The Little Wonders: JVC's RX-ES1sl & F10

Patty-o · « **Reply #60 on:** 29 Nov 2004, 06:12 am »

Hi-
I'm thinking of buying the JVC RX-F10. I'm currently using an older pre-amp/amp combo so I don't have any experience with the newer multichannel receivers like the JVC. I have some questions about the relationship of inputs to outputs on the JVC. (I've seen pictures of the rear of the ES1 and am guessing that the F10 is similar.)

Do inputs that are marked "DVD In" match with specific speaker terminals--i.e., if I connect a CD player through the "Front" input, will the signal out be only through the "Front" speaker terminals? If a second CD was plugged into the "Surround" input, would it play only through the surround speaker terminals?

If this is the case, is it possible to feed from the subwoofer "Out" on the JVC to one of the "center channel" inputs and then draw from center channel speaker terminals to power a passive sub?

A related question: When you set the satellites to small, is the high pass a fixed crossover frequency, or does it vary with the low pass that you choose for the sub?

One final question, for the Chairguy--Just wondering if you've noticed any fan noise or excessive heat with the F10 you just purchased? (I know those have been discussed on the forum as problems.)

Thanks for your help!

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #61 on:** 29 Nov 2004, 09:17 am »

Quote from: soundboy

TheChairGuy,

I went through the JVC threads and I am under the impression that the analog inputs, aside from the DVD/multi ones, go through a analog>>>digital>>>analog conversion. Maybe I am wrong?

soundboy,

I sheepishly admit

to not having tried any other input but DVD analog and digital (coax and optical). My F10 does duty strictly in my music set-up.

I'm not sure why there would be the extra conversion for the other inputs with analog connection....but a review of the manual (later) may fotell the story. That is kinda' unfortunate that Mark 'the Canuck' mcgsxr and others found that to be the case. Perhaps there is good reason that JVC has for it, or perhaps it's the price you pay for a 1st or second generation product. Future revisions are sure to have it right if JVC's past is any indication of present course.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #62 on:** 29 Nov 2004, 09:31 am »

Hi Patty-o,

Welcome to AC...be you new or a long time lurker

I have to think about your first set of questions for a spell (late here right now, brain on downward slope)...others may come to the rescue sooner than I.

As for the heat and or noise issue, I was one of the lucky ones that had no issues with either on the ES1sl...nor experiencing any with the F10.

I heard horribly irritating fan noise, at 8' away, with PS Audio Power Pant I once owned so I know what annoying fan noise can do to music and nerves. I don't even hear fan noise on the JVC's..unless I try reeeeeal hard to and move my ear within 20" of it. I may not hear tones and nuances well (maybe it is, maybe it ain't) , but my hearing is quite acute for noise issues typically.

mcgsxr · « **Reply #63 on:** 29 Nov 2004, 02:07 pm »

Patty-o, welcome to AC, and I will take a run at your question about using the JVC for your passive sub.

The only fly in the ointment that I see in your plan, is that in order to get a signal out of the sub out RCA, the processor in the JVC will need to be active - then you will be re-inputting a signal into the inputs, so I am confused about what will happen.

What passive sub is it? Would it be feasible to spend $100 for an active sub amp, and end-run this concern?

Patty-o · « **Reply #64 on:** 30 Nov 2004, 06:28 am »

Chairguy--Thanks for your info on noise....glad to hear it's not a problem.

Mark in Canada--Thanks for your thoughts. Buying a sub-amp could be an option, but right now I'm trying to figure out a way to use a channel or two of the F10's amplification (and the F10 sub-woofer crossover) to power my woofers.

A few more questions:
Does anybody know whether when the speakers are set on small, the high pass is variable or is it fixed like on most separate subwoofer amps?

Does anybody know what the input impedence of this amplifier is?

I'm also still curious as to whether putting signal to the "Front" inputs results in a signal at the front speaker terminals only.

Thanks again for thinking about these questions.

ludavico · « **Reply #65 on:** 30 Nov 2004, 03:00 pm »

Paging TheChairGuy:

Can you describe your experience with ERS cloth. Where is the best place to use it in a digital amp? I understand that ERS can muck up analog circuits; did you cut the cloth up into smaller pieces to target just the digital circuits?

Thanks,

John

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #66 on:** 1 Dec 2004, 05:21 am »

John/ludavico,

Sorry, been traveling for work.

I haven't doinked around with ERS on the F10, but a full 8 x 11" sheet of it mucked up the ES1sl. It robbed it of dynamics. I ended up using just a few 1/4" x 1" strips on the top casing...didn't seem harm it, not sure if it helped it either.

I may try something more substantial in the days ahead on the F10.

Let us know what you find if you get to the task before me or the rest of us....

ooheadsoo · « **Reply #67 on:** 1 Dec 2004, 05:31 am »

Quote from: Patty-o

A few more questions:
Does anybody know whether when the speakers are set on small, the high pass is variable or is it fixed like on most separate subwoofer amps?

It's variable.

ludavico · « **Reply #68 on:** 1 Dec 2004, 03:06 pm »

TheChairGuy: Thanks amigo. Since I posted to you I had a chance to do some research on ers. Yikes, the stuff really can mess things up.

I am going to hot-rod a ONEAC power conditioner first, then I will experiment with the TEAC amps.

Cheers,
John

tex-amp · « **Reply #69 on:** 3 Dec 2004, 05:59 pm »

I just received the F10 I bought from A6M-Zero. Intial thoughts are WOW! There is zero background noise. I look foward to having time to play with it and drag a tv down to see what the settings are. It is strictly plug-n-play right now. I'm using it with Ascend Acoustics 340s and a Pioneer 563A right now. Those spring clips SUCK! I was only trying to get 14 gauge in there!

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #70 on:** 3 Dec 2004, 06:21 pm »

Quote from: tex-amp

Those spring clips SUCK! I was only trying to get 14 gauge in there!

These Bolder adaptors do an excellent job for any amp using spring clips.....and you will always have them.

Kevad · « **Reply #71 on:** 3 Dec 2004, 06:27 pm »

Quote from: lonewolfny42

Quote from: tex-amp
Those spring clips SUCK! I was only trying to get 14 gauge in there!
These Bolder adaptors do an excellent job for any amp using spring clips.....and you will always have them.

Wow, and at the bargain price of $100/pair!

The cost of connectors for 5-7 channels of hometheater audio would be much more than the digital receiver itself. Audio is weird like that

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #72 on:** 3 Dec 2004, 06:33 pm »

Quote from: Kevad

Quote from: lonewolfny42
Quote from: tex-amp
Those spring clips SUCK! I was only trying to get 14 gauge in there!
These Bolder adaptors do an excellent job for any amp using spring clips.....and you will always have them.

Wow, and at the bargain price of $100/pair!

The cost of connectors for 5-7 channels of hometheater audio would be much more than the digital receiver itself. Audio is weird like that

When they first came out, they were $60.00 a pair....I just run 2 channel....

vote · « **Reply #73 on:** 10 Dec 2004, 06:00 pm »

Just got today my JVC RX-F10,but i think it´s broken.

Nothing happen when i put its electric wire on to the wall socket,if i understood right it should then go directly to the standbymode.

Any tips?

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #74 on:** 11 Dec 2004, 02:47 am »

Quote from: vote

Just got today my JVC RX-F10,but i think it´s broken.

Nothing happen when i put its electric wire on to the wall socket,if i understood right it should then go directly to the standbymode.

Any tips?

Doesn't sound promising....first one I've heard that was dead from the box. Does the display light up (or stand-by light near the switch)?

Do other things from the same outlet work.....if not, maybe a breaker is tripped?

Things can happen, I suppose

vote · « **Reply #75 on:** 11 Dec 2004, 10:25 am »

Quote from: TheChairGuy

Doesn't sound promising....first one I've heard that was dead from the box. Does the display light up (or stand-by light near the switch)?

Do other things from the same outlet work.....if not, maybe a breaker is tripped?

Things can happen, I suppose

There comes no light to the display panel and no light also from stand-by light.

I have tried different wall sockets.

I call yesterday to the local JVC service and they said just change it to a new one,where you have bought it?

I live in Finland,but i have bought the receiver from Germany,so i(maybe)have to send back it there.I emailed to the shop.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #76 on:** 17 Dec 2004, 06:59 pm »

Well, I've now had substantial time to compare the ES1sl and the RX-F10...my findings:

RX-F10 - Absolutely the better choice for 6 channel needs, for lower impedence loads (it drives my Maggie MMG's quite admirably for $249.00), ergonomics are better (LED off setting is very slick particularly), DSP setting s are kinda' neat, and slightly better (subjective) looks.

ES1sl - For 2 channel audio on 6-8 ohm speakers, it sounds better. This much I'm sure - yet I don't know why. It had 'tingly' and very translucent midrange and more delicate and open treble response.

At no time since the very beginning did I get those delightful chills that I got when I played the ES1sl on my Vandy 1c's. Playing the same tracks on the Vandy with both receivers (Eva Cassidy's 'Songbird' on heavy rotation here) and I kept coming back to the same conclusion. Both are 'tweeked' and set up in exactly the same manner...fed by a BPT-2, on LAT International 'pud' feet, all connections (inside and out where I could) treated with Mapleshade silver bearing grease. The ES1sl is the better sounding unit to these ears.

Comparisons of both with the Maggies are not possible...the ES1sl cannot drive 4 ohm loads adequately and will thermally shut down at moderate/high volumes.

I sold my ES1sl so direct comparison now is not possible, but I know what I know.

In fact, right now, I am getting more enjoyment from the little Sonic Impact and a 7aH sealed lead acid battery than the RX-F10. Perhaps it's yet another case of audio nervosa at play, or 'familiarity breeding discontent', but I'm pretty sure in my convictions on this one.

The RX-F10 is terrific if only because it drives 4 ohm loads for $249(!!!), but outside of that rather extreme case, the ES1sl was better.

Interestingly, I wired in a 10 guage LAT International silverfuse power cord the other day into the F10...I noticed no perceptable change in the sound. The LAT is one of my favorite inexpensive tweeks (about $125), it has never previously failed to better an IEC equipped unit before (this is the first time I hard wired it in).

However..... this is the first time I changed out a power cord, and compared vs. 18ga throw-away cord, while running it thru the BPT-2. Seems the BPT-2 removes much of the electrical and aerial garbage that the LAT (or perhaps any well shielded power cord) helped with previously.

It's all about trade-offs and I am a bit happier with the F10 driving the Maggies than the ES1sl driving the Vandy's. But, if you have a easier driving load than the Maggies, the Es1sl may be a better (and cheaper) choice.

Additionally, the Sonic Impact produces a stupid amunt of great music for $55.00 (with SLA battery), as well, with 87db+ speakers in small rooms. Simpler really is better (one input, 2 channels, 6 watts, and a volume control)and there ain't much better than pure and adequate DC current. I am getting over 60 hours of play time at moderate volumes on one charge!

I can see somehow that Vinnie's ClariT in my future...dratz!

sch · « **Reply #77 on:** 17 Dec 2004, 07:17 pm »

Hi Chairguy!
I'm about to receive the sonic impact and I'm curious about the battery you're mentioning...what brand is it and where can I get one?...Thanks

Santiago

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #78 on:** 17 Dec 2004, 08:19 pm »

Hi Santiago,

This 'tweek' is a rather substantial one for the SI...

http://www.batterymart.com/battery.mv?p=SLA-12V7-F1

I don't know how they do it so cheap at BatteryMart (but I don't really care either

).

Splurge and get the 1maH charger rather than the suggested 500maH charger...it'll be faster for you and it's only $3.00 more.

http://www.batterymart.com/battery.mv?p=ACC-12BC1000D-1

For $22.90 + shipping (and applicable tax in VA), you'll be glad you did it.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #79 on:** 17 Dec 2004, 10:45 pm »

Santiago,

You'll need this, too unless you can fashion something there to hook up charger to SLA battery. At this price, it ain't worth DIY'ing anything....

http://www.batterymart.com/battery.mv?p=ACC-D-1766

John / TCG