Subs for Martin-Logan CLS IIa's

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Captainhemo


Tyson

Re: Subs for Martin-Logan CLS IIa's
« Reply #21 on: 23 Jul 2018, 03:54 pm »
??? explain please ......

Sure - one of the main reasons that OB speakers (planars or cone based) don't blend well with sealed woofers/subs is that they load the room in different ways.  The OB upper portion (mids/highs) loads the room in a figure 8 pattern, most energy going forward and backward and nulls at the side.  A sealed woofer does NOT radiate in a figure 8 pattern, it acts as a pulsing sphere.  This loads the room in a very, very different manner than the OB top section.  Hence, they never, ever sound seamless.  Even with a nicely built sealed box.  Even with servo control.  Box bass just physically propagates differently than the top part of the speaker. 

On the other hand, OB bass radiates in a figure 8 pattern, matching exactly the pattern of the top section.  So you get a much better match because of, you know, physics. 

A nice side benefit - if you're using the woofers for mid bass or upper bass, it's a lot easier to keep the drivers physically close to the mids/highs drivers, whereas with sealed woofers, they tend to sound best in the corners or along the side walls due to how they load the room. 

Ah, and I'll also stipulate that this applies less to very deep bass like 20hz-40hz.  For that range, a sealed sub works wonders.  Anything above 40hz though and you really should be using OB bass to match the OB mids/highs.

davidwat

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 11
Re: Subs for Martin-Logan CLS IIa's
« Reply #22 on: 23 Jul 2018, 04:48 pm »
"That sounds like a W frame instead of an H frame."
Except that the W frame reduces the long dimension of the frame while I am trying to reduce the height of the unit when laid on its side. The result is that the front of one speaker and the back of the other point at the ground.

Danny seems to have answered part of my questions elsewhere.

<https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=158660.msg1694776#msg1694776>

David - Dallas

davidwat

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 11
Re: Subs for Martin-Logan CLS IIa's
« Reply #23 on: 23 Jul 2018, 05:57 pm »







mlundy57

Re: Subs for Martin-Logan CLS IIa's
« Reply #24 on: 23 Jul 2018, 07:36 pm »
Not sure how much you’d save. You have to have enough room to get the drivers in

twitch54

Re: Subs for Martin-Logan CLS IIa's
« Reply #25 on: 23 Jul 2018, 08:05 pm »
Sure - one of the main reasons that OB speakers (planars or cone based) don't blend well with sealed woofers/subs is that they load the room in different ways.  The OB upper portion (mids/highs) loads the room in a figure 8 pattern, most energy going forward and backward and nulls at the side.  A sealed woofer does NOT radiate in a figure 8 pattern, it acts as a pulsing sphere.  This loads the room in a very, very different manner than the OB top section.  Hence, they never, ever sound seamless.  Even with a nicely built sealed box.  Even with servo control.  Box bass just physically propagates differently than the top part of the speaker. 

On the other hand, OB bass radiates in a figure 8 pattern, matching exactly the pattern of the top section.  So you get a much better match because of, you know, physics. 

A nice side benefit - if you're using the woofers for mid bass or upper bass, it's a lot easier to keep the drivers physically close to the mids/highs drivers, whereas with sealed woofers, they tend to sound best in the corners or along the side walls due to how they load the room. 

Ah, and I'll also stipulate that this applies less to very deep bass like 20hz-40hz.  For that range, a sealed sub works wonders.  Anything above 40hz though and you really should be using OB bass to match the OB mids/highs.

Tyson,

thanks for your explanation. As for the CLX's, depending room acoustics they are capable down as low as 40hz, so a sealed sub would and or could do quite nicely I suspect.  I've listened to them with a pair of ML Descent i's rolled in around 50hz and it sounded superb !