[nocrapman]

Hi Folks,
My first foray into the Vinyl world was not ideal - the Dual TT never played to a level that would make me keep spinning. I lost interest and gave it away. I kept my fairly substantial collection of mostly vintage records and have since collected more!
 
I need to buy a decent TT, Phonopre, and a cleaning device. the manual spin and clean got old fast.
I have been looking at the usual suspects from Project, Rega, Clearaudio etc. For this first setup (I am sure I will be upgrading within a year) I want something which is not too complicated to setup, has easy adjustments for usual parameters and does not break the bank. This will be the learning rig essentially. To prepare me for the real/nicer table  in the future.

Please advise.

[ArthurDent]

I'm sure you'll get some good input on this. I can't really offer much as I'm using my 30 yr old Thorens TD160MkII which I pulled out of storage 6 or 7 years ago. Leveled it, plugged it in, and other than a belt change, still running like a top. And the sound is more than impressive. I have a couple of AVA pre-s, both with Frank's phono sections, which both sound good. That said he doesn't offer a stand-a-lone phono pre (as yet anyway).

I'm still using the manual spin RCM, but would hope to upgrade not too far down the road. Obviously VPI is a contender, and vinyl_lady likes her ultrasonic unit. If you have the budget most comments on those have been positive, simply a matter of $. Good luck in the hunt, wish I'd kept more of my original LP collection.   

[ACHiPo]

I recommend used ('course I'm cheap, ehm frugal)...so starting with old Stereophile and Absolute Sound recommended components reviews is not a bad way to go.  You'll fine the big names--VPI, Rega, etc. as well as maybe a few boutique brands that were hot for a couple years--these can be relative bargains if they're simple and reliable (I still have my Well Tempered Reference Turntable I bought used and it's rock solid).

Same thing for phono stages--do a little research, get a feeling for the highly regarded brands and models (and possible pitfalls) and check out CL, Ebay, Audiogon, US Audiomart, etc.  There is a lot to be said for buying turntables locally, as they can definitely be damaged if not packaged and shipped correctly.

[Blackmore]

Take a look at George Merrill's PolyTable that Michael Fremer reviewed recently. The price is a bit more than bargain basement, but you get a Jelco tonearm and it is easy to adjust.  If you want azimuth adjustment, Ortofon's LH4000 head shell is pretty nice. The Jelco will accommodate most cartridge choices and lets you swap carts quickly.
All of this is more expensive than a good used Rega but it might satisfy your need to tweak.  Good luck on your search and keep us posted.

[NIGHTFALL1970]

That said he doesn't offer a stand-a-lone phono pre (as yet anyway).

http://www.avahifi.com/products/for-vinyl-lovers/vision-riaa-phono-preamplifier




Right here.

[ArthurDent]

http://www.avahifi.com/products/for-vinyl-lovers/vision-riaa-phono-preamplifier
Right here.

Thanks for the correction Nightfall.    Hadn't checked the website in a bit, last thread I read he hadn't committed. Good news for all. 

[Letitroll98]

How about the VPI Scout Jr?  $1600, 10.5" arm, motor separated from the plinth, upgrade path to the Scout if you want more in the future.

[nocrapman]

Thanks for the input till now guys.
I want to stay with something new/demo/closeout. Dont have the time for looking for a used deal.

Here are some of the contenders currently; pls help eliminate some:

Pro-Ject Debut Carbon DC Esprit SB Turntable  about $550

Pro-Ject RPM 3 Carbon Turntable with Blue Point No 2 about $900;  with Sumiko Pearl about $700

Pro Ject Xtension 9 SuperPack Turntable with Blue Point Special EVO III Low Output about 2K

VPI Scout Jr. Turntable with Ortofon 2M Red Cartridge about 1600

Rega RP1 Turntable w/Performance Pack / Bias 2 cartridge about $445

Rega PL3 Planar 3 Turntable with Elys Cartridge about $1145.

GEM PolyTable With the Jelco SA-750E 10 inch tonearm about 1900

Clearaudio Concept Turntable with Concept MC about 2K

Any others I need to consider?

[nocrapman]

How about the VPI Scout Jr?  $1600, 10.5" arm, motor separated from the plinth, upgrade path to the Scout if you want more in the future.

I thought this shpped with the 9" tonearm stock?
Dont i have to go upto classic 1 to get the 10.5?

[NIGHTFALL1970]

I recently bought a Rega RP6 that I put my AT440mla on for 1500.00 and it sounds fantastic and is very solid.

[drphoto]

I had a Rega P3-24 with a Denon 103. Plus a no name record vac. and a carbon fiber brush. It sounded fantastic.

 Virtually no surface noise even with mostly used vinyl. Like an idiot I sold it because I just didn't have time to sit an spin records. But I still wish I'd kept it.

It did tend pick up some low end rumble even w/ deck on brass points on a pretty good rack.

The Rega/Denon beat the crap out of my old Thorens TD-165 w/ Shure V15-4. I really don't think Thorens are all that great after hearing the Rega. Always wanted a Linn LP-12, but you have to take out a 2nd mortgage for those. The Rega's are pretty affordable.

It's a shame the Denon is out of production, but you can get a mod version from Zu. High output MC. wonderful.

At some point when I'm flush with cash, I'll probably get another Rega/Zu/Denon rig.

[jarcher]

Having heard many of the TTs on your list, I would say the Clearauduo Concept tops it if you're looking for a table / arm over $1k but under $2k. The Concept MM is not a bad cartridge to start with, but the Concept MC of course is in another league.

Good lower cost phono stages are the Clearaudio Nano ($350) and the Musical Surroundings Phonomena II+. ($750). The latter can certainly carry you upwards to better tables and carts as well.

I think pro-ject makes a great table for the money, but under $1k is their forte, with the carbon DC esprit you mention as the best bang for the buck. If you want to be under $1k, that's where I would go. Their phono stages (eg phono box s @ $200) is a good choice if you want something budget.

[ohenry]

...For this first setup (I am sure I will be upgrading within a year) I want something which is not too complicated to setup, has easy adjustments for usual parameters and does not break the bank. This will be the learning rig essentially. To prepare me for the real/nicer table  in the future.

Please advise.

If you are going to upgrade the TT soon, I'd invest in a good phono preamp and a good RCM.  I recently got a Transcendent Sound phono stage that is really great and it isn't terribly expensive.  My friend recently bought an inexpensive U-turn turntable and it is surprisingly good and easily set up.

Just a thought since you can retain the RCM and preamp for your next TT upgrade without taking a big hit on selling the turntable later. 

[Letitroll98]

I thought this shpped with the 9" tonearm stock?
Dont i have to go upto classic 1 to get the 10.5?

Sorry, that's right.  Matt showed me a 10.5" arm that was identical except for the length and I mistakenly assumed it was also mounted on the Jr.

[jarcher]

Pro-ject has a good new RCM @ $500 which I find to be quicker and quieter than the equivalent VPI one. Theyre on backorder in the US now but when they become available it's a no brainier.

[nocrapman]

Pro-ject has a good new RCM @ $500 which I find to be quicker and quieter than the equivalent VPI one. Theyre on backorder in the US now but when they become available it's a no brainier.

This is definitely on the short list. How much work is needed before/after the machine is done with its thing from your experience?

[nocrapman]

If you are going to upgrade the TT soon, I'd invest in a good phono preamp and a good RCM.  I recently got a Transcendent Sound phono stage that is really great and it isn't terribly expensive.  My friend recently bought an inexpensive U-turn turntable and it is surprisingly good and easily set up.

Just a thought since you can retain the RCM and preamp for your next TT upgrade without taking a big hit on selling the turntable later.

I am definitely thinking the same.
This current purchase will not be sold. Will be using it in my living room. The next TT will be going to the listening area in the basement. Much easier to control noise/vibrations.

[nocrapman]

I think pro-ject makes a great table for the money, but under $1k is their forte, with the carbon DC esprit you mention as the best bang for the buck. If you want to be under $1k, that's where I would go. Their phono stages (eg phono box s @ $200) is a good choice if you want something budget.

That eSpirit is pretty high on my list. Looks/WAF has to be high on this buy since this will be staying in the living room in a prominent location.
Otherwise the GEM polytable would have been a nobrainer.

[nocrapman]

I have been eyeing the Parasound Halo Integrated Amp. It checks all the boxes for me and helps me simplify the Living Room system.
The only hold up is the Phono section. Is that good enough? Or will I need a dedicated Phono amp regardless?

[jarcher]

This is definitely on the short list. How much work is needed before/after the machine is done with its thing from your experience?

Same as equivalents from vpi, nitty gritty, etc.  you'll still have to apply fluid and brush, but vacuum will take care of the clean up. If you don't do many cleanings fluid will usually evaporate in tank. Otherwise there's a spigot you put in, tilt, and empty.