[nickspicks]

Hi there all...
Now that I've got my system where I want it....I think I need to make some changes.


my problem, lack of power.
my setup:

vinnie mod Tosh 3960 (for transport only) >
Sony STR-DA3000ES (using digital inputs only)
Von Schweikert VR4 gen I speakers.

Strong points:
the Sony's DAC is the best sounding piece i've ever heard.  Its like a poor mans EMM labs DAC-6 as it upsamples incoming PCM to DSD.  The amp in the sony also sounds good..so its great as a package, like an awesome DAC with gain.

The VR4's will play *anything* I throw at them.  And for refrigerator sized speakers, they do a marvelous job at dissapearing when the music is playing.

Weak points:
- not much power.  The Sony is rated at 150wpc but that number is bogus.  Sounds like 100w to me.  I routinely have to crank the sony (which doesn't strain too bad when done).  I need more punch out of it, but refuse to use DSP to obtain any extra thump.  No onboard EQ or tone controlls for me.  

- Sonys speaker terminals are garbage, and will break with my ultra-stiff custom cables.

My thoughts:
- add a DIP upsampler and an Apogee Big Ben to obtain the ultimate in signal quality / jitter reduction.  All ready in the works.

- upgrade the signal path of my Sony so that the "pre out" is using top of the line electronics (caps and whatnot) vs. the crap it has now.

- more power.  New amp behind it.  What I like is:  HUGE soundstage and rasor sharp image detail.  I like my sound to be carved...when called for.  Perfect refference quality...what is present on the recording is whats heard, and thats all.  
I like the air to be pressurized like a live concert experience.  I listen to mostly live rock and roll, so I needs that SLAM.
And this is where I would like some help.
Any suggestions?
fwiw, I've got "Manley on the brain"...after having a Stingray for a while i've grown fond of that Manley tube thump...and wonder if their other amps offer that same sound.  Maybe a pair of Snappers? Sure, only 100w, but its tube watts, and i'm confident that it would smoke my 150w of digital power.
But..i'm open to suggestions, so bring them on.

Maybe an older McCormack DNA series amp?  Iv'e had one before..and they have plenty of bass athority, but seemed a little lean in the mids.

one note, I will not give up the Sony as my DAC/preamp combo.  Its soooo good sounding, i'd have to spend a shitload of money to equal it with seperates.
[/b]

[_scotty_]

nickspicks, See if you can borrow or audition one of the latest generation BelCanto power amps. These are Tripath  technology with a power supply.
These amps should give you the clarity and slam you are looking for.
Good Luck, Scotty

[rosconey]

might try a used odyssey strato's with cap upgrade-
and if its not for you ,it will resell for what you paid
if you like you can get it upgraded to extreme

[warnerwh]

I will agree that having a very high current amp will get you where you need. The Stratos with the cap upgrade is good but even more power may be better. I believe Klaus has a new amp coming out with 500wpc in a few weeks for only about 1500(I think). Or there are any number of amps on Agon that have 250wpc or more that may help.  Sounds like you like to crank it up and those speakers need plenty of current.  I tried a Marsh A400 with 200wpc and ended up buying another Parasound HCA 3500 as the Marsh at high levels couldn't control the bass on my VMPS Supertowers.  That extra 150 wpc over the Marsh was the difference.  I think the old McCormick wouldn't be upto the task to be honest. If you crank it much the power gets used up real fast.

[Bemopti123]

such as

The CIA OP CHIP monoblocks....weighting in at 40 Watts, but what are glorious OP Chip, direct wattage that will definetly trump the Sony amplification you have.  Cost:  1K

the CIA Digital monoblocks....weighting in at around 100 watts, but more honest and will easily equal maybe 200 or more Sony watts?  Cost:  1.5K

the DNA s by Steve McCormack might sound lean in the mids, but then, you can deal with this through cabling changes, such as all pure copper wire interconnects.  I have the DNA 225 and it does not sound lean in the mids, maybe due to the cabling and also the choice of speakers, Gershmans, which all add to a more balanced presentation.  This amp has some serious slam in the rhythmic department.  Cost: 3K new, or 1-2K used.  Excellent my any means.

Clayton Class A amps, seem to the amps of the connoiseur, difficult to find used, and for the power ratings, the smallest one at 40 watts, that doubles down continously until 1 OHM?  Cost: 3-4K new, used around 1.5 K, good luck finding one.

Tubes can sound good, but you will get a sort of "slamm" that can sound bloated and out of control...That is the nature of tubes.  I would stick with SS that is well designed.  

On the topic of Odyssey amps, there is a Symphonic Line Kraft (german made amp) that I think pumps out a good 250 watts class A biased that goes for 5K in Audiogon right now.  The Kraft model seems also to be the choice of European connoiseurs when it comes to heavy amplification.  New cost is prohibitive at around 14K or 11K Euros.  

Too many choices, but remember to get the best more powerful watts for the money....The VR4s are quite sensitive, if I am not mistaken.

I think Slamm is a subjective term that might have many variables such as the design of the speakers and also the amps used to drive them.  I never got "slamm" from my speakers unless they were large, with large cone areas and also massive power behind them.