsh, I edited it, but it was too late. 

No harm done!

[macdane]

I promised myself that if I touched the system today it would only be to listen, not to mess with anything. So I just tried one little thing, and I'm attaching some photos because you guys wouldn't believe me otherwise.

I tried opnly bafld's suggestion to run the variable line out of the Hegel to an input on the Meier Prehead, then the Prehead's output to the the inputs on the Dayton amps. Not ideal as a long term solution, but I actually started to warm up to the idea of keeping the Prehead around because it's an amazing headphone amp.

Photo 01 shows the purple/gray XLO cable leaving the variable line out of the Hegel.



Photo 02 shows that cable feeding input 1 of the Meier, and right next to it the blue Straightwire leaving the pre-out.



Photo 3 shows the Dayton amp with the blue cable coming into the left input with the amp set to lowpass, mono, and the low pass freq set to the max of 150Hz.



Photo 04 shows the volume control of the Dayton set to max. The light looks reddish but it's blue, and the other Dayton is set up identically.



Finally, Photo 05 shows the Meier set to input 1 with the volume at max.



I should have more bass that I know what to do with, but I still do not have enough to match the output of the Omegas. This just makes no sense to me whatsoever.

Dane

[JLM]

You seem to have narrowed it down to the Hegel variable outputs.  Previous owner may have never used them.  But does seem odd that both channels would go bad.

Again I'd check all of the Hegel's controls, including those accessed from the remote.  And make sure you hear back from the factory (or maybe a Hegel retailer).

[macdane]

You seem to have narrowed it down to the Hegel variable outputs.  Previous owner may have never used them.  But does seem odd that both channels would go bad.

Again I'd check all of the Hegel's controls, including those accessed from the remote.  And make sure you hear back from the factory (or maybe a Hegel retailer).

Agreed. As I said, I don't expect to hear back from Hegel over the weekend but they've been super responsive to the first couple of questions I sent them so I'm hopeful they'll be willing to help. If not, there's a dealer in Denver I just visited a few weeks ago ... I'll give them a call. I'm also reaching out to the guy I bought it from to see what he's willing to share with me.

Meanwhile, there's no shortage of stuff to mess around with. Using the Hegel simply as an integrated amp with a single set of speakers at a time (I definitely want to try the Omegas because they're my first-string players, but also with the Studio IVs because they're much more full-range), I'd like to do some head-to-head comparisons with the Daytons (in mono and/or stereo mode) and my wife's old Luxman receiver. Don't laugh ... I've driven Apogees reasonably well with that thing! Shoot, if I keep the volume down I could also throw the 2A3 amps into the mix.

My suspicions definitely lean toward the Hegel's pre-outs, but I still have some nagging concerns about the amount of bottom end I got from its power amp, so these tests will help pinpoint what's happening.

Thanks for the help thus far!

Dane

[macdane]

I'll apologize in advance if this is putting everyone to sleep, but it's been an interesting journey and I believe this should be the next-to-last update.

Using the MacBook Air and Meridian Explorer as my source, and the Fried Studio IVs as my speakers (because they're more capable of showing changes in the bass and mid-bass), I held a head-to-head competition between the Hegel, a single Dayton amp in stereo mode, and my wife's old Luxman R-113 receiver. I used two tracks as test material, a small jazz combo with prominent acoustic bass to test the mid-bass and an organ piece to test deep bass. Neither of the others should honestly hold a candle to the Hegel ... but they did. In fact, if I had to choose just one of those three to live with, it would be the $150 Dayton amp!

At that point a buddy texted me to say he found instructions in an online manual for a different Hegel amp that performs a factory reset (this is alluded to in the H80 manual, but there are no instructions). I tried it on the H80 and it worked. No the Hegel whips the other two handily, as should be the case.

This still doesn't do me any good unless I can use the Hegel the way I want — with its pre-outs feeding the bridged Daytons to drive the subs while the Hegel's internal amp drives the Omegas — but it's a huge relief. If the sensitivity mismatch between the subs and the Omegas still proves to be too much to overcome, I no longer care why. At least now I can put the thing back on the market with a clear conscience that it's working properly and sounding the way it should.

Dane

[artur9]

Shame the Hegel is giving you so much trouble.  I listened to the H90 the other day and it sounded fantastic.  Its imaging and soundstage were great.  Compared it to a SimAudio 240i and it was no comparison, the SimAudio sounded two-dimensional in comparison.

[macdane]

Shame the Hegel is giving you so much trouble.  I listened to the H90 the other day and it sounded fantastic.  Its imaging and soundstage were great.  Compared it to a SimAudio 240i and it was no comparison, the SimAudio sounded two-dimensional in comparison.

To clarify, since doing the factory reset, the H80 *does* sound fantastic. If my situation only called for driving a single pair of speakers, there's no question I'd be thrilled. I was completely stumped yesterday when I ran through the comparison above. I was putting a modern 75wpc, $2000 integrated amp (that every single reviewer raves about) up against a $150 amp and a 35wpc receiver from the 1980s ... and not finding a clear winner. I have no idea what parameters were out-of-whack or what the reset did, but it transformed the H80 completely.

Going back to the topic of this thread, I need to be able to integrate my (lower sensitivity) subs with my (quite high sensitivity) Omega speakers. I'll test it today and it either works the way I want it to or it doesn't ... I no longer care why. The reason is that I have the ability to go back to the system I was using prior to this adventure, which also sounds wonderful *and* includes a top-notch headphone amp.

One of the things that caused me to rather impulsively order the Hegel in the first place was a recurring problem that I assumed was caused by my tube amps. I kept getting a weird scratchy sound in the right channel that sounded exactly like a tube going bad, but I cycled through all of my tubes and couldn't isolate or eliminate that noise. With the Hegel already on its way here, my daughter accidentally helped me identify the Omega RS5 driver in my right speaker as the culprit. I called Louis at Omega and, even though these speakers are nearly 4 years old, he immediately offered to ship out a replacement driver. Stand-up guy, that Louis. I'll have more praise to heap on him in the near future over on the Omega circle!

I didn't tell this story at the outset of the Hegel saga because things were complicated enough without it. It's worth mentioning it now. The fact that I can keep the 2A3/Omega magic knowing I don't actually have any tube headaches is a big factor here. But yes, the H80 connected to a single set of speakers now sounds just as good as I hoped it would!

Dane