[kyrill]

I never started so 'subjectively before

Put yr money away to save for … Stein harmonizers.

Oh boy I wish I never heard them. You must start at least with two that is what I have.  Then after weeks I get so accustomed to the sound that I could not hear a difference anymore as my music was in my memory before the Steins as I enjoyed in those weeks not my complete collection but the newest CD's ( Nick Cave Bonny Prince Billy). Of course you can get the Steins outside the room and I did in the beginning but anticipation of what you expect to hear play a bitter role in this too. Bitter in the sens of obstructing objectivity But In another room I have my Home Theater `set up (D-ILA pj) and put the Steins there to have more emerging sound during movies. The next day (evening) I listened to my audio and after 5 minutes I wanted to stop listening. This was one of those evenings of yesteryear the sound was uninvolving only because it was a different evening. It sounded compressed more 2D and some lazy universal fattiness over all frequencies that I have never heard before! That was my system I know so well.  And then I realized, the Steins are still upstairs.   Without any anticipation my brain told me the difference between 2 Steins with or without.

What the Steins do is shake away from the sound the signature that the sound is produced by speakers. The effect is a big jump in life-likeness. Singers and instruments become much more real and in the room. Before that my brain had no reference of such a possibility so I took the "speaker signature" which is not the coloring of the speakers frequency wise, for granted. I dont have the accompanying stones yet ( package is too expensive for me yet) so only 2 'naked' Steins.

 

I know off what seems to be a better alternative: The acoustic Energizers. They are bigger but there two catches. 1) 30+ % more expensive, but worse regular replacement of the heart, the machine of the system which very cleverly is integrated with the battery! This is or at least I consider that pure nonsense it forces the customer to keep on buying it and the old one you have to throw away.. The cost is 175 dollars, but per piece.. The rest is a wooden enclosure and a led. And maybe, this possibility exist,  2 or 4 year from now the cost is 300 or 500. and you cannot say I stop as the sound quality  will tumble down down for miles.

But is it that much better than the Steins? One reviewer says: "(As you might expect, arrangements of duo and trio Energizer setups don’t make as forceful an impression")  Also the Steins will sound better with 5 and all the stones, a Valhalla I am prepared to save for
The problem is when you think you don't need them, you need them. The better yr system is, the more pronounced the  musical effect is of the Steins.

So what is it John


"The Steinmusic system confounds easy characterization. The Harmonizers are electronically active, but they are not connected within the system's signal path. Changing the Intensity level quite audibly alters the in-room sound, but that interaction is strictly with the room itself, not the electronics of the system."

[JohnR]

What is it? Pse provide some pictures and description for a review.

[Phil A]

Thanks for the review.  Found some more info too -

http://www.stereophile.com/content/stein-music%E2%80%99s-intriguing-accessories

http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue61/steinmusic.htm

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/superioraudio/equipment/0411/steinmusic_h2_harmonizers_magic_stones.htm

[JLM]

I hate "can't live without" tweaks, especially when they cost $$$.   

I try to keep an open mind, but can't fathom the "explanation".

[kyrill]

explanations are nice, but produce only language, and that i snot why I have my audio system for. On completely on the other hand ( not the domain The Steins fall in) try to explain why Mozart or Tchaikovsky produce real good music or why your loved ones are worth yr love in a way science accept those explanations. That does not make those "unexplainable things" unreal, no?

 I fully  agree with your "I hate "can't live without" tweaks, especially when they cost $$$."

Tweaks you cant live with out are those who WILL fulfill your dream for a better sounding equipment especially in those areas which are fundamental when there are no or costlier alternatives 

[thunderbrick]

I'm assuming you mean BEER steins, which properly filled and chilled make for a more pleasurable listening experience?   

[kyrill]

beer? My favourite is Belgian Trappiste beer: Westmalle.  BTW all beer in cans are low-fi beers period.

[BobM]

I am sure these things do "something", and we know that "everything" affects the sound.

That being said, I can't stand it when marketing jargon and technical explanations start spouting string theory and quantum mechanics. NOBODY really understands them, nor can they be building something consciously that is designed to change your perceptions in a positive way. Maybe by accident, but not by design.

In fact, the act of measuring the units performance toward your goal will actually change that performance and give you a different result Mr Shrodinger!

[kyrill]

hi Bob

Lets not confuse words or theoretical explanations  about events as the events themselves. The audio system and room WILL produce an experience. The Stein is part of that. random effects or snake oil cannot produce consistent results.

So if product X seems to good to be theoretical possible within contemporary science, I am not interested, unless a few trusted sources ( one is an audio friend I have) stand behind the product. In my case that is several well known audio review magazines. Then I become interested. Even worse, when I read about  a product which claims heaven and the theorie behind it is sound and well understood, ....but no reviews or forums on the net speak favorably about it? Then I am NOT interested.

But if my interest is awaken because of trusted (personal) searching criteria ànd there is also a a try before you buy possibility then I put my money where my belief is. My review is next to the many others based on personal careful listening.
You will find with no problems at all dozens of attacks to Steins or similar products based on disbelief and NONE based on personal experience.
greetz
K

[BobM]

Agreed Kyrill. If you can hear the difference, and you like that difference, and can afford the product, then by all means go for it. It's always experience that should be your ultimate guide. Not someone else's but your own. Try-buys are a great way to do that.

My problem is the marketing of things that don't follow "typical" engineering standards. The marketing turns me off because I keep hearing Peter Belt in my head, regardless of whether the product does anything positive or not. I thought the same of the Qol device until I heard what it can do. Not for my system, but for many others. If the Stein floats your boat then congratulations. I hope to hear it some day so I can make my own determination.

Thanks for making us aware of your positive experience with them.

[DaveC113]

Thanks kyrill, interesting reading for sure.

I'm not sure what to think, except the price is very high. But I keep an open mind and would like to try it out myself someday. 

[Rclark]

I am sure these things do "something", and we know that "everything" affects the sound.

That being said, I can't stand it when marketing jargon and technical explanations start spouting string theory and quantum mechanics. NOBODY really understands them, nor can they be building something consciously that is designed to change your perceptions in a positive way. Maybe by accident, but not by design.

In fact, the act of measuring the units performance toward your goal will actually change that performance and give you a different result Mr Shrodinger!

Exactly. Unless you are both an actual quantum physicist AND an audio engineer, leave all the pretense out of your marketing materials. Anyone who starts spouting benefits due to quantum effects is HIGHLY suspect.

For the fleeced, see: expectation bias.

[kyrill]

expectation bias goes two ways...

you are also fleeced while not having a product by expectation bias
so "For the fleeced, see: expectation bias." is non information if you think it through