New Song3's

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laulau

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #20 on: 30 Dec 2016, 08:56 pm »

Great looking speakers.

Do you have the grill upside down in the 3rd photo?

johzel

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #21 on: 30 Dec 2016, 09:41 pm »
Great looking speakers.

Do you have the grill upside down in the 3rd photo?

Not any more . . .    :thumb: 

johzel

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #22 on: 31 Dec 2016, 12:09 am »
Interesting that you should mention imaging.  I asked Jim this morning what he thought of the Beats, and he mentioned that a particularly hard-to-please crew member had extolled their imaging qualities.  That's something that's very hard to predict.  Although the Be dome tweeter does have superior vertical dispersion compared to the RAAL ribbon, its horizontal dispersion isn't as wide.  So that's not what explains it.  I suspect it has to do with the way the off-axis response rolls off very evenly, and to how easy it was to optimize phase relationships between the mid and tweet.  Too bad those drivers are so expensive.

Interesting that you should mention off-axis response.  My wife and I enjoyed our glass of wine by the fire this evening.  About as far off-axis as you could get.  And the music was simply wonderful.  Caught me totally off guard.

KLH007

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Re: New Song3's
« Reply #23 on: 31 Dec 2016, 12:43 am »
John, Your off axis scenario usually occurs when a piano or guitar is playing in the next room, yet you know it's live, your system is certainly top shelf. Jim seems to be able to design great sounding speakers with ribbons or domes, passive or active bass, and his woodwork is sensational with some of his exotic veneer choices being stunning.

Big Red Machine

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #24 on: 31 Dec 2016, 12:52 am »
Wow those are absolutely beautiful!  Congrats on your purchase!  Just curious, do you use the subs when listening to music with the songs?

Kinger, sniffing out the blasphemers?   :tempted:

johzel

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #25 on: 31 Dec 2016, 12:59 am »
Wow those are absolutely beautiful!  Congrats on your purchase!  Just curious, do you use the subs when listening to music with the songs?

Nope.  Absolutely not.  That was the point of moving from the Silk AT's to these . . . mission accomplished  :thumb:

Folsom

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #26 on: 31 Dec 2016, 02:15 am »
The Satori is pretty sweet. Very good drivers in that speaker, as long as they play well together.

boniccie

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #27 on: 31 Dec 2016, 02:58 pm »
Congrats on your gorgeous new speakers. Mine should be done next month. Please give us a quick review if you can.

johzel

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #28 on: 31 Dec 2016, 03:55 pm »
Wow those are absolutely beautiful!  Congrats on your purchase!  Just curious, do you use the subs when listening to music with the songs?

Nope.  Absolutely not.  That was the point of moving from the Silk AT's to these . . . mission accomplished  :thumb:

I'm wondering if I responded to this a bit hastily.  I am not using the subs because I didn't want to move cables back and forth between two independent systems.  I am aware that there are those who believe running a pair of subs, even with full(er) ranged speakers has a positive impact upon room dynamics . . . am open to and interested in people's experience and expertise in this regard . . . And a very happy, healthful and prosperous New Year to all!!

ClarkFan

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Re: New Song3's
« Reply #29 on: 1 Jan 2017, 04:04 am »
When Jim and I were talking about the design he suggested the beryllium as it has the extension of the Raal, the dispersion of a dome, and would work well in this 3-way speaker.  I noted its successful use in the Soundscape 8 BE's.  I had liked the beryllium tweeter in a former pair of Ushers I owned.  I was looking for fast, detailed, dynamic and lack of harshness but also something that would smoothly integrate with the midrange. I love a great midrange. So, I followed Jim's recommendation.  From a design standpoint, Jim might choose to step in here???   We'll see if I like this as much of the Silk AT's  . . .

So, having experience with both, what is your read on the differences between the RAAL and the beryllium dome?  I've heard a couple of Salks with the ribbons, and they seem to have very nice treble.  In my present system, I'm not much concerned with vertical dispersion, as I listen to music sitting or it is background while I am in another room.  The Song 3 package does seem like a nice starting point, and as a long-time Spendor owner I am all about the midrange. 

DMurphy

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Re: New Song3's
« Reply #30 on: 1 Jan 2017, 05:53 am »
Vertical dispersion isn't an issue with the RAAL.  It's not quite as good as a 1" dome, but it's good enough that you won't notice any difference if you sit or if you stand at a normal listening distance. 

FireGuy

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #31 on: 1 Jan 2017, 01:51 pm »
Vertical dispersion isn't an issue with the RAAL.  It's not quite as good as a 1" dome, but it's good enough that you won't notice any difference if you sit or if you stand at a normal listening distance.

Yes, sitting in your camp.  I too, prefer (metal) domes.  Auditioned some Martin Logans with folded ribbon, okay but no "wow" factor that you'll hear about.  Axiom  (for example) makes a remarkable titanium unit... these are their V3's of the M2.





Mudslide

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #32 on: 1 Jan 2017, 04:19 pm »
Yes, sitting in your camp.  I too, prefer (metal) domes.  Auditioned some Martin Logans with folded ribbon, okay but no "wow" factor that you'll hear about.  Axiom  (for example) makes a remarkable titanium unit... these are their V3's of the M2.



Nice looking setup.

I think Dennis was referring to the Be dome being slightly better at vertical dispersion, not an overall quality or preference.  Dennis takes care to discuss measurable elements here, not a personal opinion.

But I retain no such wisdom, so to give you my opinion...there is no better HF transducer in terms of delivering a clear and smooth reality than a RAAL (not any ribbon).

ClarkFan

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Re: New Song3's
« Reply #33 on: 1 Jan 2017, 05:00 pm »
But I retain no such wisdom, so to give you my opinion...there is no better HF transducer in terms of delivering a clear and smooth reality than a RAAL (not any ribbon).

Yeah, a pair of raw RAAL tweeters sells for about as much as a completed pair of those M-L speakers.  Makes juuuuust a bit of difference in the materials and technology a manufacturer can put in a product.

I've heard a couple of different Salk speakers with RAAL tweeters.  They're really, really nice.  And that's speaking as a Spendor fanboy who thinks their speakers have better treble than most people say.  The RAALs don't seem to have more treble, there is just less "background" behind it so you hear more of the music.

I'd love to hear johzel's Song 3-BEATs (the "Song Waltz?").  Before I retired, work put me in Chicago for about half of each month, but not so much now.  I wouldn't un-retire just to audition a pair of speakers, but.....


FireGuy

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #34 on: 1 Jan 2017, 05:01 pm »
I think Dennis was referring to the Be dome being slightly better at vertical dispersion, not an overall quality or preference.

Understood, thank you.  I've not heard the RAAL in a home audio environment but welcome the opportunity.   My point, of the ribbons I've auditioned, a quality dome can be just as good, or better. 

I see the Salk line has both.  The Wow1's look impressive is all respects.


johzel

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #35 on: 1 Jan 2017, 05:30 pm »

I'd love to hear johzel's Song 3-BEATs (the "Song Waltz?").  Before I retired, work put me in Chicago for about half of each month, but not so much now.  I wouldn't un-retire just to audition a pair of speakers, but.....

You're welcome anytime . . . fill your car with New Glarus beer (only sold in Wisconsin yet half of it is drank in Chicago), local cheese and sausage and more than pay for your trip!!!  :thumb:

ClarkFan

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Re: New Song3's
« Reply #36 on: 1 Jan 2017, 05:40 pm »
You're welcome anytime . . . fill your car with New Glarus beer (only sold in Wisconsin yet half of it is drank in Chicago), local cheese and sausage and more than pay for your trip!!!  :thumb:

I live in Fort Collins, Colorado.  Bringing craft beer from somewhere else is pretty much a modern definition of "taking coals to Newcastle."  Although cheese and sausage go well with other things available in Colorado.....:-)

billmcc

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Re: New Song3's
« Reply #37 on: 3 Jan 2017, 12:54 am »
So, having experience with both, what is your read on the differences between the RAAL and the beryllium dome?  I've heard a couple of Salks with the ribbons, and they seem to have very nice treble.  In my present system, I'm not much concerned with vertical dispersion, as I listen to music sitting or it is background while I am in another room.  The Song 3 package does seem like a nice starting point, and as a long-time Spendor owner I am all about the midrange.
I'm using two Rythmik F12SEs with my HT2-TLs and with the use of Dirac room correction the combo sounds excellent :)!

Bill

jsalk

Re: New Song3's
« Reply #38 on: 5 Jan 2017, 06:39 pm »
It is always hard to capture the full effect of seeing speakers in person, but here are some pictures we took just before packing these. The finish is black dye over ropey cherry.



And a close-up...



Happy listening John!

- Jim

mresseguie

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Re: New Song3's
« Reply #39 on: 11 Jan 2017, 01:51 am »
Jim,

Any chance you'll include the specifications on these speakers for curious onlookers?  :D

Thanks,

Michael