[PeteG]

Sony has two new body’s with a new sensor in them being announced Oct 16. The A7 (24mp) at $1698 and A7r (36mp, no AA filter) at $2198 both E-mounts and a rumor of coming with either Canon, Nikon, Leica adaptors. The sensors are new (not D800E) in a mirrorless Sony body, some folks that have used them have said its weathersealed and built like a tank.

I was looking at dac’s this weekend but might have to put that on the back burner for now. I would love a great new 36mp sensor with my Canon lenses.

[PeteG]

Sony A7r (36mp, no AA filter) with the 35mm f/2.8 Zeiss lens.

[Jon L]

Oh, man, there's already a review, and at about 11:30 into the video, the guy is shooting Canon L glass on the Sony with Metabones adapter with Autofocus INTACT!!  I'm so excited I could use all my lovely L glass on the D800E sensor in the Sony A7r 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=bnvgceTEV3c

 

[tnargs]

You make it sound like the A7r uses a Nikon sensor. Of course, the opposite is true: Nikon are using Sony sensors.

The number of people whose photographs will actually improve from having a 44mm sensor instead of, say, a 22mm m43 sensor or a 30mm APSC sensor, is miniscule. The number who THINK it will improve, is huge.

When you put the A7r on its dedicated 70-200 f4 stabilised lens, its size and weight is almost indistinguishable from a Canon 6D on the EF 70-200 f4 L IS, because the L lens is actually smaller and lighter than the Sony lens. So the Sony owner now has a camera/lens combo that is no smaller and lighter but relatively pathetic at focusing. This is progress? This is a 'game changer'?

Put a Panasonic GX7 on its 35-100 f2.8 (yes, 2.8 ) lens next to an A7 on its 70-200 f4 and you will LAUGH. Then put the 6D combo next to the other two and you will CRY.

[Photon46]

We'll have to wait and see how the A7r's performance stacks up against the competition, but one thing really caught my eye about the A7r's sensor design: the omission of the low-pass sensor filter. That could potentially really improve resolution. The first thing I noticed when switching to a medium format PhaseOne digital back was how much greater the resolution was in comparison to the image files coming out of my EOS 1Ds II which I understand is, in large part, due to the lack of a low-pass filter. (I'm talking about an apples to apples comparison of equal size file segments, not the difference between the Canon 16.7 Mp and PhaseOne 65 Mp files.) The lack of a low pass filter makes a big difference. If the A7r can deliver a 36mp file with image quality anywhere near medium format quality, I'd say it is indeed a potential game changer for those able to extract quality images from the camera.

Tnargs is correct about the disparity between those whose photos improve with large sensors vs. those who think they will. It all depends on what you are shooting and how up to snuff your technique is. The larger the sensor gets, the more critically you have to pay attention to focus and camera stability if you're going to get maximum image quality. The PhaseOne back I use demands tethered shooting in the studio to get razor sharp focus. Impossible to consistently get maximum image clarity unless you're using a live view on a computer monitor. When shooting groups of people in tight quarters, my EOS system's depth of field is often challenged, so I'll  switch to a small sensor Canon G12 to get the benefit of the greater depth of field which that camera offers vis-s-vis the EOS.

[PeteG]

Oh, man, there's already a review, and at about 11:30 into the video, the guy is shooting Canon L glass on the Sony with Metabones adapter with Autofocus INTACT!!  I'm so excited I could use all my lovely L glass on the D800E sensor in the Sony A7r 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=bnvgceTEV3c

Yes I'm excited too, its all about putting great Canon glass on a full-frame 36.3mp Exmor sensor because we could never have done it until now. I was surprised how expensive the Metabones adapter was.

Some more news on the E-mount:

5 new primes from Samyang are coming to the A7 / A7R.

ETA 2 months from now.

Samyang 14mm f/2.8 ED AS IF UMC (Canon mount: I've used it for a short time, very nice)
Samyang 24mm f/1.4 ED AS IF UMC
Samyang T-S 24mm f/3.5 ED AS UMC (Canon mount: The one I had was average at best)
Samyang 35mm f/1.4 AS UMC
Samyang 85mm f/1.4 AS IF UMC

[Jon L]

5 new primes from Samyang are coming to the A7 / A7R.

ETA 2 months from now.

Samyang 14mm f/2.8 ED AS IF UMC (Canon mount: I've used it for a short time, very nice)
Samyang 24mm f/1.4 ED AS IF UMC
Samyang T-S 24mm f/3.5 ED AS UMC (Canon mount: The one I had was average at best)
Samyang 35mm f/1.4 AS UMC
Samyang 85mm f/1.4 AS IF UMC

I wouldn't buy Samyang FE mount lenses simply for the reason FE mount lenses cannot be used on another system (i.e. Canon) via adapter due to FE's short flange distance.  It would be better to buy Samyang Canon mount, which can also be used on FE mount with adapter.

The company I would love to see announce FE lenses is Sigma.  A Sigma ART FE 35 mm f1.4 or 85 f/1.4.  If they can manage a future 50 mm ART f/1.4, hopefully compact, it would be sweet 

[tnargs]

The larger the sensor gets, the more critically you have to pay attention to focus and camera stability if you're going to get maximum image quality.

Agreed, and that is what bugs me about the A7r. We are never going to get 36 MP of resolution without a tripod --- which kind of defeats the purpose of a slightly smaller body. So what is the point?

[Photon46]

Agreed, and that is what bugs me about the A7r. We are never going to get 36 MP of resolution without a tripod --- which kind of defeats the purpose of a slightly smaller body. So what is the point?

As someone who has lugged 35 pounds of 4x5 view camera, lens, film holders and tripod over hundreds of miles of trails, any amount of weight saved relative to image quality is welcome. However, for the average point and shoot photographer, "what's the point" may be true. But hey, Sony is hardly unique by marketing product their average consumer can't utilize to the max. Performance cars of all stripes and expensive wine come to mind as products that are consumed as much for what they say about us as what they do for us.

[Jon L]

I envy this guy 


Sony A7r Zeiss Otus 55mm by drjlo2, on Flickr

[Brad]

Wasn't that Otus named after an owl?
LUST!

Off track a little bit:
I'm actually looking to get the Zeiss 21mm for my Canon 6d.
It's much more affordable compared to the 55/1.4. although this pricing reminds me of audio gear 

[PeteG]

That’s a sweet combo, but I won’t be getting that Zeiss Otus anytime soon.
However, I will be getting the A7r (have Metabones/extra batteries) just waiting for them to ship.

[PeteG]

Wasn't that Otus named after an owl?
LUST!

Off track a little bit:
I'm actually looking to get the Zeiss 21mm for my Canon 6d.
It's much more affordable compared to the 55/1.4. although this pricing reminds me of audio gear 

 I went back and forth between the Zeiss 21mm and Canon TS-E 24mm II, got the Canon (which I love) but I still think about that Zeiss.

I wouldn't buy Samyang FE mount lenses simply for the reason FE mount lenses cannot be used on another system (i.e. Canon) via adapter due to FE's short flange distance.  It would be better to buy Samyang Canon mount, which can also be used on FE mount with adapter.

The company I would love to see announce FE lenses is Sigma.  A Sigma ART FE 35 mm f1.4 or 85 f/1.4.  If they can manage a future 50 mm ART f/1.4, hopefully compact, it would be sweet 

My Rokinon 14mm f2.8 (Canon mount) came today, have to wait for the weekend to see if its a good copy.

[SET Man]

Hey!

    I don't remembered ever see Canon users get excited over Sony cameras or any other camera makers' for that matter 

    I have to say that the A7 and A7r sound like a lot of camera for the price, especially the A7. And I do like the way they reminded me of the old Minolta 7000. Not sure how comfortable they are though.

    I'm a Sony user but with the A-mount. And look like Sony is putting the A-mount on the back burner and going full steam with the E-mount cameras right now. Yes, I could use my Minolta's lenses some of which are 20 years+ old with full AF on them with an adapter. But one thing that turned me off from them is that Sony left out the sensor-based stabilizer that they inherited from Minolta. I think they want to keep the body as small as possible. So, even with adapter I won't have stabilizer at all with my old Minolta/Sony A-mount lenses 

    As for the lens. If you don't have lots of lenses from other makers, and can afford them, do check out those Sony's Zeiss lenses and don't overlook their G lenses of which are excellent also (I think Minolta still make the G line and others lenses for Sony) The Sony's Zeiss lenses are worth every penny  But that's just my opinion... the Zeiss' have different look and feel to them.

    Well, if anyone get their hands on one of these, let me know how you like it.

Take care,
Buddy

[SET Man]

Hey!

   Well, the A7r is barely out and it already got Popular Photography's "2013 Camera of the Year"...

http://www.popphoto.com/news/2013/11/2013-camera-year-sony-a7r

   I haven't seen one yet. But I will have to stop by to play with one at B&H soon... well not that I can afford one right now. 

Take care,
Buddy

[PeteG]

I’ve been playing around with the Sony a7r for a few days and so far I’m very happy with it. All my lenses work great on it although AF is slow, but MF works so well on this body that’s all I’ve been using. It will take awhile to get everything down plus the weather is going to be bad for a while, it will take a little time before I can get out for some good shots.




Both pictures - Canon 85mm 1.8 @ f2

[Jon L]

I was excited about using all my Canon lenses with A7r myself..UNTIL I read this article which measures adapters, and basically all of them, even premium ones, cause significant degradation to IQ, with many causing large amount of degradation:

"Putting a great lens on your camera via an adapter might still be better than an average native-mount lens. On the other hand, that great lens certainly wouldn’t be as good as it would be on its native-mount camera."

http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2013/09/there-is-no-free-lunch-episode-763-lens-adapters

When I get the A7r, I think I will save the hefty amount of money for the Metabones adapter and apply it towards the Zeiss FE 55mm f/1.8 instead, which is the lens I really want, not the Zeiss 35 mm f/2.8. 

[PeteG]

I read Roger's article on adapters when it came out, it had me a little worried. Rodger also wrote " you can detect a very real difference in the lab that doesn’t make much difference at all in the real world. "

I can tell you the images I'm seeing are some of the best I've seen from any of my body's old or new. I don't blame you for go for native lenses they all should be great.

[SET Man]

I read Roger's article on adapters when it came out, it had me a little worried. Rodger also wrote " you can detect a very real difference in the lab that doesn’t make much difference at all in the real world. "

I can tell you the images I'm seeing are some of the best I've seen from any of my body's old or new. I don't blame you for go for native lenses they all should be great.

Hey!

   Yup, if the pictures look good to you than why worry?

   Pete, I saw pic from the 7r in "Picture of the Day" Nice pic, were that shot in JPEG or RAW than converted? I have to say look like the dynamic range of this camera looks like it will be excellent especially in highlight.

   BTW... are those buildings in the background? Man! Those bisons sure live very close to people.

     

I was excited about using all my Canon lenses with A7r myself..UNTIL I read this article which measures adapters, and basically all of them, even premium ones, cause significant degradation to IQ, with many causing large amount of degradation:

"Putting a great lens on your camera via an adapter might still be better than an average native-mount lens. On the other hand, that great lens certainly wouldn’t be as good as it would be on its native-mount camera."

http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2013/09/there-is-no-free-lunch-episode-763-lens-adapters

When I get the A7r, I think I will save the hefty amount of money for the Metabones adapter and apply it towards the Zeiss FE 55mm f/1.8 instead, which is the lens I really want, not the Zeiss 35 mm f/2.8. 

     You worry too much. I think it will be hard to tell any difference... let's say with 8X10 prints and etc.
 
     Ever since the photography's "digital revolution" started people seems to want that "digital perfection" pictures. Many become the so called "pixel peeper"

    When I look at a picture... first thing I look for is the "emotional feel", secondly the "artistically side" to it than "technical side" of it. I have to say that there are lots of "digital perfection" photos out there that I just find lacking any emotional and artistic feel to it.

     Anyway, that's just my take on things. But at the end "beauty is in the eye of the beholder"

    BTW... you'll like the Zeiss. Even though picture wise it will have a different feel to it compare to Japanese lenses, well there are different feel between each Japanese lens makers' lenses also.  But when is come to sharpness and contrast Zeiss is hard to beat.

Take care,
Buddy

     

[PeteG]

This Sony sensor really has me excited, I’m just seeing things big and small that I’m not use to.

I'm enjoying MF on the a7r a lot using focus peaking/zebra, it just gets easier the more I use it.
Here's a sample that I just don't see with my other body's, hand held/NO sharpening done/MF.

a7r w/ Canon 70-200 f2.8 II@ f3.5
 

100% crop


My 5DIII is a great camera but at 100% crop I just don't get this kind of detail and resolution, even using the same lens.