[c.coyle]

.
I can only address the speaker cable question here as it applies to the Daedalus speakers. . . .

We try to make these systems as neutral as possible and have found that many of the available speaker cables are 'tone controls' which we do not recommend to use with our speakers, this is why we make these cables.

What makes other speaker cables affect the tone of a speaker?  How do you keep yours neutral?

[easystreet]

 

That's just re-wording what you originally stated.  My question was how.

Tube and solid state amps require different types of speaker cables?  Even if both amps have 8 ohm outputs?

As to your specific "how" question, I'm afraid I don't have anywhere near the technical competence to answer your question.

And I never said that tube and solid state amps require different types of speaker cables. But it makes sense to me that a cable specifically designed for Shindo tube amps might not sound as good as other cables, designed for wider use, on a solid state amp. More importantly, the proof is in the listening:  each of the other four speaker cables I auditioned sounded better than Auditorium 23 cables when paired with my Crayon amp.

If you don't believe that different cables sound different, and that some cables are better than others in particular systems, just say so.

[c.coyle]

As to your specific "how" question, I'm afraid I don't have anywhere near the technical competence to answer your question.

And I never said that tube and solid state amps require different types of speaker cables. But it makes sense to me that a cable specifically designed for Shindo tube amps might not sound as good as other cables, designed for wider use, on a solid state amp. More importantly, the proof is in the listening:  each of the other four speaker cables I auditioned sounded better than Auditorium 23 cables when paired with my Crayon amp.

If you don't believe that different cables sound different, and that some cables are better than others in particular systems, just say so.

I was just asking you about some of the statements you made. 

EDIT: You are correct, you did not say that tube and solid state amps require different cables.  I just need some help understanding how a cable is specifically designed for a specific amp.  It seems to me that a cable can't see a difference between an audio signal from a tube and an audio signal from a transistor. 

[Daedalus Audio]

I was just asking you about some of the statements you made. 

EDIT: You are correct, you did not say that tube and solid state amps require different cables.  I just need some help understanding how a cable is specifically designed for a specific amp.  It seems to me that a cable can't see a difference between an audio signal from a tube and an audio signal from a transistor.

It is about voicing not detecting any difference in 'signal'.

[Tomy2Tone]

I can only address the speaker cable question here as it applies to the Daedalus speakers.

We take the internal wiring of our speaker systems very seriously and have spent years developing the optimum wire and configuration
for these systems. In that sense using similar technology from the speaker to the amplifier is just a continuation of the care we use in the speaker systems. Seems logical to me.

We try to make these systems as neutral as possible and have found that many of the available speaker cables are 'tone controls' which we do not recommend
to use with our speakers, this is why we make these cables.

Wow, I think that is awesome that you go to such lengths to get the best sound possible from your speakers!

Even though I just recently purchased some new speakers, I'm always on the look out for other styles and designs. I will be visiting some family in Oregon this summer and would love to make a visit to your shop. I'll get in touch with you when the time comes.

Back to the cable discussion, I've been upgrading all my cables recently including power cables. Amazing what even a power cable can do. I think this debate seems to always end the same where some people appreciate what particular cables can do while others will resent the fact that people can distinguish one from another.

[vortrex]

I have Shindo gear.  I've always used A23 cables with great success.  I then got a Shindo interconnect for amp to pre.  Just changing this one cable was a massive improvement over an already great cable (that was also made for Shindo equipment).  I put in a friend's Wywires Silver cable and thought it was pretty bad in comparison.  I'd be willing to bet that Shindo cables won't sound great in other gear.

[c.coyle]

. . . I think this debate seems to always end the same where some people appreciate what particular cables can do while others will resent the fact that people can distinguish one from another.

I seem to have struck a nerve here.  Claims have been made in this thread, and I asked some questions about them.  That's all. 

If component A sounds better than component B to your ears and brain, then it does, to you, and it's nobody else's business.  But if you make claims on a public forum, you shouldn't get touchy if someone asks for a little explanation.

[Early B.]

I just need some help understanding how a cable is specifically designed for a specific amp.  It seems to me that a cable can't see a difference between an audio signal from a tube and an audio signal from a transistor.

You won't find a technical explanation regarding cables. Sort of like tubes -- there's no technical explanation for preferring one tube brand over the other. Audio is very subjective, and all cables change the character of the music, sometimes in a very subtle manner and sometimes quite dramatically. Such dramatic changes make cables just as important as components. Some can hear the differences among cable changes, while others cannot. Likewise, some people can hear the differences in amps, while others cannot. 

[c.coyle]

. . .  Some can hear the differences among cable changes, while others cannot. Likewise, some people can hear the differences in amps, while others cannot.

I hear a difference almost every time I change cables or amps.  Usually the new one sounds better.  Sometimes the same set up sounds better or worse depending on my mood or physical state.  I would just like to know if it's entirely in my head (nothing wrong with that) or if there is some way of measuring these things objectively. 

If it's entirely in my head and subjective, how it sounds to someone else seems irrelevant to a buying decision.  These are just testimonials. Interesting, but irrelevant if I am thinking of buying it. 

I am not picking on Daedalus.  I have never heard their speakers or cables.

[jimdgoulding]

Well, believe I'm on my way to getting some WyWire P's thanks to you all.  I have active speakers so the IC from preamp to speaker has to be pretty long.  Have to get their phono cable, too, I suppose.  Think I'll start with the IC's and see what happens.  Will talk to them soon about the cost.  I wonder if they re-sell customer trade-in's but, then again, probably no one has or had my need for a lengthy one.

[Tomy2Tone]

I seem to have struck a nerve here.  Claims have been made in this thread, and I asked some questions about them.  That's all. 

If component A sounds better than component B to your ears and brain, then it does, to you, and it's nobody else's business.  But if you make claims on a public forum, you shouldn't get touchy if someone asks for a little explanation.

No, no nerve with me. I wasn't aiming my comment at you. I've just read too many threads with topics like this where it just goes back and forth.

[Tyson]

No, no nerve with me. I wasn't aiming my comment at you. I've just read too many threads with topics like this where it just goes back and forth.

Why tommy2tone, whatevah do you mean?

"Yes they do."
"No they don't."
Yes they DO!"
"No they DON'T!"
"YES THEY DO!!"
"NO THEY DON'T!!"

And that settles it! 

[Daedalus Audio]

No, no nerve with me. I wasn't aiming my comment at you. I've just read too many threads with topics like this where it just goes back and forth.

yep and the next thread will be, "Does vinyl really sound better than digital?". After that ... " Is there really a difference between two SS amps that "spec" the same?"  and on and on, it isn't just cables but it doesn't have to just be a schoolyard argument, already there have been several good points made in this thread.

Coyles comment about "subjective" is a good one, and that is why double blind testing is useful. The funny thing about most high end audio is that for most purposes our ears are the best test equipment. We ship our systems three states away for testing in one of the best labs in the country but still the final evaluation is the ear.
I have always felt it important to get input from other 'ears', yes we are each unique but often when we only rely on our own ears we end up in our heads and that is very subjective and fickle. 
In the early '90's when developing my first acoustic instrument speaker I had the good fortune of the amazing guitarist Martin Simpson living in town. His 'ears' were crucial to developing those speakers, yep the best test gear I could have had.

thanks,
lou