[Danny Richie]

BMS wouldn't work?  (I don't know, not being smart)  http://bmsspeakers.com/index.php?id=bms_12c362

That driver doesn't look too bad. I wonder how hard it would be to mill out or replace the rear tweeter cup?

[dnewcomer]

or maybe check the radian models, they did offer both 8"/1 (5208) and 12"/2 (5312) coaxials,  and I remember reading about the back cup being opened up for OB

[Jonathon Janusz]

That driver doesn't look too bad. I wonder how hard it would be to mill out or replace the rear tweeter cup?

The idea of finding a "next" driver for the V-series speakers was an idea in the back of my head when I sat down in the BMS room at RMAF.  I spent some time listening and chatting with the rep for the US importer.  Judging the sound or comparing it in any way to what I've heard from the paudio drivers wouldn't mean much and wouldn't really be of much use.  For what it is worth in any case, I liked what I heard from some of the bigger models I heard (I think most of my time was spent with one of the 12" triaxials?).  There is potential for some cool things there, I think.  Actually, if I didn't already have a pair of the paudio coaxes sitting unused, I would have seriously considered picking up a pair of BMS drivers and at the very least working on learning more about the crossover networks the importer had running in the demo speakers (which I was very clearly told were built into their acrylic cases specifically and exclusively as a means to demo and display the drivers - as in the speakers themselves complete were not for sale through any dealer/distribution channels).

Good news, in speaking with the importer, is that his company is not really in the speaker building/selling business, wanting to stay selling drivers/components only and in particular he specifically mentioned both the OEM and DIY crowds as target customers in our conversation.  The street prices I was hearing floated around were a little higher than the paudio, but not entirely out of the ballpark.

If you're curious, you should give them a call and hit them up for some info - seemed like they were approachable, even to an ordinary guy off the street like me. 

[tasar]

Correct if I'm wrong here Danny, but you imply they'll be a repair or replacement solution for those embracing your product/component. I did not say "always", but at least if you can help to that end, and patience remains a virtue.

[Danny Richie]

Correct if I'm wrong here Danny, but you imply they'll be a repair or replacement solution for those embracing your product/component. I did not say "always", but at least if you can help to that end, and patience remains a virtue.

Any servicing of the P-Audio drivers can be handled through the US importer.

I am still looking at new drivers that might allow a new version of the Super-V.

[tasar]

Just what is the avenue to the PA importer ? Further, what time/cost expectations should we have, given the "importer" would likely ship back to manufacturer ? I truly suspect "replacement" becomes the default program. Is it reasonable to expect a cost effective "drop in" driver ?

[LarryB]

I too was impressed with the BMS drivers, with all usual caveats re: show conditions, unfamiliar electronics, etc.  But I would certainly second the suggestion of your looking into them.

And Danny, while I know that you really like the open-back tweeter, I wouldn't regard this as a deal-breaker until you have assessd what they can do as is.

My two cents.

Larry 

[gregfisk]

Danny, are you planning on designing an OB line array for the do-it yourself crowd? If so, are we talking months, a year, more?

[Danny Richie]

Danny, are you planning on designing an OB line array for the do-it yourself crowd? If so, are we talking months, a year, more?

I have had some on the drawing board, but I have a tough time believing that the DIY guys will spend that much on a kit.

[Danny Richie]

Hey, I am getting one more set of P-Audio drivers back in on trade. Someone decided they had to have the new Serenity Acoustics Super-7's.    So they decided not do through with the Super-V build.

Crossovers are already assembled and looks good. They have Jupiter caps as well.

So now is your chance to pick up a pair even after they were gone.

[AJinFLA]

That driver doesn't look too bad. I wonder how hard it would be to mill out or replace the rear tweeter cup?

Those are well worth looking into  .

[tasar]

Geez Danny, if I had answers to my questions 4 threads up, I might purchase this returned set for investment !

[DeeJayBump]

Geez Danny, if I had answers to my questions 4 threads up, I might purchase this returned set for investment !

Google is your friend. A quick search turned up the following:

http://www.paudiothailand.com/distributors.cfm

...which lists Loudspeakers Plus as the US Distributor (and I'm assuming the importer as well) of P Audio drivers.

http://www.loudspeakersplus.com/

http://www.loudspeakersplus.com/p_audio_speakers.html

[Danny Richie]

Just what is the avenue to the PA importer ? Further, what time/cost expectations should we have, given the "importer" would likely ship back to manufacturer ? I truly suspect "replacement" becomes the default program. Is it reasonable to expect a cost effective "drop in" driver ?

I really didn't follow your questions.

Will there be a drop in replacement of some other type? No. Will original drivers be serviced or replaced? Yes.

[tasar]

Sorry thought I was clear. By "avenue" I questioned how one would pursue a remedy to a failed driver. Thru GR, importer direct, manufacturer ? Assuming these end up in Thailand, the process sounds $$$tedious. Now you're implying "replacement" is an option, assuming repairs can't be made. My understanding is they're discontinued product, based on previous comments. Please clarify.

[SoCalWJS]

I would assume that the devil is in the details concerning a "replacement".

(my less than 2 cents follows)

Danny takes great pride in these little details which is what makes his speakers so good.

If you followed the Serenity Super 7 thread, it got to the point where somebody broached the topic of a DIY version (which DR wouldn't do as a direct competitor to Serenity). The idea was floated of just figuring out the dimensions and buying everything. While you certainly can, it's the testing and getting the parts modified and matched that is key. A given driver may have similar, even very similar, published specifications on the surface. The problem is, they roll off at different rates, impedence changes over these frequencies, and this must be planned for and addressed.

If you took a different driver and just "dropped it in", it would sound different.

There may be a way to get a different driver, analyse it, figure out what changes would need to be made (milling out the back of the coax driver and the specifics of that, the crossover network, baffle dimensions, etc.) and get something that sounds very close. It might be a little bit better, a little bit worse. Tough to tell until the actual work has been done. Potentially a LOT of work.

A business decision has to be made as to whether or not there's a decent market. It sounds like at a minimum, the BMS drivers would cost more. It might take even more expensive capacitors to make them "sing". This will result in a higher cost for the kit. Will it sell?


(IMHO, probably yes, as it would still sound better than anything else near the current Super-V price, but it is somebody else's call  )

[Danny Richie]

Sorry thought I was clear. By "avenue" I questioned how one would pursue a remedy to a failed driver. Thru GR, importer direct, manufacturer ? Assuming these end up in Thailand, the process sounds $$$tedious. Now you're implying "replacement" is an option, assuming repairs can't be made. My understanding is they're discontinued product, based on previous comments. Please clarify.

Some repairs can be made on these drivers at Loudspeakers Plus (the importer). They already repaired a woofer that was damaged in shipping. It has been the only failure to date. Most companies (myself included) usually stock a hand full or replacement drivers when a driver is discontinued. I already have a small supply of replacement tweeters on hand.

And the tweeter is about the only that can get damaged and in this case I don't mean damage from playing them too loud. It is MUCH more likely to be damaged by someone poking it with something.

So if you are worrying if you'll get stuck with something broken, don't worry.

[tasar]

Thanks Danny. I just don't find the word "discontinued" as casually as some. Real business models expect the "supplier" to be the first door to be knocked upon. I applaud you for keeping users in mind. While most can remedy woofer problems, the coax repair is potentially a premium. I'm not sure how many V owners may not be looking in here, but apprising them of this situation directly, would seem the course. I would certainly not be adverse to acquiring a pair of tweeters, and others may share that sentiment. My Vs are heirlooms whether I implement them day to day, or otherwise. Please inform of price/availability, I personally see this as a good defensive move. Their cost will certainly pale when compared to a non functional speaker, a scenario I'm not willing to bear. A group purchase could make this cost effective, why not poll users.

[Danny Richie]

Thanks Danny. I just don't find the word "discontinued" as casually as some. Real business models expect the "supplier" to be the first door to be knocked upon. I applaud you for keeping users in mind. While most can remedy woofer problems, the coax repair is potentially a premium. I'm not sure how many V owners may not be looking in here, but apprising them of this situation directly, would seem the course. I would certainly not be adverse to acquiring a pair of tweeters, and others may share that sentiment. My Vs are heirlooms whether I implement them day to day, or otherwise. Please inform of price/availability, I personally see this as a good defensive move. Their cost will certainly pale when compared to a non functional speaker, a scenario I'm not willing to bear. A group purchase could make this cost effective, why not poll users.

These things will outlast us if you don't poke them with something. But if you are worried about it just buy a new tweeter diaphragm: http://www.loudspeakersplus.com/product/BMD440.8RD/P-AUDIOBMD4408RD/  Just replace the diaphragm and you have a whole new tweeter. These will be around for a long time as there are tons of speaker out there using them.

And I wouldn't worry much about the woofer at all. They are super tough. If you don't poke a hole in one with something then you'll be fine.

[stevenkelby]

I'm not worried at all, I don't think my coax's will need replacement parts anytime soon. If they do, I'll worry about it then.

If parts can't be had and a different driver needs to be used with a different crossover, I'll worry about that if and when it happens, but I don't think it will, it seems very unlikely to be an issue.

Good idea to buy a couple $55 tweeters though to keep in a cupboard just in case kids poke the tweeters or something. I may buy some in future but it sounds like they will available for years to come.