How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.

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maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #60 on: 13 Mar 2018, 02:37 pm »
Talking about capacitors...

Electrolytic capacitors: useful life



and from Diyaudio forums:

[PDF] My_Ref_FE - Tutorial.pdf by ClaveFremen

5.2.7 Audiophile upgrades (best suggested parts)

pages 29, 30, 31 & 32.

Quote
6 - Mundorf MLythic AG in C101, C201

Mundorf AGs are a worthwhile improvement over Vishay/BC PMG-SIs.

Vishay/BC PMG-SI is an excellent base cap, though, and not a problem at all.

What you can expect:

* Blacker background and more contrast/focus

* An higher harmonic content

* Cleaner sound

* Fuller and deeper bass

The change after the upgrade is not small, pretty evident but AGs comes at over 4x the PMG-SI cost.

Is it worth it?

IMHO, absolutely yes

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #61 on: 13 Mar 2018, 03:06 pm »
To finnish about capacitors:

Electrolytic Capacitors Shootout - What Sounds Best for Coupling to Headphones?

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/parts/319979-electrolytic-capacitors-shootout-sounds-coupling-headphones.html

Comparing electrolytic capacitors - May 2008, by Eric Juaneda

http://tech.juaneda.com/en/articles/electrolyticcapacitors.html


and the huge review (to speakers filters) by Tony Gee, a very helpful person.

Capacitor Test

http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Cap.html


********* *********


Off topic

I LOVE the measures/graphs of his DIY Plutone speaker:

http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Plutone.html


There are not resistors in the crossovers!!!!

If my main system room was not kidnapped by TV and family are the ones that I would like to have!

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #62 on: 13 Mar 2018, 07:36 pm »
Off topic again

This vinyl collection (LPx3) sounds GLORIOUS!

Mravinsky, Leningrader P - Tchaikovsky: Symphonies Nos 4, 5 & 6 "Pathetique" (1961) (2017 German pressing)


CD Edition

[Customer Reviews] https://www.amazon.co.uk/Tchaikovsky-Symphonies-Nos-4-Pathetique-Originals/product-reviews/B000E0W24S/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_viewopt_srt?ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews&sortBy=recent&pageNumber=1

With the III and IV of Symphony No 5 I had to stand up. You had to imagine me circling the room moving my arms vigorously as if I were the director. Adrenaline rush.

A little more I get on a tank and invade Europe  :D
« Last Edit: 13 Mar 2018, 08:47 pm by maty »

sts9fan

Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #63 on: 13 Mar 2018, 11:40 pm »
Sound of one audiophile clapping?

Photon46

Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #64 on: 14 Mar 2018, 12:08 am »
Off topic again

This vinyl collection (LPx3) sounds GLORIOUS!

Mravinsky, Leningrader P - Tchaikovsky: Symphonies Nos 4, 5 & 6 "Pathetique" (1961) (2017 German pressing)


CD Edition

[Customer Reviews] https://www.amazon.co.uk/Tchaikovsky-Symphonies-Nos-4-Pathetique-Originals/product-reviews/B000E0W24S/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_viewopt_srt?ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews&sortBy=recent&pageNumber=1

With the III and IV of Symphony No 5 I had to stand up. You had to imagine me circling the room moving my arms vigorously as if I were the director. Adrenaline rush.

A little more I get on a tank and invade Europe  :D

Yes, that is a very fine sounding indeed. I have that set and it's one of my favorites. I also have this release of Mravinsky/Leningrad and the 5th, it is an even better recording!



maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #65 on: 14 Mar 2018, 09:00 am »
This evening I will listen: Mravinsky, Leningrade PO – Tchaikovsky: Symphony No. 6 in B minor, Op. 74 “Pathetique” (1961) (2017 German pressing), is not in the collection LPx3.

I have this version. I will listen again.

Mravinsky, Leningrad PO - Tchaikovsky 5 (1961) (SACD 2012)

Thank you very much for the recommendation.

By the way, I am not an audiophile man but I like to verify for myself what others say works. That is why I bought a second-hand amplifier so I could experiment with what I had read over there and some original tweaks of mine. My problem is that this second system sounds so good that I do not feel the need to spend money on a new one. Maybe in a H2 predominance and the new RME ADI-2 DAC (I suspect that my cheap tweaked ODAC is the last bottleneck but before I want to see the measures/graphs/reviews and not only the writed in the very good manual, very interesting reading).

[PDF] https://www.rme-audio.de/download/adi2dac_e.pdf

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #66 on: 14 Mar 2018, 10:17 am »
I already had the LPx3 collection but 2006 German Pressing. The other is from 2017.

You know, usually the year pressing is important.

Mike B.

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #67 on: 14 Mar 2018, 05:10 pm »
Maty, you offer a lot of good information. Did you include how to check if there is DC on the AC lines? Some of us might have clean AC.

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #68 on: 14 Mar 2018, 05:39 pm »
Internet is full of opinion and more opinion -> noise. The Spanish net is much worse and a lot worse education.

In other forum, talking about the problems of ALL Rega Brio amplifiers I just wrote:

Quote
By the way,

https://www.plitron.com/news/low-noise-toroidal-technology/

[ Over the past 25 years, toroidal transformers have replaced conventional transformers in many applications because, among many other benefits, they are quieter under normal conditions. But, because of the their highly efficient nature, standard toroidal transformers become noisy under adverse line conditions, such as overvoltage and DC offset, (and tend to draw high inrush currents during start-up). With increasingly deteriorating power lines over the years, these adverse conditions are becoming more prevalent. PLITRON LONO™ toroidal transformers suit a variety of applications, but the features of these products are probably best utilized in the demanding Hi-End Audio industry, where growling transformers can represent a huge bear of a problem. ]

You know, DC Blocker :)

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #69 on: 14 Mar 2018, 05:46 pm »
You need an oscilloscope to measure, and it is dangerous.

More easy:

* On the top cover of the amplifier. If you notice that the area that corresponds to the transformer is very hot, you will probably have more voltage in mains or DC.

* Noise, aka buzz, is other symptom. I think only with toroidals.

* Like the RF/EMI on mains, the DC changes during the day. If at night (or weekend or holidays like Christmas... ) the sound is much better, it is another symptom.

Better to look for professional solutions and spend less on super expensive audiophile power cables I think.

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #70 on: 14 Mar 2018, 07:05 pm »
Off topic

I preferred to hear again a recent vinyl rip that I improved after trying different resamplers.

Charles Gross - Windham Hill Artists ‎– Country (An Original Soundtrack Album) 1984

https://www.discogs.com/es/Charles-Gross-Windham-Hill-Artists-Country-An-Original-Soundtrack-Album/release/1653567

the cover is other:



CD Edition

[Customer Reviews] https://www.amazon.com/Country-Original-Soundtrack-Charles-Gross/product-reviews/B000000NG7/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_viewopt_srt?ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews&sortBy=recent&pageNumber=1

One word: BEAUTY.

B4 The Auction, Beauty, emotion, bristly hair, arms hitting the battery... It is an ideal cut for a demo.


The resampler: SSRC 24/96 Intermediate 95%


At the eighties the digital masters have big problems with jitter. Usually this SSRC resampler is a good idea.

Now, the Tchaikovsky No 5 comparative.

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #71 on: 14 Mar 2018, 07:15 pm »
Mravinsky, Leningrad PO - Tchaikovsky 5 (1961) (SACD 2012)


foobar2000 1.4 beta 7 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1
log date: 2018-03-14 20:13:21

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Analyzed: EVGENY MRAVINSKY / LENINGRAD PHILHARMONIC / TCHAIKOVSKY: SYMPHONY NO.5
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

DR         Peak         RMS     Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR9       -3.90 dB   -19.24 dB     14:33 01-1. ANDANTE - ALLEGRO CON ANIMA [SYMPHONY NO.5]
DR9       -3.38 dB   -18.93 dB     11:56 02-2. ANDANTE CANTABILE, CON ALCUNA LICENZA [SYMPHONY NO.5]
DR11      -4.45 dB   -23.08 dB      5:27 03-3. VALSE [SYMPHONY NO.5]
DR8       -3.37 dB   -16.19 dB     11:03 04-4. FINALE [SYMPHONY NO.5]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks:  4
Official DR value: DR9

Samplerate:        2822400 Hz / PCM Samplerate: 44100 Hz
Channels:          2
Bits per sample:   1
Bitrate:           5645 kbps
Codec:             DSD64
============================================


Mravinsky, Leningrader P - Tchaikovsky: Symphonies Nos 4, 5 & 6 "Pathetique" (1961) (2006 German pressing)


foobar2000 1.4 beta 7 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1
log date: 2018-03-14 20:17:19

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Analyzed: Mravinsky, London Leningrad PO / Tchaikovsky - Symphonies Nos. 4, 5 & 6
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

DR         Peak         RMS     Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR10      -3.56 dB   -20.50 dB      9:18 02-Symphony No.4 In F Minor, Op.36: 2. Andantino in modo di canzone
DR13      -3.49 dB   -23.78 dB      5:49 03-Symphony No.4 In F Minor, Op.36: 3. Scherzo. Pizzicato ostinato - Allegro
DR9       -0.84 dB   -14.93 dB      8:07 04-Symphony No.4 In F Minor, Op.36: 4. Finale (Allegro con fuoco)
DR9       -1.91 dB   -16.10 dB     14:36 05-Symphony No.5 in E minor, Op.64: 1. Andante - Allegro con anima
DR8       -1.01 dB   -15.72 dB     11:58 06-Symphony No.5 in E minor, Op.64: 2. Andante cantabile, con alcuna licenza - Moderato con anima
DR11      -2.14 dB   -19.89 dB      5:29 07-Symphony No.5 in E minor, Op.64: 3. Valse (Allegro moderato)
DR8       -0.92 dB   -13.09 dB     11:12 08-Symphony No.5 in E minor, Op.64: 4. Finale (Andante maestoso - Allegro vivace)
DR9       -1.99 dB   -16.91 dB     17:40 09-Symphony No.6 in B minor, Op.74 -'Pathétique': 1. Adagio - Allegro non troppo
DR11      -3.43 dB   -19.97 dB      8:07 10-Symphony No.6 in B minor, Op.74 -'Pathétique': 2. Allegro con grazia
DR9       -0.80 dB   -14.25 dB      8:22 11-Symphony No.6 in B minor, Op.74 -'Pathétique': 3. Allegro molto vivace
DR8       -1.80 dB   -15.82 dB      9:49 12-Symphony No.6 in B minor, Op.74 -'Pathétique': 4. Finale (Adagio lamentoso - Andante)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks:  11
Official DR value: DR10

Samplerate:        96000 Hz
Channels:          2
Bits per sample:   24
Bitrate:           2795 kbps
Codec:             FLAC
======================================


Mravinsky, Leningrader P - Tchaikovsky: Symphonies Nos 4, 5 & 6 "Pathetique" (1961) (2017 German pressing)


foobar2000 1.4 beta 7 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1
log date: 2018-03-14 20:21:14

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Analyzed: Evgeny Mravinsky / Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra / Symphony No. 5 in E minor, Op. 64
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

DR         Peak         RMS     Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR12      -0.50 dB   -18.80 dB     14:36 05-Symphony No. 5 in E minor, Op. 64 - I. Andante - Allegro con anima
DR12      -0.03 dB   -18.61 dB     11:56 06-Symphony No. 5 in E minor, Op. 64 - II. Andante cantabile, con alcuna licenza
DR14      -0.90 dB   -22.13 dB      5:28 07-Symphony No. 5 in E minor, Op. 64 - III. Valse: Allegro moderato
DR11      -0.03 dB   -15.47 dB     11:08 08-Symphony No. 5 in E minor, Op. 64 - IV. Finale: Andante maestoso - Allegro vivace
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks:  4
Official DR value: DR12

Samplerate:        96000 Hz
Channels:          2
Bits per sample:   24
Bitrate:           2893 kbps
Codec:             FLAC
=======================================================

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #72 on: 14 Mar 2018, 07:29 pm »
The 2017 pressing with

Quote
RME Hammerfall 9632 ADC

http://www.rme-audio.de/en/products/hdsp_9632.php

I LOVE the very good rips made with RME ADC and Lavry AD11. But one thing is the ADC and another the DAC, so it is better to wait for the independent measurements of the RME ADI-2 DAC and RME ADI-2 Pro.

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #73 on: 14 Mar 2018, 07:35 pm »
The sound?

2017 German Pressing is the BEST and with much difference.

And again I verify that most of the SACD are very badly done, missing the best technology. And this recording of classical music is not saved from the loudness war. Well, the DR 2006 pressing (Symphony No 5) is like DR SACD!


- End off topic -

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #74 on: 14 Mar 2018, 08:36 pm »
I am listening to the Country soundtrack again and when I get to the cut I feel the same again, so I double it:

Quote
B4 The Auction, Beauty, emotion, bristly hair, arms hitting the battery... It is an ideal cut for a demo.

It reminds me of the movie Mr. Jones, played by Richard Gere. The character has a bipolar disorder and can not contain himself when listening to an orchestral piece in a concert.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Jones_(1993_film)

Quote
In one of his manic periods he jumps up onto the stage during a concert performance of Beethoven's ninth and starts conducting, resulting in his arrest...

Well, that, if someone saw me ... Adrenaline rush.

The final is very good too.

B6 Epilogue And Hymn

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Country_(film)

maty

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Laird-Signal Integrity Products LFB095051-000, ferrite
« Reply #75 on: 14 Mar 2018, 09:36 pm »
finnsam has found a better ferrite and ten times cheaper!!!

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/class-d/320039-class-amp-emi-reduction-3.html#post5372182


Laird-Signal Integrity Products LFB095051-000, ferrite

http://assets.lairdtech.com/home/bra...095051-000.pdf


Würth 150 kHz

http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/1919956.pdf


10x Cheaper and better than Würth.

https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/laird-signal-integrity-products/LFB095051-000/240-2277-ND/703465


I proceed to update the post of the thread where I recommended.

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #76 on: 14 Mar 2018, 10:21 pm »

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #77 on: 14 Mar 2018, 10:22 pm »
Laird: FOR ROUND CABLES & WIRING HARNESSES 300 KHZ TO 30 MHZ OPTIMIZED


maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #78 on: 15 Mar 2018, 10:43 am »
We need to find RF ferrites with similar specifications and ... that can open / close, which is the advantage of the Würth and others.

maty

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Re: How to clean the DC at mains. And ripple too.
« Reply #79 on: 17 Mar 2018, 09:26 am »
When I made my comments I was really thinking about my problems with my class AB amplifier. Class D amplifiers work inside an higher frequencies. They have more problems with EMI than RF.

From Hypex there are a interesting article about EMI and the old UcD modules but that serves for all class D.

UcD and EMI by Bruno Putzeys

https://www.hypex.nl/img/upload/doc/an_wp/AN_UcD_and_EMI.pdf

When I read these about toroidal inductors (page 4):

Quote
If you see toroids in the output filter, shudder. If it’s mounted upright, shudder once more

Quote
Wire wound inductors with multiple layers of windings. A space efficient way of winding a ferrite core is to layer windings on top of each other. First, you wind n/2 turns going from left to right, and then you proceed back from right to left with the remaining n/2. The first and last windings of the coil end up on top of each other and are free to couple capacitively.

I have rememebered this picture:

Nuprime ST-10

[IMG] http://maty.galeon.com/WP-imagenes/hard/Nuprime-ST-10-inside.jpg

vs

Hypex UcD180

[IMG] https://www.hifisound.de/out/pictures/master/product/2/AKT-2012402.jpg

Hypex NC500

[IMG] https://static.wixstatic.com/media/bee373_681bd32aff9f48ff87b2984d6941f6f6.jpg/v1/fill/w_246,h_222,al_c,q_80,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/bee373_681bd32aff9f48ff87b2984d6941f6f6.jpg

and

IcePower 1200AS2

[IMG] https://www.head-case.org/forums/uploads/monthly_2018_01/IcePower1200AS2.thumb.jpg.f524da0367760c3711e978bb011a4886.jpg