OB H-Frame / A370PEQ / HX800 amp Box Flat Packs / Finished Cabs

Captainhemo · « **Reply #400 on:** 14 Nov 2018, 06:17 pm »

Quote from: undertowogt1 on 14 Nov 2018, 05:42 pm

Just curious on pricing, maybe this was answered already. Does pr duals mean a PAIR of Dual flat packs? Or is it 750 dollars for 1 Dual Flat Pack?

That is for the pair. there is additional costs for the amp boxes and grill frames if wanted, prices are in the same post you quoted above....
Let me know if you have any other ? 's
We're a bit backed up right now so a bit of a lag but we're getting there

jay

rajdude · « **Reply #401 on:** 19 Nov 2018, 09:04 pm »

Hello everyone,
My first post in AudioCircle forums, but have been lurking around for a couple of weeks now.
(Apologies in advance, if this is not the correct thread for my post. Please move my thread or guide me where to post such a question.)

Short post: Is it possible to audition these subwoofers somewhere nearby? I am in northern VA, Washington, DC's suburbs and am willing to drive an hour or even two.

Long version: I am very curious about these OB subwoofers. I recently moved and now my Magnepan 3.6r speakers are setup in a 20x13 living room with two large openings (5' and 6' to foyer and dining room respectively). Looking to augment the bass of the maggies, which is practically non existent in this living room

I know, it is too big and too many openings to pressurize easily. My kit is very old...the Maggies are fed by a couple of Bryston 200wpc monoblocks sitting behind the maggies. Balanced cables are connected to an old Anthem AVM 20 pre-pro with DSP bypassed. Meridian 588 CD player and Rega P3 turntable are the sources. I know, I know, I need a proper 2-channel pre-amp. This setup is only for 2 channel music. I have another room for movies. I have an old Velodyne sub (DD12 I think), which died right after we moved. The plate amp is dead. Looking to repair it, eventually.

Anyway, I have read through quite a lot about these OB subwoofers....but being a bass head, I worry about the OB design not having enough output. When I talk to box sub dealers and manufacturers, they all say OB design does not have low bass, it only has mid bass....which is kinda true of my maggies. So without actually hearing the OB design, it would be impossible for me to buy (and build) these OB subwoofers.
I am looking for a "fast" sub which has tight bass. I have looked at sealed box designs from REL, SVS and HSU. I have auditioned REL and SVS. I found SVS to be good for movies, but not particularly good for music on planar - magnetic speakers like my magnepans. I found it a little boomy. REL was good but was too expensive for a small, single sub. I am looking for a pair of subs this time.

What should I do?

Thanks
Raj

mlundy57 · « **Reply #402 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 02:08 am »

While the mid bass comment may be true of the OB subs they heard, it is not true of these servo OB subs. To go with your Maggies you want a pair of the triple 12” driver H-Frames. I built a pair of triple OB subs with 8” drivers for a client with Maggie 3.7s. He loved the bass but would have preferred the 12” drivers if he had room for them.

You’re welcome to listen to mine. I’m in the Tulsa, OK area if it works for you.

Mike

Danny Richie · « **Reply #403 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 02:24 am »

Quote from: rajdude on 19 Nov 2018, 09:04 pm

Anyway, I have read through quite a lot about these OB subwoofers....but being a bass head, I worry about the OB design not having enough output. When I talk to box sub dealers and manufacturers, they all say OB design does not have low bass, it only has mid bass....which is kinda true of my maggies. So without actually hearing the OB design, it would be impossible for me to buy (and build) these OB subwoofers.
I am looking for a "fast" sub which has tight bass. I have looked at sealed box designs from REL, SVS and HSU. I have auditioned REL and SVS. I found SVS to be good for movies, but not particularly good for music on planar - magnetic speakers like my magnepans. I found it a little boomy. REL was good but was too expensive for a small, single sub. I am looking for a pair of subs this time.

What should I do?

Thanks
Raj

Typical OB woofers are just as they say. The servo subs are very different. They produce a lot of output and are flat to 20Hz. And nothing is faster or really compares in any way. And nothing will blend as seamless and easy to your Maggies.

Rich Hollis is in Callaway, VA. He has a set of doubles and a set of towers with six per side.

HAL · « **Reply #404 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 02:42 am »

Raj,
Danny is close.

It is Callaway, MD, about 2 hours south of NoVA.

I wish you had asked this in time for CAF2018 in early Nov. in Rockville when I had The Monoliths with OB servo 2x12's setup in the HAL room for the show.

In the middle of getting the two systems setup again, so will be Dec before they are both running again, but not that far away.

Luckily the line array setup can be configured with 2x12, 3x12, 4x12 and 6x12 OB servo setups with the HX300's and HX800's servo amps I have. Probably closer to the Maggie 3.6's than the smaller setup.

PM me and we can discuss dates in Dec if you are interested.

HAL
aka Rich

Danny Richie · « **Reply #405 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 03:18 pm »

Quote

Danny is close. It is Callaway, MD, about 2 hours south of NoVA.

Oooops, I knew that.

rajdude · « **Reply #406 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 03:37 pm »

Thanks for the responses, guys. I appreciate it.

So Rich, you are probably the closest guy (who has these OB subs) to me, right? Around 2 hours drive. I could do that. Will PM you when I have enough posts here. I am definitely interested and thanks for the audition offer. BTW, are you an audio equipment dealer? If yes, what else do you sell?

I just spent an hour going through all the 21 pages of this thread. Gleaned quite a bit of info.
I am curious of placement of these OB subs. Do they have to be right besides the main speakers, like most photos I see here? Can't they be hidden like regular subs? If not why? Do you guys cross them over too high to the mains? In my talks with HSU guys, they recommend that their subs be placed as close as possible to the listening position, maybe right besides the couch/chair. They say that will give the best mid-low bass thump in (say) dance music, I like dance music

Also, I read that these need to be at least 3' out from the back wall. Now that will definitely not fly in my living room, from the WAF perspective. I would like these to be approx. 6" away from the back wall. Is that a no-no?

I was thinking if I get/build these OBs, I would like to place them right behind my Maggies (3.6 are large enough to "kinda" hide these OBs.

-Raj

Danny Richie · « **Reply #407 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 04:39 pm »

Quote

I would like these to be approx. 6" away from the back wall. Is that a no-no?

Think of a traditional sub as a piston that forces pressure changes within the room.

Then the open baffle subs quickly push air from one side of the room to the other without loading the room. So they do need to be out into the room to achieve that.

Captainhemo · « **Reply #408 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 04:58 pm »

I was going to nominate Rich but I see it's already been done

If you head up to his place, hopefully you'll be able to have a listen to both the 2 x12's and 6x12's he's got. You'll be able to see our modular setup which can be configured from 2x12 up to 6 x12's. As you likely noticed in this thread, 2x12 and 3x12's are also available in a non-modular design.

Yes, for guys crossing at higher frequencies, keeping the subs close to the mans is a good idea as the sound becomes driectinal. for the lower cross over points, getting them further away is possible. You don't want these subs beside you, the dipole design creates nulls to the side so yo u basically want them shooting straight down the room. Bass impact will not be an issue .
6" from the front wall is not enough. 3' is generally considered the "minimum" but people have had pretty good sucess with a bit less.
These subs are fast, accurate, and play very low but don't creat the typical "
room boom" that many are used to. They can take a bit of getting used to but once you do, there's no going back

jay

HAL · « **Reply #409 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 05:14 pm »

Quote from: rajdude on 20 Nov 2018, 03:37 pm

Thanks for the responses, guys. I appreciate it.

So Rich, you are probably the closest guy (who has these OB subs) to me, right? Around 2 hours drive. I could do that. Will PM you when I have enough posts here. I am definitely interested and thanks for the audition offer. BTW, are you an audio equipment dealer? If yes, what else do you sell?

I just spent an hour going through all the 21 pages of this thread. Gleaned quite a bit of info.
I am curious of placement of these OB subs. Do they have to be right besides the main speakers, like most photos I see here? Can't they be hidden like regular subs? If not why? Do you guys cross them over too high to the mains? In my talks with HSU guys, they recommend that their subs be placed as close as possible to the listening position, maybe right besides the couch/chair. They say that will give the best mid-low bass thump in (say) dance music, I like dance music

Also, I read that these need to be at least 3' out from the back wall. Now that will definitely not fly in my living room, from the WAF perspective. I would like these to be approx. 6" away from the back wall. Is that a no-no?

I was thinking if I get/build these OBs, I would like to place them right behind my Maggies (3.6 are large enough to "kinda" hide these OBs.

-Raj

Raj,
Sent you a PM with the info you asked about.

Danny and Jay's advice is excellent for correct setup of the OB servo subs. You do not want to hide them behind the Maggies.

Rich

mlundy57 · « **Reply #410 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 07:11 pm »

The OB subs will be the best match for your Maggies bar none. However, If there is no way you can get them far enough away from the wall to work properly, the next best option is Danny’s sealed servo sub, especially if you build the sandbox cabinet.

Danny’s sealed servo subs use the same servo control as the OB subs. They are just as fast and accurate as the OB subs but they load the room differently.

With your Maggies the crossover point will be low enough you can place the subs away from the Maggies, as with any sealed sub. Between the servo control and adjustibility of the amp you can dial these in to blend very well with the Maggies. All servo controlled subs are not the same. I auditioned many sealed servo subs from different manufacturers for my living room HT/music system and the Rythmik/GR sub was hands down the best. I used one with Danny’s Wedgie OB speakers for close to a year before building OB subs.

Again, the OB subs will blend the best because you would be using di-pole bass with di-pole mids and highs (like with like). The sealed sub is a compramise. A very good compramise, but a compramise none the less.

Keep an open mind and lidten to Rich’s speakers. Just know there is a very good option if the best one won’t work for you.

Mike

rajdude · « **Reply #411 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 07:59 pm »

Thanks for the replies guys,

Rich, I got your PM. Thanks. Once you have the rig setup, please let me know. I would like to come hear it.

Mike, I like that option also. I think it would be best if I find someone nearby willing to give me a demo of Danny's servo subs. Checking if there is a thread for those kind of subs.
I know Rhythmik makes fully built servo subs, presumably using same or very similar tech. But again, they are an internet only seller.........so I cannot go to a store or showroom to check them out

I do have a really old Velodyne Servo Sub, a FS12. It recently died but I remember its bass was always tight. That model is from 1995 and of course, its servo tech would probably be no match to modern servo sub technologies.

-Raj

mlundy57 · « **Reply #412 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 08:29 pm »

Raj,

The prebuilt version of Danny's sub is the Rythmik F12G. The only difference is it would not be in a sandbox cabinet.

It's true you can't go to a store to hear one, but Rythmik has a money back 30 day trial period. I couldn't listen to the Rythmik before I bought it either but with the guarantee I figured I didn't have anything to lose. I was ready to pull the trigger on a $2,500 sub when I ordered the Rythmik. The Rythmik outclassed it so I got a better sub and saved a lot of money.

Have fun at Rich's.

Mike

HAL · « **Reply #413 on:** 20 Nov 2018, 09:45 pm »

Raj,

Will do!

Rich

studley · « **Reply #414 on:** 30 Nov 2018, 09:39 am »

What is the usable FR of the dual driver version please? To be more specific, how high do they go before the FR rolls off, gets lumpy or loses refinement?

Captainhemo · « **Reply #415 on:** 30 Nov 2018, 05:26 pm »

Using the 12db / oc slope, Danny has crossed them in numerous designs around the 200 hz mark

mkane · « **Reply #416 on:** 20 Dec 2018, 11:49 pm »

Bought a pair of H frames from Jay. Dealing with him via e-mail was a real pleasure. The box is still sealed. It will probably be after the Holidays before I get to it. Thank's again.

Captainhemo · « **Reply #417 on:** 21 Dec 2018, 05:20 pm »

I think you had a 2nd box arrive yesterday

Not sure how the 2 boxes got separated, they usually arrive together.
Happy Holidays

jay

mkane · « **Reply #418 on:** 21 Dec 2018, 06:17 pm »

Picked that box up this morning, thanks

mkane · « **Reply #419 on:** 21 Dec 2018, 06:37 pm »

I was going to use AE Dipole woofers for this build but, I've changed my mind. Servo Sub kit is the surefire way to go IMO. I need help deciding which kit. I'm thinking kit #4. I'll need a pair of boxes Jay.