Subwoofer Setup Tips & Tricks

quern · « **Reply #20 on:** 13 Feb 2005, 01:29 pm »

Hello All:

I just joined the site but have owned my Force sub for about two years. During these two years I have used it strictly in a "theater" sense. Recently I upgraded my Harman Kardon AVR-65 receiver to an Arcam AVR-300. The musicality difference between the two units is night and day! I began listening to CD's through my gear and realized that I have finally found a receiver that sounds fantastic for 2 channel music! I was listening to Norah Jones and her piano truely sounds like a piano. My new Arcam unit has a "stereo direct" only button that shuts down all DSP circutry so that I can listen to my CD's in their most pure state. Of course, in doing this I loose all that nice bottom end the Force provides...

So after looking at the ACI website I would like to confirm that I am reading the hookup correctly for using this unit for both HT and Stereo listening. It is my understanding that I should have my HT direct Input plugged in to the Force from my receivers LFE output, and also connect the Force Sub via the right and left line level inputs. Am I correct? Is there anything that I should know about what effects I may end up with when doing this? Should I use high pass filters in this setup also?

Any and all information is greatly appreciated!

Cheers!

Jerry

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #21 on:** 13 Feb 2005, 09:52 pm »

Jerry:

Congrats on your new Arcam, glad you're enjoying the system, that's what its all about . . .

You have the right idea for using the Force in two systems. Your HT subwoofer relative volume will be set in your processor. Your two-channel setup will be controled by the volume controls of the Force.

Enjoy!

quern · « **Reply #22 on:** 14 Feb 2005, 05:16 am »

Thanks Mr. Dzurko for confirming my thoughts so quickly! I'll work on getting my Force sub up an running in 2 channel over the next week.

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #23 on:** 14 Feb 2005, 12:37 pm »

Quote from: quern

Thanks Mr. Dzurko for confirming my thoughts so quickly! I'll work on getting my Force sub up an running in 2 channel over the next week.

Glad to help, let us know how it works out.

Have a great day!

kkalivoda · « **Reply #24 on:** 13 Jul 2006, 05:34 pm »

I've ordered the new Maestro XL and was wondering if the external amp had connections for both the LFE and the Left and Right to allow me to use this in HT/2Channel applications.

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #25 on:** 15 Jul 2006, 02:41 pm »

Quote from: kkalivoda on 13 Jul 2006, 05:34 pm

I've ordered the new Maestro XL and was wondering if the external amp had connections for both the LFE and the Left and Right to allow me to use this in HT/2Channel applications.

Congratulations . . . you will LOVE this sub. Here's a link so you can download the manual:

http://www.audioc.com/library1/manuals.htm

The short answer is that you have left and right inputs that you can use in many different ways

kkalivoda · « **Reply #26 on:** 20 Jul 2006, 03:05 pm »

Thanks Mike,

Yet another question. In another reply somewhere I mentioned that I crossover my main speakers in my processor at 80hz. My mains are Jag 2000's. I was wondering if I should use the crossover setting in the processor for my Maestro XL or should I use the crossover on the sub? My processor only allows me to select 80, 60, or 40hz for the sub. I will be connecting the sub using the sub-out from the processor.

Thanks,

Kyle

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #27 on:** 21 Jul 2006, 07:01 pm »

Quote from: kkalivoda on 20 Jul 2006, 03:05 pm

Thanks Mike,

Yet another question. In another reply somewhere I mentioned that I crossover my main speakers in my processor at 80hz. My mains are Jag 2000's. I was wondering if I should use the crossover setting in the processor for my Maestro XL or should I use the crossover on the sub? My processor only allows me to select 80, 60, or 40hz for the sub. I will be connecting the sub using the sub-out from the processor.

Thanks,

Kyle

Kyle:

Often it works very well to use both set to the same frequency. I'd try it both ways and see which way you get the best results . . . every system is different. Ears work great, but if you if some way to measure (like RatShack meter) it makes it even easier

kkalivoda · « **Reply #28 on:** 25 Jul 2006, 06:43 pm »

Groovy...

Here's my plan to hookup my Maestro. Please kick me if I have it wrong. I will buy a Y adapter and plug that into the right channel input of the subs amp. I will plug the line level adapters into the amp, left channel into the left input on the amp and the right channel into one of the 2 inputs of the Y adapter that's plugged into the right channel of the amp. I will then also plug the Sub output from my processor into the other input of the Y adapter. I will then use the sub volume control to set the level for 2 channel and the processors sub level control for mutli channel stuff. My only uncertainty is the crossover setup. Should I have the subs crossover on bypass, and when watching movies would the line level inputs cause the sub to become overwhelming?

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #29 on:** 26 Jul 2006, 05:06 pm »

Quote from: kkalivoda on 25 Jul 2006, 06:43 pm

Groovy...

Here's my plan to hookup my Maestro. Please kick me if I have it wrong. I will buy a Y adapter and plug that into the right channel input of the subs amp. I will plug the line level adapters into the amp, left channel into the left input on the amp and the right channel into one of the 2 inputs of the Y adapter that's plugged into the right channel of the amp. I will then also plug the Sub output from my processor into the other input of the Y adapter. I will then use the sub volume control to set the level for 2 channel and the processors sub level control for mutli channel stuff. My only uncertainty is the crossover setup. Should I have the subs crossover on bypass, and when watching movies would the line level inputs cause the sub to become overwhelming?

You won't need Y-adapters . . . just plug the sub out from the processor into the sub in on the Maestro amp. I would experiment with using bypass vs. setting the Maestro's crossover at the same frequency as your processor . . .

kkalivoda · « **Reply #30 on:** 28 Jul 2006, 04:55 pm »

Thanks Mike and TJK for your advice.

Could I get you guys to look at my first attempt to graph the frequency response of my Maestro Xl? The link below is a snapshot of the Excel Gray. My Maestro XL has about 60 break-in hours and it’s sounding so groovy. I used the test CD that you guy shipped me and plotted the readouts from my digital Radio Shack DPL meter. I have attached a copy of the Excel spreadsheet to hopefully shed some light on what I’m looking at. My SPL meter was mounted on a trip-pod pointed up towards the ceiling at about a 45 degree angle. The power amp for my main and surround speakers was off. I played the 60hz tone and turned up the volume setting for the sub in my processor until the SPL meter read 70db. I then went from 20hz on up. The sub is placed about 8” in front of a wall but it’s not corner loaded. I’m using the sub out from my processor and the crossover is set to 80hz. I’m not sure why I see the lower frequencies at a higher db. If anybody out there could look at my spreadsheet and give me some advise or let me know whether or not my response it acceptable that would be great. This is my first real sub so I’m learning as I go.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=gallery;area=browse;album=789&pos=1

DanielHahn · « **Reply #31 on:** 12 Feb 2008, 06:44 pm »

hello my name is daniel and i have a sledge hammer box that fits 2 MTX 10 inch subwoofers and i have a 4 channel pioneer. my question is ...i bought a compacitor that is 500k but my lights still go dim what could this problem be? do i need a bigger compacitor ?.. and would the gauge of the ground wire affect this.??

thank you for taking the time to read my question your expertise would help me out alot
DAN

mcgsxr · « **Reply #32 on:** 12 Feb 2008, 09:59 pm »

Hello Dan, I see that you are asking a car audio question, in what you may not know is a home audio forum.

With respect to your question though (as I have played around for years with that stuff too!) is I would review the wire gauge, and cap size. The gauge of both positive and ground should be the same, and should be at least 4g in my estimation.

Good luck!

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #33 on:** 12 Feb 2008, 11:56 pm »

Thanks Mark

griller · « **Reply #34 on:** 15 Feb 2008, 05:08 pm »

I put an Aurelex Subdude under the Force XL in my HT. It definitely decreased the amount of bass that penetrates into the rooms below. I can play louder and later without disturbing others now.

actuarysam · « **Reply #35 on:** 18 Mar 2008, 04:32 pm »

Mike, I was wondering why you don't recommend using the hi-pass output of the Force XL sub for connecting to the Sapphire XLs. I've been using y-connectors previously, but I tried this hookup and in initial listening it sounded pretty good. Thanks SG

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #36 on:** 18 Mar 2008, 05:07 pm »

Quote from: actuarysam on 18 Mar 2008, 04:32 pm

Mike, I was wondering why you don't recommend using the hi-pass output of the Force XL sub for connecting to the Sapphire XLs. I've been using y-connectors previously, but I tried this hookup and in initial listening it sounded pretty good. Thanks SG

SG:

If it works for you, that's cool.

That highpass is an inexpensive IC based circuit that is not completely transparent. Eventually it will be eliminated but there is still a large stock of PC boards and metal work that have it. I prefer and recommend the separate passive filters

Samg · « **Reply #37 on:** 14 Apr 2008, 02:37 pm »

I've experimented with all of the possible subwoofer hookups (Force XL and Sapphire XL). Until very recently, though, I had not tried using the speaker-level output from the main amps along with the the supplied RCA converters to fit the Sub, mainly due to laziness to splice the wire to the connectors. Someone suggested I try it, as he found that there were phase problems when line-level input is going straight to the sub, but through amps and then speaker wire to the mains.
Sure enough, I found much better coherence, tightness and integration by using speaker-level input out of my amp into the sub. I recommend that everyone try this hookup.

Mike Dzurko · « **Reply #38 on:** 15 Apr 2008, 12:12 am »

A perfect example of why it is smart to try all the options (this is usually true of most audio situations). Sure it takes time, but only YOU can determine what sounds best to you in your system and your room. Thanks for sharing!

NewBuyer · « **Reply #39 on:** 23 Aug 2008, 04:12 am »

Quote from: Samg on 14 Apr 2008, 02:37 pm

...Until very recently, though, I had not tried using the speaker-level output from the main amps along with the the supplied RCA converters to fit the Sub, mainly due to laziness to splice the wire to the connectors. Someone suggested I try it, as he found that there were phase problems when line-level input is going straight to the sub, but not through amps and then speaker wire to the mains.
Sure enough, I found much better coherence, tightness and integration by using speaker-level input out of my amp into the sub. I recommend that everyone try this hookup.

Just wanted to mention: Like Samg above, I have also only recently tried the high-level to RCA converters, mostly out of laziness since I was happy with the sound through the Force XL's RCA inputs.

Rather than attach a connector, I just stripped about 2" from the bare-wire end (leaving the tinned ends intact), wrapped each stripped end around an amp output post, and tightened down accordingly (just like you would do with spade connectors). I then used an RCA coupling adapter and some short RCA leads to the Force XL.

Much better sound now! Exactly as Samg described above. I had no idea it would really make a big difference, but somehow it does. My only guess (besides the phase idea that Samg mentioned above) is that it may provide a more optimum impedance connection - since the Force XL RCA input impedance is 10k ohms, the speaker level converters are 22k ohms, and the source (amp) output impedance is different too. But who knows!

Subwoofer Setup Tips & Tricks

DanielHahn

Samg