[S Clark]

Did Danny get the parameters of the 15" ? The TS stuff? I'm curious. I'm sure he has a woofer tester.

Maybe the answer is to build a deck for listening and BBQ? You do live in TX...

You've got a PM on TS parameters. 
As to the deck... I like that idea.  The slab and BBQ part are already in place, just have to move 100 lb speakers back and forth. 

[S Clark]

Or you might realize you now have the best garage system in your neighborhood...maybe all of Abilene!  Rock your neighbors! 

I have been, even though the closest one is 1/4 mile away. I live a few miles outside of town. There are advantages to country living. Even outdoors, you can crank up the volume. But I think Folsom is on to something.  It may be time to fire up the BBQ and invite a bunch of folks out for some food and outdoor listening in the back yard. 

[nickd]

Thanks for the listening notes S Clark.

I love the LS9’s too. In my room however I couldn’t tame the bass nodes they excited. I never considered DSP as I had never heard one that was transparent enough to satisfy me.

When I read a review on the Lyngdorf TDAI 2170, I thought what the heck, I should give one a try. I’ll sell the thing if it sounds bad. I wanted a new DAC anyway and It wasn’t crazy money. The tech used in the design was light years ahead of what most companies are putting out.

All I can say is if I had owned this amp when I built my LS9’s I would still have them. Using well designed DSP and digital crossovers is a game changer for room issues. I could never go back.

I have had some crazy good speakers overt the years, yet getting a well balanced in room response with killer imaging was almost impossible. One or two dB peak or null in the wrong place just bugs me after a few weeks. So I would sell the speakers and try to find something better.

You should hear the Altec’s with just a touch of DSP magic. They can’t Image like the LS9’s, nothing can. But they make lifelike music indeed.

Bring us up date this spring when you get them outside. going to impress yout guests for sure..

[S Clark]

Cloth grills are done with a reversable fabric, black diamond on one side, gold diamond on the other.

[fredgarvin]

I love those grills.

[S Clark]

Thanks, Fred.  I'm happy with the way they turned out also. Most importantly, my wife likes the way they look. 

[Bob in St. Louis]

That's a "win win" right there. 

[Folsom]

Are you trying to make the gold diamond look better by juxtaposing it next to some dog ass?

[S Clark]

Are you trying to make the gold diamond look better by juxtaposing it next to some dog ass?

Hey, that's my listening partner you're talking about! 
I had just put on some CSN&Y, and he was leaving the room.  He only listens to jazz and classical. 

[JakeJ]

Your dog has excellent taste!  He wasn't leaving due to the music choice, he just wanted to photobomb the shot with his butt.

Smart dog.  Good dog.

[SteveFord]

Your dog has excellent taste!  He wasn't leaving due to the music choice, he just wanted to photobomb the shot with his butt.

Smart dog.  Good dog.

Thanks, I needed a laugh. 

If those speakers sound as nice as they look you've got it made.

[MerRev]

Those diamond grill cloths are icing on the cake.   
Where did you find them?
Thanks for taking us through your journey and sharing Dannys expertise with the old girls.

[S Clark]

Those diamond grill cloths are icing on the cake.   
Where did you find them?
Thanks for taking us through your journey and sharing Dannys expertise with the old girls.

Kenneth Richmond of Richmond Designs Inc.  He specializes in cloth for old radio restoration... lots of patterns to choose from and he'll cut to order. 
Not as cheap as typical ebay stuff, but I thought it was worth a bit extra for a pattern that was a better match.  Easy to deal with and good communications.  http://www.richmonddesignsinc.com

[Sparky2]

Ok, I just joined AudioCircle today.  I have a pair of Altec 416-8B's that were taken from a pair of Mid-1970's A7 Voice of The Theater cabinets.  They were in bad shape with a radial rip in one, and a screwdriver hole in the cones and edge suspension on the other.  I repaired these with coffee filter and PVC glue on the cone, and coffee filter with rubber cement on the edge.  I put them temporarily in some cheap old carpeted DJ cabinets a friend gave me, and they sound fantastic.  By cranking the bass a bit, I almost don't need the subwoofer.  However, those cabinet volumes are too far below the Vas for the drivers, so I cannot port them effectively.  I thought of building two Valencia's from scratch, with my own design for midrange and tweeters, not the 811 horns.  The 416-8B's are some of the finest woofers ever made, but in my opinion the big horns were meant for theaters and PA systems, not for HiFi home use.  We used them in our rock and roll bands for PA. My friend has some Valencia's he has had since we were teenager's in the 60's.  They sound "honky" and harsh even powered by a McIntosh 275.  Some of our more serious audiophile friends almost refuse to listen to them.  Anyway, my idea is to cross the 416-8B's over at something below 200 Hz., use some good 10" bass guitar speakers I have to cover 200 HZ. to 3000 HZ. where they roll-off, a dynamic 4"x10" horn for 3000 Hz to 7000Hz, then maybe a high-quality piezo, or ring radiator above 7000Hz.  These should theoretically sound much smoother and pleasing than the Valencias, while keeping that great bass response.  I am a little puzzled by the port size in the Valencia's, as they appear in the photos to be only small slots on the sides of the 811 horn.  I calculated a much larger port, or ducts similar to the Altec 846B.  I would appreciate any constructive comments or suggestions.

[nickd]

Welcome to AC Sparky,
The 416 woofers you are working with will work in several size boxes. The Valencia to my knowledge did have a round port, however if memory serves, the box was a bit small for the 416. The Model 19 was more optimized for that driver.

You can look on the Great Plains Audio site for original Altec parts and lots of factory box info. They can put new factory recones in your woofer baskets too. The Altec users board on the net is also full of really knowledgeable Altec builders and restoration experts.

Enjoy the build, the 416 is indeed one of the best sounding 15” woofers ever made. They sound good well over 200hz too. It would surprise me if you can find a 10”woofer that will sound as good as a 416 from 200-1000hz.

[Sparky2]

Thanks , Nickd,. I will research the references you gave me.  My thought was to go 4-way and use the 416's a!most as a subwoofer up to 200hz, but maybe I will crossover higher and let the 10 inch take 1000 Hz,to 3000 Hz,. I would just like to utilize the great bass response of the 416-8B without building a washing machine sized cabinet.  I loaded enough of those to band gigs in my lifetime.  Take care.

[S Clark]

The Valencia A had slotted ports next to the woofer.  The later model B had a round port.  What we found when Danny Richie measured mine was that the best response was when we used some open cell foam on the horn, and ran the woofer open baffle.  With the right crossover, it measured amazingly smooth and kept it's vocal clarity (Valencia's best feature)

[idler]

Hi,
Any listening updates?  Do you have the new crossover installed and are you listening sans back panel? Please share crossover details and photos.
Thanks for the interesting thread!

Regards,
Idler

[mariolmb]

Ok,ok.  Notice the scale.  Each mark is only 1/2 db.  Look at how that woofer smoothed out. That's about as good as it gets, period, much less for a 50 year old driver... and it certainly didn't look that way to begin with.  But, if you're looking for high overtones, look elsewhere. You can't fix what's not there.  But the main issue that I originally heard was a large peak at about 1700-1800Hz. It's been tamed to just a couple of db rise. 

Sorry to enter so late on this trend.
Just read it now.

But for guy whoi want to restore a pair of Valencia.
Don't be afaid from this graph.
The wood restauration is really good.
But for the compression driver.
something is really wrong there.
Me I suspect one of the 2 things: an Chinese diaphragm or uncalibrated microphone.
Cause the pics show a curv like a bad chinese one.
The chinese one I work with, were about the same curv, except a bit hy'er... around 9,500hz,
the reason to use it, it's just if client is in a thight budget, and wait to do better in near future.
But now, if I'm asked to do it, I discard the project, too bad for my work.
but lot's of other thing could be wrong to.... gasket....mics....computer,,,,gauss...diapragm placement...etc...etc...
But this compression, fall at 7.500hz.
Any altec with an altec diapragm will go a least to 12,500 ~ 14.500 easily, if measured with proper equipment.
Some with help of the cross over will even go through 18,200.
Me I don't work on Valencia. but from my experience with 825 and 828 cabinets and lots of 811/511 combo.
Can't see why an altec compression could be so different from an valencia cabinet to 828.
It's the horn, not the cabinet who influence the curv.

But this one need work, that's for sure.
So my conclusion is :
"Fix what it is there with proper components"
and you will get original sound.

Hope it will help guy  who want to get nice pair of Valencia with original sound.
So go for it, you will enjoy it, and nobody will tell you that you HF is poor if done properly.
they will put too much concentration on tapping their feet to music.
Not lot's of people ear a sound higher then 14500hz, imagine 18000.

Mario

[S Clark]

The diaphrams are the ones made from the original Altec tooling from Great Plains Audio, so they are as close to original as you can get.  The measuring was done a full pro Clio unit, manned by a very experienced professional-- so they were measured properly.
You comment to not be afraid of the graph... note that this is probably the smoothest Altec speaker you will ever encounter within its range. 

As far as getting the original Valencia sound, no thanks.  Danny's crossover was much superior.