My Harman (JBL M2) Trip

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JoshK

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #40 on: 16 Apr 2017, 05:11 pm »
I have read this as well.  We heard that three people were really behind the M2.  Mr. Timbers was not listed as one of those.  I believe the Everest design was his last big one. 

That is what I heard through the grapevine from someone in the factory.  Timbers did a lot of somewhat similar designs but more consumer oriented, whereas the M2 was more pro-recording studio oriented.   I guess that makes us prosumers. 

JoshK

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #41 on: 16 Apr 2017, 05:29 pm »
Congrats on your purchase. I have lusted over the M2's since I first heard them at a get together.  The ability to use the networked DCi amps instead of the iTech amps really helped with the cost for enthusiasts.

Also the fans on the DCi are near silent for me, whereas the Itech are meant to be leave blowers.   

You can use the BSS Processor if you want to use your own amps, but I can't really see the point.  The crown amps are super powerful and perform exceptionally well.   

The DCi amps are permanent install amps which work well for us audiophiles rather than the touring version which is the itechs. 

Russell Dawkins

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #42 on: 16 Apr 2017, 05:33 pm »
I have read this as well.  We heard that three people were really behind the M2.  Mr. Timbers was not listed as one of those.  I believe the Everest design was his last big one.
You might well be right about the Everest. I can't remember where I got the impression that Greg was involved with the M2—maybe it was some of his knowing comments on the design. I think the Studio 500 series (530, 570, 580 and 590) may have been his last designs. That, also, is conjecture although it would fit with what JoshK just said.

JoshK

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #43 on: 16 Apr 2017, 05:34 pm »
I have to wonder if the 705i would be the best imaging of the bunch with the narrow design. Set them up with a pair of Rhythmik subs and have M2s on the cheap. Although I don't know the  705s pricing as I type this.

Rocket Ronny

In my experience with well designed constant directivity (CD) speakers sans any large diffraction edges (the waveguide minimizes this to a large extent), that old audiophile rule of thumb that narrow designs image better doesn't hold true.  The M2s image about as good as any other speaker I've heard and what is more is it holds in off axis.  They are the opposite of the head-in-the-vise speaker design.   My guess (also noted in one pro review) is that the radial horn of the 4367 (Greg Timber design iirc) is more traditional horn and thus a very narrow sweet spot.   That is why he was a fan of the radial axis standing upright in some of his other designs.   A proper CD horn with minimal diffraction actually has a very wide sweet spot with excellent separation and imaging. 

Further, I'd rather have a speaker with a larger waveguide all else being equal due to the more controlled pattern it holds to a lower frequency.   The 705's waveguide is almost too small to be super useful, but still they pull it off somehow.  The 708 is about the minimum size waveguide for good CD speaker design based on my studies.   I think part of the magic of the M2 is the large waveguide that matches a well controlled large woofer capable of moving real amounts of air without excess distortion. 

Russell Dawkins

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #44 on: 16 Apr 2017, 05:46 pm »
Well, don't know any of those folks personally, but it sounds like a rather bitter, just terminated long time employee.

You could be right!

Russell Dawkins

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #45 on: 16 Apr 2017, 05:50 pm »
OH, Russell, did not catch that you were one of the JBL engineers. Fine work, and my condolences.
AFRF

I'm not, or I wouldn't have made the mistake of assuming that Greg Timbers was behind the M2.

DaveC113

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Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #46 on: 16 Apr 2017, 06:11 pm »
Greg has wrote about the experience on other forums, those interested can search and find easily.

OzarkTom

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #47 on: 16 Apr 2017, 07:15 pm »

Odal3

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Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #48 on: 16 Apr 2017, 10:49 pm »
That's the way to shop for speakers! Congrats on your purchase. Enjoy!

Angaria

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Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #49 on: 17 Apr 2017, 12:33 am »
The 705i, 708i and 305P were all setup next to the M2.  With some software and a switcher we were able to toggle between all four of the models. Although not level matched, nor blind, it was difficult at times to tell one from another.  The family resemblance is remarkable considering the price difference. 

Overall, a great day.  Very pleased we made the trip.  And now the waiting for some big boxes to arrive begins...

I find this point of comparison to be very interesting - as you say, seeing performance that doesn't fall off with dramatically different price points is cool.

jtwrace

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #50 on: 17 Apr 2017, 01:22 am »
That's the way to shop for speakers! Congrats on your purchase. Enjoy!
Thanks!   :thumb:

witchdoctor

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #51 on: 17 Apr 2017, 03:15 am »
Entire post deleted due to it being, on second thought, a combination of faulty conjecture and unconstructive dirty laundry airing.

Sorry, all.

Fragments can be seen in replies below.


After I bought my last JBL's I liked them so much that I sent Greg a CD as a thank you (Apostrophe by Zappa) and Charles Sprinkle a CD (Bush by Snoop Dog) and a thank you note. I wish I would have known to send you one too. Thank goodness I sent before Greg left.

JohnR

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #52 on: 17 Apr 2017, 09:50 am »
No, load the tuning file into the DCi and you're done.

Oh, OK cool  :thumb: Very neat!

jtwrace

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #53 on: 17 Apr 2017, 02:23 pm »
Oh, OK cool  :thumb: Very neat!
If you're curious, you can go to the link below and click on "Tunings" on the right side and read all about it.
http://www.jblpro.com/www/products/recording-broadcast/m2/m2-master-reference-monitor#.WPTPpPkrLDc


AJinFLA

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Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #54 on: 17 Apr 2017, 02:29 pm »
If you're curious, you can go to the link below and click on "Tunings" on the right side and read all about it.
http://www.jblpro.com/www/products/recording-broadcast/m2/m2-master-reference-monitor#.WPTPpPkrLDc
Tweaker heaven  :thumb:

jtwrace

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #55 on: 17 Apr 2017, 02:32 pm »
Tweaker heaven  :thumb:
If one wanted to but I'll stick with the anechoic data.   :green:

AJinFLA

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Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #56 on: 17 Apr 2017, 02:35 pm »
If one wanted to but I'll stick with the anechoic data.   :green:
For now... :green:

jtwrace

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #57 on: 17 Apr 2017, 02:42 pm »
For now... :green:
Ha!  I'm not a tweaker when it comes to that stuff.  Take measurements and fix the room....multiple subs etc.  It ain't that hard.   :green:

NavyDoc

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Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #58 on: 17 Apr 2017, 03:14 pm »
JBL M2 will be my only pair of speakers.

Cant wait to read your thoughts once they arrive.  With the LIO front end I would expect stellar performance.

I may end up with the same setup.

JoshK

Re: My Harman (JBL M2) Trip
« Reply #59 on: 17 Apr 2017, 04:33 pm »
On another forum, a guy who goes by Gooddoc put in a minor shelving filter to dial down the top end a wee bit.  That is the kind of stuff that audio architect will work well to do (you can even save different presets) that I wouldn't want to do in a AV processor.    You can go all tweaker, but I'm not a tweaker either.   I just set them up as per factory and enjoyed for the last 5 months.   I'll run room eq when I finish setting up my Atmos.