Prosumer Coffee Machine

S Clark · « **Reply #20 on:** 25 Nov 2016, 11:30 pm »

Quote from: Johnny2Bad on 25 Nov 2016, 04:39 pm

I looked at a lot of bean grinders at the time, and everyone seemed to want me to buy one of the Italian units. Instead I bought the KitchenAid one, glass coffee bowl (no static), was inexpensive (Costco online) and works perfectly.

It was out of production around the time I bought mine ... I think for about $80 ... but it's back in the catalog now. Highly recommended; it grinds my expresso and my drip grind beans with a quick turn of the dial. Fully adjustable burrs.

This One:

That's a good unit, but it's not $80... about $250

Johnny2Bad · « **Reply #21 on:** 26 Nov 2016, 07:12 am »

Quote from: S Clark on 25 Nov 2016, 11:30 pm

That's a good unit, but it's not $80... about $250

$250 now, after being dropped from the product line and then recently re-introduced. $80 in 2009, when I bought mine. I don't know the MSRP then (all I have is my invoice) but I seem to recall something around $130 or so. Still, there is no lack of Italian-branded, made who-knows-where-today units, that cost about the same as what the current KitchenAid "Artisan" unit is priced at.

As far as it being "a good unit", which I wholeheartedly agree with, when I was researching coffee grinders, not one single "expresso devotee" website or blog mentioned it, let alone recommended it. They instead suggested pricey (at the time, in comparison) Italian made units with plastic coffee containers and hoppers, all of which suffer from static cling., and as often as not utilize "stylish" square cornered containers, which are more difficult to clean.

Strange, but just goes to show that there is often a hidden agenda, in the case of espresso grinders, I think also not a little snobbishness. The KitchenAid unit is robustly built, uses a brushless motor, is quieter than most (although not silent by any means), the burrs are a generous size and stay cool, not imparting heat to the beans, and so on. Everything you would think someone recommending a grinder would look for. But, no.

I think my experience also serves as a caution with regard to our hobby. We can't always be sure we are not being led down the garden path. You would have to be very unobservant not to notice a certain faddishness in the Audio hobby. (Anyone remember when you could not buy a copy of Stereophile without a new Musical Fidelity review inside?).

A certain prudence when reading reviews and recommendations, and above all do not fear trusting your own judgement. A lesson we can benefit from being reminded of from time to time.

Chris Adams · « **Reply #22 on:** 26 Nov 2016, 01:52 pm »

I agree with Jonny2Bad. I've had this KitchenAid grinder for four or five years and it has been the best grinder I've used since my original KitchenAid died twenty years ago. It gets dailey use. I had a few others in between including two of the Maestro units. It listed for $250 when I bought it but found it on sale for $150. Now that I know how good it is, I would have gladly paid full price.

S Clark · « **Reply #23 on:** 26 Nov 2016, 03:06 pm »

I have a Gaggia grinder/doser that I paid about $150 for many years back. A buddy has the Kitchen Aid. Both are heavy, well made units that will last decades of home use, but the comparison ends there. The Kitchen Aid is much faster, and half as loud as my Gaggia.

Philistine · « **Reply #24 on:** 26 Nov 2016, 07:45 pm »

I've got a Rancilio Rocky grinder, doserless version, I can put the correct weight of beans into the bean hopper and grind straight into the portafilter - no wasted coffee and consistency. Looking at the Kitchen Aid it doesn't have the option to grind directly into the portafilter, is this correct? I'm looking for a new grinder and the Kitchen Aid could be an option....this is why I'm asking, and curious if there's a fix for this?

Chris Adams · « **Reply #25 on:** 26 Nov 2016, 09:16 pm »

If the portafilter is no taller than the glass coffee container, you could remove the coffee container and grind into the filter. Could be a bit messy. I'm not at home, so I can't take a look.

S Clark · « **Reply #26 on:** 26 Nov 2016, 09:18 pm »

I've never seen my buddy load his portafiliter from the grinder. Isn't a standard portafilter much smaller than the the opening of the Kitchen Aid?

Chris Adams · « **Reply #27 on:** 26 Nov 2016, 09:21 pm »

Quote from: S Clark on 26 Nov 2016, 09:18 pm

I've never seen my buddy load his portafiliter from the grinder. Isn't a standard portafilter much smaller than the the opening of the Kitchen Aid?

I think you're correct.

RPM123 · « **Reply #28 on:** 29 Nov 2016, 06:18 pm »

I picked up the KitchenAid yesterday at a very good price from Macy's, tried it this morning and while it does grind very well, I am not sure that I can tolerate the noise level!

It is very loud...seemingly about twice the db level of the Capresso mill that I have been using. I will be experimenting with placing different materials underneath it, in an effort to dampen the noise level. It sits on a quartz countertop and placing a dish towel underneath the mill does help somewhat, but I will be looking at some other materials. This makes me feel like I am tweaking an audio component! Such a well built unit though, too bad that I may have to return it.

Peter J · « **Reply #29 on:** 29 Nov 2016, 06:34 pm »

We just got a new Super-Automatic and, lo and behold, it has an IEC power connector on rear.

I'm wondering if I upgrade the cable will the coffee taste better?

S Clark · « **Reply #30 on:** 29 Nov 2016, 06:52 pm »

Please report back after doing a double blind test!

... and to RPM, if that Kitchen Aid is loud I'd hate to compare to my Gaggia- which sounds like a jet taking off.

RPM123 · « **Reply #31 on:** 29 Nov 2016, 10:03 pm »

Quote from: S Clark on 29 Nov 2016, 06:52 pm

Please report back after doing a double blind test!

... and to RPM, if that Kitchen Aid is loud I'd hate to compare to my Gaggia- which sounds like a jet taking off.

Ear protectors would be mandatory then.

newzooreview · « **Reply #32 on:** 30 Nov 2016, 12:08 am »

I had the Kitchen Aid for a couple of years. It is very overpriced considering how coarse the adjustment is and how inconsistent the grind is. It tends to have a higher content of powdery fines mixed with the coarser grinds for pour over or french press.

For the same price I would check out a Baratza Virtuoso. I have two of the similar, but discontinued, Baratza Preciso grinders and they are consistent and have about 3x the precision of grind size adjustment compared to the Kitchen Aid. Baratza also sells replacement parts for just about everything in the grinder. With the Kitchen Aid I couldn't find any replacement parts.

More info on objective review of coffee grinders here: http://thesweethome.com/reviews/the-best-coffee-grinder/

Doublej · « **Reply #33 on:** 30 Nov 2016, 02:01 am »

What do folks recommend for grinding a small batch of beans (1-2 tablespoons)? The Hario Slim mentioned in newzooreview's link appears to have a fatal flaw.

RPM123 · « **Reply #34 on:** 30 Nov 2016, 03:35 am »

Quote from: newzooreview on 30 Nov 2016, 12:08 am

I had the Kitchen Aid for a couple of years. It is very overpriced considering how coarse the adjustment is and how inconsistent the grind is. It tends to have a higher content of powdery fines mixed with the coarser grinds for pour over or french press.

For the same price I would check out a Baratza Virtuoso. I have two of the similar, but discontinued, Baratza Preciso grinders and they are consistent and have about 3x the precision of grind size adjustment compared to the Kitchen Aid. Baratza also sells replacement parts for just about everything in the grinder. With the Kitchen Aid I couldn't find any replacement parts.

More info on objective review of coffee grinders here: http://thesweethome.com/reviews/the-best-coffee-grinder/

In my very limited experience with this device thus far, I have found the grinds to be very consistent. It also has half grind steps. Perhaps yours was an older model or just a "lemon"? I am also impressed by the build quality, as it it should last a very long time. My only issue is the noise level.

borism · « **Reply #35 on:** 12 Feb 2017, 09:15 pm »

Quote from: Philistine on 25 Nov 2016, 02:09 pm

If anyone has a Silva the best improvement you can make is to add a PID controller, the temperature with the Silvia is all over the place, with the PID it's rock steady and gives you a more consistent shot. I got mine from Auber Instruments:
http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=6

Thanks Philistine! I checked out Auber instruments and got a PID for my Gaggia Classic. This was a great improvement similar to getting the Mazzer Mini grinder a few years back. Espresso is much more consistent. Your new espresso machine, however, seems in a different league.

Philistine · « **Reply #36 on:** 14 Feb 2017, 05:53 pm »

Quote from: borism on 12 Feb 2017, 09:15 pm

Thanks Philistine! I checked out Auber instruments and got a PID for my Gaggia Classic. This was a great improvement similar to getting the Mazzer Mini grinder a few years back. Espresso is much more consistent. Your new espresso machine, however, seems in a different league.

Glad the Auber PID worked out for you, having the water at a consistent temp controls one of the variables

When I first went down this path I was in disbelief when 'experts' on coffee forums claimed a good grinder was more important than the espresso machine - I discovered they were right. I've had a Rancilio Rocky for years now, and been using it for espresso and Aeropress grinds, it's a pain having to change the grind setting and the beans. A few weeks ago I pushed the boat out and bought the matching Profitec grinder (it matches the PRO700 and has great performance). As good as the Rocky is, the Profitec grinder makes a significant improvement to the flavor profile. I'm as close now as I can get to a good high street coffee house....next step. upgrade my roaster!

borism · « **Reply #37 on:** 14 Feb 2017, 07:17 pm »

Does it ever end?

cfisher835 · « **Reply #38 on:** 14 Feb 2017, 08:34 pm »

I've had a Pasquini Livia for 16 years. I just can't kill it. On the other hand, it's probably saved me somewhere near $15,000.

randytsuch · « **Reply #39 on:** 14 Feb 2017, 09:29 pm »

Missed this thread before, but I have a Baratza Vario grinder. Have been using it for a few years now, great grinder but not cheap.
Price went up since I bought it.

There are better grinders I suppose, but I feel no need to upgrade.

A commercial conical is the ultimate, but $$$$.

My espresso machine is a Expobar office, with a temp sensor I added. The temp sensor has spoiled me, I don't think I could use an HX machine without it.

Randy