[wushuliu]

my problem is the the tonality is not right in my system.
my reference would be a listening session some years ago with audionote japan electronics and Harbeth 40.1 and dCS CD player. its not that i expect that sound in my budget system with no acoustic treatment and imperfect placement. I dont expect the same sound but i want to get the tone right.

it sounds too digital. too dull. im specially not happy with how high frequcies are rendered. i want to get the same sense of space and openness and resolution without these shrill highs that surprisingly are more pronounced and therefor annoying with hi rez music. like my 96khz flaming lips CD is unlistenable though all these DACs in my system.

Ok, my thought is if your reference point is such a high level it would probably help to share exactly what your gear is. To get what you're looking for is going to need more than a change in a single component. And if you're wanting anything even remotely close to that for under 400, even if it's just tone... you might have your work cut out for you. My short answer would be you need to get an NOS dac. For your budget the only one I've heard that is well made and doesn't require modding is this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Non-Oversampling-NOS-DAC-TDA1543-DIR9001-SPDIF-Coax-Optical-dual-9V-NiMH-w-charg-/201003880227?hash=item2eccc3cf23:g:3kIAAMXQVT9Sq1xa



He has a cheaper version without an enclosure I believe and more expensive ones w/ usb. The TDA chip will give you that 'analog' warmth I think you are looking for. For that budget you are not going to get anywhere close to your reference gear, but hopefully tonally in the same ballpark. What's important is that this is well designed for the cost.

If you really want to get next level performance out of that dac (or any with coax) I cannot recommend getting the Singxer F-1 converter enough. That plus this DAC should come in just a hair over your budget.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/F-1-XMOS-USB-Digital-Interface-Module-XU208-U8-upgraded-version-/111961717820?hash=item1a11703c3c:g:UI0AAOSwAvJXBdC1

[*Scotty*]

Dadbeh, it's probably time to try some good Schiit. You have 15 days to return a product from them if you don't like it.
 About Chinese dacs found on Amazon or eBay. Virtually all of them have no original R&D involved in their design. Their circuit design is most frequently the factory recommended implementation straight from the application notes. While this factory recommended circuit design will work it may not be the best sounding approach and there is no original thought involved.
 It's basically one from column A, one from column B and so on. Include the current audio buzzword parts, put it all in a fancy case with a thick aluminum face plate and you're done.  You might get lucky or you may go through a lot these cookie cutter dacs until you find a winner.
 As far as the ESS based DACs are concerned see AURALiC's President and CEO Xuanqian Wang's comments about the inadequacies of the ESS DAC chip data sheets quoted here from the Sixmoons review of the Auralic Vega,("The DAC's power supply was revised several times to meet true bit-resolution requirements. The most difficult part during this development was figuring out how to best harness the ES9018. Its datasheet is an error-riddled nightmare with lots of vital information missing. We would like to openly thank everyone on diyaudio.com for their help on how to wring the most performance from this freaky chip.) http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/auralic5/2.html
You can see why companies using an ESS Sabre DAC chip in their products may have sub-optimal results.
Scotty

[wushuliu]

For the record, the DAC i recommend above is made by a frenchman 

It's certainly worth it to try a Schiit, but based on Dadbeh's reference point neither the AK chip they use nor the ESS chip sound would, IMO, fall under what he's looking for tonally.

[wushuliu]

Here's a video by the designer of the TDA dac. He is not just copying schematics:

https://youtu.be/lLawl2ApKgw

[*Scotty*]

That's where that 15 day return option comes in handy. I was thinking the multi-bit Bifrost at $599 might be to his liking.
Scotty

[wushuliu]

That's where that 15 day return option comes in handy. I was thinking the multi-bit Bifrost at $599 might be to his liking.
Scotty

Yes, I'd be curious about the multibit. Over his budget though, I think.

[restrav]

Ok, my thought is if your reference point is such a high level it would probably help to share exactly what your gear is. To get what you're looking for is going to need more than a change in a single component. And if you're wanting anything even remotely close to that for under 400, even if it's just tone... you might have your work cut out for you. My short answer would be you need to get an NOS dac. For your budget the only one I've heard that is well made and doesn't require modding is this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Non-Oversampling-NOS-DAC-TDA1543-DIR9001-SPDIF-Coax-Optical-dual-9V-NiMH-w-charg-/201003880227?hash=item2eccc3cf23:g:3kIAAMXQVT9Sq1xa



He has a cheaper version without an enclosure I believe and more expensive ones w/ usb. The TDA chip will give you that 'analog' warmth I think you are looking for. For that budget you are not going to get anywhere close to your reference gear, but hopefully tonally in the same ballpark. What's important is that this is well designed for the cost.

If you really want to get next level performance out of that dac (or any with coax) I cannot recommend getting the Singxer F-1 converter enough. That plus this DAC should come in just a hair over your budget.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/F-1-XMOS-USB-Digital-Interface-Module-XU208-U8-upgraded-version-/111961717820?hash=item1a11703c3c:g:UI0AAOSwAvJXBdC1

what about this?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/LITE-Audio-DAC-AH-D-A-converter-Processor-TDA1543-x8-/131024614436?hash=item1e81acf424:m:mQlK7VTWWC_cewJsJv7UMbw

[wushuliu]

what about this?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/LITE-Audio-DAC-AH-D-A-converter-Processor-TDA1543-x8-/131024614436?hash=item1e81acf424:m:mQlK7VTWWC_cewJsJv7UMbw

Direct from China caveats still apply re: possible mods needed to improve. But sure, give it a shot.

I know the French dac I mentioned isn't sexy, but it's a very good dac, especially with the battery option.

[wushuliu]

Wait, Dadbeh did you say you already tried the Ifi Idac? I think you mentioned 'peachtree idac', so I'm confused. If you haven't tried the IDAC2 or IDSD micro then for a new retail dac with the sound you are looking for those are great options thanks to the Burr Brown chip they use. And the IFI 'house sound' is a very refined, smooth, analog. The IFI are hands down the best new dacs under <$500 of the ones I've heard over the past few years, and I've heard a bunch. If that sound is still not your cup of tea, then I would recommend NOS fare like the TDA1543 dacs...

[restrav]

Wait, Dadbeh did you say you already tried the Ifi Idac? I think you mentioned 'peachtree idac', so I'm confused. If you haven't tried the IDAC2 or IDSD micro then for a new retail dac with the sound you are looking for those are great options thanks to the Burr Brown chip they use. And the IFI 'house sound' is a very refined, smooth, analog. The IFI are hands down the best new dacs under <$500 of the ones I've heard over the past few years, and I've heard a bunch. If that sound is still not your cup of tea, then I would recommend NOS fare like the TDA1543 dacs...

is there fake ifi products on ebay? im asking because there is a big price difference between the same DAC from different sellers and also a lot of sellers from HongKong which is always alarming

[wushuliu]

is there fake ifi products on ebay? im asking because there is a big price difference between the same DAC from different sellers and also a lot of sellers from HongKong which is always alarming

Doubt they are fakes, seems like it would be expensive to replicate their enclosures and logo. Probably just cheaper because it's direct. You can ask IFI, they are very responsive. If you are looking for an iDAC2, I will be selling mine shortly (going to diy a soekris dac).

[charmerci]

Doubt they are fakes, seems like it would be expensive to replicate their enclosures and logo. Probably just cheaper because it's direct. You can ask IFI, they are very responsive. If you are looking for an iDAC2, I will be selling mine shortly (going to diy a soekris dac).

But often the Chinese manufacturers will sell them directly, bypassing the American companies' shipping, retailers, profit margins, etc. Hence the price difference.

[lacro]

This thread is timely for me. My Schiit Modi USB dac burned out recently. I don't know why, it just smoked; destroyed the board, so no fixing it. I thought Schiit might sell me a new board, but no luck - they don't sell parts? Anyway I need a new DAC. Actually my PC's motherboard DAC doesn't sound any different than the Modi? I want something better, but no more Schiit.

How does the volume control on the IFI - MICRO IDAC2 work, is it for the headphone amp only or does control all outputs including the RCA outs (analog), and is it a good VC?

Is this bundle a good deal? http://www.musicdirect.com/p-343092-ifi-micro-idac2-ipurifier-bundle.aspx

[wushuliu]

This thread is timely for me. My Schiit Modi USB dac burned out recently. I don't know why, it just smoked; destroyed the board, so no fixing it. I thought Schiit might sell me a new board, but no luck - they don't sell parts? Anyway I need a new DAC. Actually my PC's motherboard DAC doesn't sound any different than the Modi? I want something better, but no more Schiit.

How does the volume control on the IFI - MICRO IDAC2 work, is it for the headphone amp only or does control all outputs including the RCA outs (analog), and is it a good VC?

Is this bundle a good deal? http://www.musicdirect.com/p-343092-ifi-micro-idac2-ipurifier-bundle.aspx

The VC works for the headphone out only on the IDAC2. It's good, on warm soft side due to the Elna Silmics. Not going to replace a good separate preamp. The IDAC2 is designed more for direct out.

[restrav]

I just paid for an Audiomirror D1 which is a DAC-AH with fancy case and maybe some upgraded caps.
so basically a non usb NOS 1453 with 8 parallel DAC chips. very cheap and cheerful though

[restrav]

if this doesnt get rid of that digital glare and help with the tonality, im going straight for tube DAC

[rodge827]

if this doesnt get rid of that digital glare and help with the tonality, im going straight for tube DAC

I just received my Starting Point Systems Dac3 and it sounds fantastic! I purchased it on eBay a couple of weeks ago for $182.00 + $19.00 ship from Paris.
I have tried it in my system with and without an iFi iTube and like it either way. For now I listening without the iTube to get familiar with its sound which so far is very good. Tubes aren't always the answer, if a tube stage is a lousy one then the sound will reflect it.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/USB-SPDIF-Non-Oversampling-NOS-DAC-TDA1543-DIR9001-2x9V-NiMH-powers-from-USB/201598290159?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20131003132420%26meid%3D8ed6b31f9e8e4fb8b6499793f3a2a456%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D201486642344


 

[restrav]

Huh, that's a lot of praise, Wushiliu also was very enthusiastic about this and the reason that i went for a 1543 in the first place was his praise but I was hesitant because:

1 - i liked to buy a DAC witohut USB so i can use my own USB solution like F-1 or some DIY XCORE200
2 - the video that he posted from the guy who makes them was surpsingly light on technical details and he was basically repeating the tag line that other than phillips in the 80's no one else knows how to design a DAC chip for reasons unknown.
3 - it looks awful. butt ugly.
4 - the circuit looked spartan to me. not that it is a good or bad thing. i just wasnt sure to make of it.
5 - the ebay entry has just one pic. not even one from the connectors

but with this much praise im really curious so actually i am bidding on one right now

[restrav]

I got it today and my search for DAC in over. sounds lovely. next step power conditioner and if i can do something for the accoustics of the damn living room



I also built an AC cable using Fake chinses Oyaide plugs and DH LABS AC cable and it definitely didnt hurt anything.
also I got an Audiomirror AC cable which again is not hurting anuthing.

I finished my AQ Type 1 speaker cable with chinese banana plugs and I also have  a crackin' Neotech 3003 RCA interconnect. overall everything sounds good now for the first time in a while. im happy.

[wushuliu]

I got it today and my search for DAC in over. sounds lovely. next step power conditioner and if i can do something for the accoustics of the damn living room



I also built an AC cable using Fake chinses Oyaide plugs and DH LABS AC cable and it definitely didnt hurt anything.
also I got an Audiomirror AC cable which again is not hurting anuthing.

I finished my AQ Type 1 speaker cable with chinese banana plugs and I also have  a crackin' Neotech 3003 RCA interconnect. overall everything sounds good now for the first time in a while. im happy.

Classy looking piece of kit.