[SteveFord]

For the past few years my shoulder joints have been killing me and it's just gotten worse and worse. I ran out of vitamins a year or so back and temporarily took some of my wife's Centrex Vitamins For Women and it made the pain worse. I went back to my regular Centrex or Equate vitamins and my shoulders ache, creak and pop but not nearly so bad.  I move my neck and you can hear it cracking from three feet away.

 This week it was really bad so I decided to stop taking vitamins altogether and you know what? My shoulders are doing much better.

 I'm thinking that there's something in the vitamins that I REALLY don't need. Any ideas what it might be?

[mresseguie]

Steve,

I can't speak to your vitamins and joint pain correlation. However, there is a supplement I've been taking for a few years that doesn't seem to make me feel worse and does seem to make me feel better. I'm sure there are other brand names, but I get mine from Costco (usually online shopping). It is called Celadrin. It comes in capsule form as well as a creme form. I initially began taking another brand at my chiropractor's recommendation, but switched over to Celadrin because it was something like half the cost. As I understand it, the primary active ingredients are fatty acids. They are both the active ingredient and the vehicle to get them into the body.

I believe I benefit from taking three capsules each day.

Information:

(From the company's website) Celadrin® is an all natural proprietary ingredient, that has been clinically proven to reduce pain and rapidly promote joint health, improving flexibility and mobility. Clinically studied at various times in Vivo, it has been published twice in the prestigious Journal of Rheumatology.

Available for oral and topical applications, Celadrin's beneficial effects have been proven superior in results to Glucosamine, Chondroitin, MSM, SAMe and other arthritic medications.

http://www.celadrininfo.com

http://www.totalhealthmagazine.com/Vitamins-and-Supplements/Stamp-Out-Pain-and-Inflammation-with-Clinically-Tested-Celadrin.html

Best of luck. YMMV.

Michael

[RDavidson]

Not sure what in your vitamins would do that.
I suggest talking to a pharmacist and/or a doctor.
It's possible that you're getting too much of a vitamin or mineral (in addition to what is in your normal daily diet) and it is causing inflammation.

[mlundy57]

Not a vitamin, but joint pain caused by an inflammatory condition (such as arthritis) can be lessened by getting enough long chain Omega 3 fatty acids. These usually come from eating cold water fatty fish such as salmon, tuna, mackerel, trout, sardines, etc. However, you can also get them from fish oil supplements.

Be sure the company who makes the supplements is reputable and you are getting what the label says is in the capsules. A 1,000mg or 1,200mg capsule has about as much of the Omega 3 EPA and DHA as 1oz of salmon. So three capsules would provide as much EPA and DHA as a 3oz serving of salmon. The minimum recommendation is two 3oz servings per week so 1 capsule a day would provide this amount of EPA and DHA. You can take more without any harmful effects. 3 capsules a day would be like eating 1 serving of salmon a day.

The reason the Omega 3's help the pain is two fold. First, Omega 3's are anti-inflammatory. Second, certain substances the body makes in response to inflammation are less potent when made from Omega 3's and as such cause less pain.

Additional benefits of Omega 3's are that they thin the blood and reduce triglycerides (part of the cholesterol panel).

EPA and DHA are not the only long chain Omega 3's that are beneficial but most fish oil capsules may only contain these two (in the US anyway). To make sure I get all the Omega 3 benefit I use salmon oil capsules (the entire 1,000mg of oil in the capsule is from salmon). This way I get the EPA and DHA as well as the other healthy Omega 3's.

If you have problems with fishy tasting burps, get capsules that are enterically coated. These are designed to dissolve in the intestines rather than the stomach, so no fishy burps.

Mike

[Folsom]

It's possible something in the vitamins were bad for you, just as much as it's possible something was good for you. Sometimes being healthy comes at a cost that isn't pleasant at first.

However it's possible there's something bad in it for you. Let me give an example of something people aren't familiar with... When people are getting sick they like to consume a lot of vitamin C. But most common cheaper (especially non-health food brands) derive it from corn. The benefits are offset by the bad affects corn have on almost everyone.

Centrum women's vitamin has a lot of corn in it, and a hydrogenated oil (poison). It also has tin, which is weird. But tin and nickle might be bad for someone that has trouble getting rid of heavy metals. But Centrum's men simply has less of the same ingredients it appears. The big question is if taking nothing would be more or less similar to Centrum.

My recommendation, take something that's not shitty. But I also recommend eating healthy for your phenotype... Anyway, if you want something for your joints this is one of the best things I've seen and used. And if you want a multivitamin and that's it, then I know this is made at exceptional quality. It contains the methyl version of B12 for example, that is bioactive, doesn't use cyanide, and even stops glaucoma for a high percentage of people. Those that take vitamins by D'Adamo typically take reduces doses to achieve what they need. The man takes special care to make sure no nutrients are cooked during the process of manufacturing - that's not true of many expensive brands that are considered good.

[Rob Babcock]

I think most research shows that vitamin supplements are a waste of money.  Non-chelated vitamins have very low levels of bioavailabilty; they pass right through you without being absorbed.  Some brands do work better but getting the vitamins and minerals you need from food is usually a better idea.

This maybe has nothing to do with your situation but my knee pain quit when I started weight training.  In my case the pain was probably weak muscles in the joints and stabilizing areas.  Back pain often responds well to strength training that strengthens the back and shoulder muscles. 

[Jumpin]

Try a Cortisone shot.  Worked miracles on my elbow.  Knees not so much but they are really shot!

Mark

[SteveFord]

Oddly enough, 3 days of no multivitamins and my shoulders feel just fine and this is after years of pain.  Even putting on a jacket was a big deal.  My neck, arm sockets and shoulder blades were all just creaking and popping and it felt like things were rubbing together in there. 
I figured I would be up for some sort of surgery next year because I'm getting old and falling apart but luckily nope!
Even my ankles are better and both of those suffered some trauma - nothing ever happened to my arms or neck.

So much for taking my daily vitamin to try and be healthy.

[Hugh]

Good info here as I am not young anymore.

Thanks for sharing.

[Folsom]

Vitamins can be very good for you, if you need them. But again the detriment, as seen here, by common vitamins makes it not even worth it.

If you have normal levels of stomach acid and eat a varied diet you're probably getting about everything. When you get real old the stomach doesn't do nearly as well. Other conditions may have affects on it too.

Rob only certain things can be chetalated (minerals). But there's truth to the idea. For example you can take bioactive version of many B vitamins, and folic acid. This is without a doubt valuable to someone with several mutated MTHFR genes; and they're more common than you might think.

[Big Red Machine]

I think most research shows that vitamin supplements are a waste of money.  Non-chelated vitamins have very low levels of bioavailabilty; they pass right through you without being absorbed. 

YOu nailed it. Bad vitamins give all vitamins a bad name. These are lovingly referred to as bed-pan pills. Pass thru because they are coated in cellulose quite often and do not break down in the stomach.

That's why I take, and swear by:

[bummrush]

As for vitamins. A suggestion from me is go straight to the Freeda vitamins  and see what you  can find out.I'm  biased.But i dont know if their is a better quality and price anywhere near what they make..Really take a lookm   

[JerryM]

It seems to me you're seeing a lot of MDs and Staff right now.

Given the same circumstance, I'd ask every single one of them their thoughts. I wouldn't let any one of them *run away* with that Doctor shit and run tests or make referrals. I'd ask, though. And I'd listen.

[Devil Doc]

My guess and only a guess is calcium. Women need it; men not so much. My recommendation? See an orthopod. Asking for medical advice on an audiophile forum is not prudent.

Doc

[JerryM]

... Asking for medical advice on an audiophile forum is not prudent....

It's tantamount to asking for audiophile advice on a medical forum. 

[Folsom]

My guess and only a guess is calcium. Women need it; men not so much. My recommendation? See an orthopod. Asking for medical advice on an audiophile forum is not prudent.

Doc

Interesting since the Men's version has 10mg more than the Women's, in the specific vitamins he was taking. Self-fulfilling prophecy...

[FullRangeMan]

In 2003 I take the vitamin complex Sunvite/Rexall for 3 years it was great, inexpensive and nice food and suplement to lose weight.
But 3 years is a long time to take a vitamin, I had to stop because it was giving me long headaches daily.
Hypervitaminosis can kill any one.

[nocrapman]

Short of a bad batch or a "walmart special" - this seems like placebo effect.
Vitamins dont act this fast positively or negatively.
Alternatively you might be responding to a binding agent in these pills.

Americans consume the most OTC vitamins in the world. Most of it gets out in the pee.
Vitamins A,D,E, K - are not water soluble and if u consume large doses of those, you might get toxicity. Highly unlikely from a centrum like formula.

Eat a healthy diet; get some exercise; listen to some good music. If you are not showing signs of a vitamin deficiency, and are still curious, get your doc to order panels for vitamin levels. And then only supplement what u r low on.

And stop that Equate!!

[Kenneth Patchen]

Did you have a blood work-up done? For the first time ever my last work-up tested for vitamin deficencies and my levels of D3 and B12 were off the charts low. The sun might shine in my back door someday but most of the time it's pretty gray in northern NY, thus the low D3. (And now research is showing a connection with low D3 and Altziemers.

Your blood work-up might reveal an excess of certain vitamins.

[Folsom]

Kenneth, low D can also be partial to poor fat processing, particularity the liver.