[harri009]

I read a random persons post on audio asylum as well that he supposedly received an email from Windell saying it was not true.  All I know is I agree with you that I know Magnepan and the freight company will happily take your money for possibly nothing.  I can say the dealer felt confident in what he was saying so I have no reason to disbelieve him until magnepan decides to actually tell us first hand.

[SteveFord]

The whole thing is just to get free exposure on the internet.
Much ado about nothing, as they say.

[munosmario]

Both Josh and I tried for the better part of a half hour with Wendell and you can file the entire conversation under F for Futile.
Perhaps someone else will have better luck in learning why anyone should pack up their speakers and ship them plus $500 to Magenpan for an upgrade.
What the heck are we actually paying for?  That's not an unreasonable request. 
If your car mechanic said give me your car and $500 for an upgrade you'd ask him what he planned on doing, wouldn't you?

Steve, as you can see below, those excerpts from Harry Pearson's April 2011 review of the 3.7, in the Absolute Sound, show that the shroud of mystery regarding technical specifics of the 3.7 is an old stand of Magnepan/Diller. So, no surprise now that Magnepan/Diller continue the same policy. More important, despite his mighty status in the hi-end industry and his long standing relationship with Diller, HP was not spared the mystery treatment and had to patiently accept it. Consequently, however frustrating, no one should be surprised or take it personally if any inquiries regarding technical aspects of the upgrade turn out to be futile.

The excerpts follow:

Quote>

....It [the 3.7] sounds unlike any of its ancestors. It is the culmination of Winey’s art. The technological ins and outs, and their workings, are things the company is trying to keep as secret as Iran its atomic research programs. (See the sidebar.) Maybe they fear being reverse-engineered. No surprise there.
________
Sidebar

Later on, in an e-mail, I got Diller to expand (somewhat) on the mysteries of the 3.7s.

“The drivers are purely resistive since they are like a straight wire. The crossovers are first-order which provides a gentle phase angle…” And the crossover to the tweeter “is very close to the same point.”

As for the quasi-ribbon:
“The tweeter is a true ribbon. However, I am aware that these definitions have been a subject of debate. Our short version is—any deviation from a foil (usually aluminum) suspended in magnetic gap is a ‘quasi-ribbon.’ And there have been a lot of creative variations of the true ribbon.”

And, to wit:
“As I said earlier, the Tympani IVa bass is the Gold Standard we set as a goal and that is what we went after. The midbass is much fuller than the 3.6 which gives the subjective impression that the 3.7 is much more efficient. However, we are not making any claims for increased efficiency….The low frequency ‘achievable’ is the same as the 3.6, but, due to much better midbass ‘slam’ everyone is saying it goes deeper.”

And, to wit, a last thought: from HP:
“When pressed for a more definitive technical explanation, Diller can still be frustratingly vague, at times, no change there. (Remember, I have known him since near TAS’s beginning days). So, what's the big secret? Iranians aside. Maybe, from a marketing perspective, he thinks the review might be more interesting if he keeps me in the dark.”

Mario



 

[SteveFord]

Yes, I recall. 
The workings of the audio industry borders on the surreal at times.

[harri009]

The whole thing is just to get free exposure on the internet.
Much ado about nothing, as they say.

 

[jhm731]

Is Wendell related to Phyllis Diller?

[Davey]

What a pathetic way to handle a product recall.  They won't tell you what the problem is, and oh by the way, YOU get charged for their production mistake.
That's rich!

Dave.

[zuluwarrior0760]

The customers are Billy in the Doritos finger cleaner commercial
and Wendell is the old guy who sez:

"You ask too many questions Billy".......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugo7Y2lRsxc

[rhoni]

The 3.7 has been in production for more than 2+ years.  You would think that stereophile could have borrow a pair from a private party for their review and measurements.  No need to get it from Magnepan. 

Has anyone posted private measurements of the 3.7 ?

[Goosepond]

I sure hope Wendell is reading this thread. It's obvious his failing company needs a lot of help and there are a whole bunch of experts here that just know they can run it much better than he can. 

Hilarious. 

Gene

[rollo]

    Remember the customer is always right. The best consumer is an educated consumer. All the customer wants is info. Give it to them. Does not have to be specific. A hint like " we reworked fastening system " or something similar.
    Maggie owners are willing to bite but bite what ? Something to chew on is all they are asking. The other side is that Maggie does not release a revision until it is blind tested by their staff. If one trusts Magnepans reputation it should be a non issue.
    The real question is does the total cost of such [ shipping ] worth the money ? Bang for the buck. Mye stands or upgrade ? Hmmmmm.




charles

[AdvoCat]

The comments in this thread have discouraged me from upgrading, or from having them shipped.  I'll just get them myself and wait for more information before making the leap to the 3.7i.  Frustrating, but it would be at least a $1200 investment (with shipping) to do it.  That really devalues the base model, doesn't it?

[Davey]

I sure hope Wendell is reading this thread. It's obvious his failing company needs a lot of help and there are a whole bunch of experts here that just know they can run it much better than he can. 

Hilarious. 

Gene

I assume you're being facetious.  If not, it's silly commentary because that's obviously not what the posters here are saying.
It's certainly a legitimate question what a customer spending $500 and risking the shipment of his speakers is getting for said expenditure.  Zero information from Magnepan regarding this "i"improvement is unacceptable.

Dave.

[SteveFord]

I had some measurements on my old PC which met an untimely demise.
Basically, it was flatter frequency response in the low end and the foil smoothed out the sound compared to the old wires (if I put that in a way that makes sense).
I'm sure a review in TAS is forthcoming on this little upgrade but I wouldn't expect anything more than general subjective comments.

Yes, the resale value has taken a real hit over something which, I suspect, doesn't amount to very much at all and the customer could do themselves if they can manage to solder without setting the house on fire.

I like Wendell and I like Magnepan speakers but every one here has raised valid points.

[rhoni]

500 + shipping and not knowing what your're getting other than a receipt that says you have a 3.7i makes no sense.  If you are selling an upgrade, state the upgrade and present your sale pitch.  The customer will make an informed decision.

My impression of the 3.7 is there is a better blending of the drivers but i think the 3.6 has better bass.  This is from memories of many auditions of the 3.6 and finally my purchased of the 3.7.

I will take better driver blending over better bass.

[Waker]

For those who have the 3.7s, I hope you are not too bothered by not having the upgrade.  For the cost, it cannot be that major. By the time the factory takes your speakers off the truck, unpacks them, does the upgrade, repacks them, perhaps in new cartons depending on shipping damage, and resend them, $500 for time, labor and materials does not go that far.  Until you do know what the upgrade is, a few bolt-on mods will probably provide a sense of satisfaction.  The Mye Stands or an equivalent, Cardas jumpers, etc, and, controversial as they are, some after-market fuses will all add up to noticeable improvements.  The Furutech fuses provided more resolution to my 3.6Rs, no doubting that--in my experience, in my system, but I did double the ratings for both for a larger filament in each.  Not to open any discussion on that, just to say there are some tweaks to be done for about the same cost until the upgrade is disclosed. I would not ship mine, anyway--not for any reason, even for sale.  Nothing is handled with care. 

[kevin360]

Dave, I think it's unfair to classify the mysterious upgrade as a product recall. Mine have not been upgraded (to the factory 'i' version) and I certainly wouldn't consider them broken in any way. I'm very happy with them. So pleased am I that I have no interest in packing them up and sending them to the factory for elective surgery. Besides, I've done a little elective surgery of my own – part of the fun.

I find myself in unusual territory because I have always spoken in defense of Magnepan's business philosophy and of the company's right to maintain secrecy about technical details. This is different and I feel differently about this situation. Unless this upgrade involves a 'deep' technology, I see no reason why it should be such a closely guarded secret. If one has his 3.7s upgraded, must he enter into a 'hush contract' with Magnepan (I promise not to peek and never to divulge what I didn't see )?

Various things in my life drove me to invest in a mancave and some bigger Magnepans. I was, after all (and still am) in love with my MMGs (and it has also been a blast tinkering with them). One audition of the 3.6s and I was sold – what a stunning tweeter! I decided to go for the 3-series instead of the 1.7s, but I wondered when the 3.6 was going to be updated in the same way. The word from Magnepan (Leland asked Wendell) was that it wasn't happening anytime soon, so I purchased a pair of 3.6s. A few months later, the 3.7s debuted. Even though that secret cost me around $2k (when I traded up), I defend Magnepan's right to have kept it. This, however, is different.

When each of the .7s was introduced, we knew something significant about the changes. We knew wires had given way to foil and we knew the crossovers had been simplified as well as built with boutique quality parts (such is the claim. anyway). These are significant changes and they were anything but secrets. I suspect there were numerous tweaks to the 'black art' aspects of their design, and I support Magnepan's right to protect that information. I see it as justified and proper. This, I reiterate (again), is different.

I'm not pissed off or anything, but I do not understand why this must be such a covert operation. For crying out loud, at least tell us what the hell it addresses. We aren't asking for every detail, but only some general information. I suppose this is the ultimate test of faith. My inclinations run in a different direction. Without any information to guide my decision, I'm not disposed to interest. Thanks, but I'll pass. For all I know, the enhancement involves something that I've already addressed (one way or another). 

I may not think of it as a product recall, but I agree to the pathetic (I'd say deplorable) way this upgrade is being executed. To be blunt and honest, I'm a little bit offended. Oh well, I still dig their speakers and I'd hesitate to call whatever the upgrade 'fixes' a production mistake. I suspect the product was considered finished and polished when it was introduced, but there is more than a kernel of truth to the assertion that Magnepan actually does tinker with their products. I'd guess that they 'stumbled into something' that is beneficial and decided to put it into production with the current speaker. Perhaps, the upgrade cost is an acceptable loss for the company - it's possible. Since we know nothing, well, we just don't know. 

[Davey]

Kevin,

I understand your point, but without any information from Magnepan regarding this "improvement" what the heck are owners supposed to think?  Understandably, dealers get queries and start spreading possibly incorrect information and we're left with multiple rumors, one of which describes the panels as not tensioned correctly.  But heck, maybe it's some other explanation and this really is some sort of valid improvement to the design?  The whole thing is just puzzling as hell and a fantastic example of a company not treating its customers well.  I thought Magnepan was above the kind of silliness employed by so many other companies operating in "high-end" audio.

As you know, I don't own 3.7's, but if I did there's no way in hell I'd consider shelling out the moola and sending my speakers to Magnepan without getting a damn good explanation of what the heck they're doing.  I suppose I'm in the minority here since I have much more technical interest in these type of things than most users.

Maybe "recall" is the wrong word, but what the heck is the right word? 

Cheers,

Dave.

[SteveFord]

I'm not very technically inclined but I won't pay for something based on blind faith and I'm surprised that any company would ask their customers to do so.

[berni]

I think this odd decision to announce a upgrade is going backwards for Magnepan.