[jlafrenz]

It seems that the VPI, Clearaudio and Rega continually get recommended. So what are some of the pros/cons that you guys have found with these tables?

[cheap-Jack]

Hi.

Right now I have the Music Hall 5.1 with the Goldring 1012 cart. I am looking for something that is a bit smoother on the top end and a little more in the mid range. It seems just a bit lacking to me. I don't find myself listening to my vinyl as much any more as it doesn't give me as intimate of sound as I am looking for. I would really like to rediscover my vinyl collection and start listening to it more.

TT & cartridge are not a fashion which one likes to change every season, my friend. It can be a pain, & expensive pain maybe.

Besides you think by replacing another new TT & cartridge can give you the sound you want? You are somewhat like searching a needle in a haystack. Frankly whoever tells you whatever is not so sure at all. Like blind leading the blind.

There are other ways of getting the sound you want with less pain & money.

Say, e.g. change the interconnects from yr TT to yr phono-preamp. One less costly & less hazzle solution.

If I were you. me being a phonostage DIYer who knows the trick, I would simply adjust the I/P cartridge loading  resistor of the phono-preamp to get smoother HF & full MF. A few bucks will do the job for me.

FYI, my TT is a 40-year old vintage Thorens 125II with a cheapie no-name MM cartidge. Yet I've matched the cartridge with my DIYed tube phonstages to make it sound superb. It tracks my hundreds of LPs (mostly recycles) w/o problem & delivers excellent sound from Pavarotti, Domingo to Elvis Presley...

 I don't need to replace this old bone shaker as I know sound can be refined many other easier & less costly ways rather than replacing it without knowing the new TT will work at all.

Try not to become many those helpless audio consumers keep on financing equipment vendors.

c-J

[toocool4]

jlafrenz check out this review about one of the Acoustic Solid's turntable, makes interesting reading.

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0402/acousticsolid.htm

[Ericus Rex]

I don't mean to complicate your decision at all but have you seen the Goldenote tables?  (formerly named Bluenote until the record company got upset and threatened litigation)


http://www.goldenote.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=18&Itemid=23&lang=en

I've never had the chance to hear one but they sure are beautiful.  The Piccolo and Valore models should be in your price range.  I think they are now imported by Koetsu USA.  Their arms and carts have gotten many good reviews.  I think they have had very poor past distribution in the US so no one's heard too much about them.

[jjc1]

 As far as Clearaudio is concerned, I have the Performance with Benz Glider and am very pleased with it.

 The Concept is more in your price range ( $1500 sans cart. and about $2000 with MC cart.). I can't testify to the Concept since I've never heard it, but my experience with the Performance leads me to believe that  Clearaudio TTs should all sound excellent at their price point.

[jlafrenz]

Hi.
TT & cartridge are not a fashion which one likes to change every season, my friend. It can be a pain, & expensive pain maybe.

Besides you think by replacing another new TT & cartridge can give you the sound you want? You are somewhat like searching a needle in a haystack. Frankly whoever tells you whatever is not so sure at all. Like blind leading the blind.

There are other ways of getting the sound you want with less pain & money.

Say, e.g. change the interconnects from yr TT to yr phono-preamp. One less costly & less hazzle solution.

If I were you. me being a phonostage DIYer who knows the trick, I would simply adjust the I/P cartridge loading  resistor of the phono-preamp to get smoother HF & full MF. A few bucks will do the job for me.

FYI, my TT is a 40-year old vintage Thorens 125II with a cheapie no-name MM cartidge. Yet I've matched the cartridge with my DIYed tube phonstages to make it sound superb. It tracks my hundreds of LPs (mostly recycles) w/o problem & delivers excellent sound from Pavarotti, Domingo to Elvis Presley...

 I don't need to replace this old bone shaker as I know sound can be refined many other easier & less costly ways rather than replacing it without knowing the new TT will work at all.

Try not to become many those helpless audio consumers keep on financing equipment vendors.

c-J

You have some very valid points and I completely agree with you. I have changed out tubes and tried different settings on the Jolida phono stage. I have looked into the mods for it here on the forum and a couple others. It is something I may also do. It isn't like the Music Hall is bad by any means. I was just listing what I would like in a new table if I get one. There is a bit more to the story with a new turntable. I had someone who was interested in a used table and mine came up in discussion. If that person decides to buy it from me it gives me an excuse to try out a new table. Part of the hobby that I enjoy is trying out different pieces of gear.

[E4T]

I love my Clearaudio Concept.  For the price, it is a fantastic table.  But there look to be a lot of great suggestions here, can't really go wrong with any of them.

[cheap-Jack]

Hi.

You have some very valid points and I completely agree with you. 

There is a bit more to the story with a new turntable. I had someone who was interested in a used table and mine came up in discussion. If that person decides to buy it from me it gives me an excuse to try out a new table. Part of the hobby that I enjoy is trying out different pieces of gear.

Glad you get my message - don't let the equipment vendors eat our lunch so easily. If you have told me yr inside story, I'd not have posted such lengthy messasge.

Anyway this forum is read by tons of readers out there who hopefully also get the message intended for you. Beware of sales pitches given by vendors & their delegates who are out for our hard-earned cash - it is their hidden agenda.

Happy hunting for what you want!

c-J

[SteveRB]

... I really don't know what I want ...

I think this is primary in the original post. Until you know what you want -- you will be throwing money around. Right now you have a ton of strangers all telling you what they like.

In my opinion you should not buy anything new. Look for someone selling a system (table, arm, cart). Your money will go five times further this way. Also, if you take care of the gear, you should be able to flip it (with minimal loss on investment) towards something you actually want -- when you have a better understanding of what you want.

For $500 you should be able to find a perfectly set up Rega P3... then why buy a new P1?!

I search for 3 minutes before I found this...
http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/649024815-rega_planar_3/

and just to add to the frenzy, my priorities have always been: table, arm, cart. Also source, speakers, amps...

good luck.

[jarcher]

That looks like a decent deal - just make sure the shipping is with insurance (especially if not in the original box) 

I don't quite understand why people seem to downplay the importance of a good phono preamp.  If a decent preamp is so important for regular higher level signals, why ignore it for the much lower level phono signal (especially for MC)?  For my experience moving up from the built in MM phono stage of a Rega Mira 3 - often considered a very decent MM phono stage - to a used Sonic Frontiers SFP-1 (used at $400) was a HUGH step up, even w/ a budget table & cartridge.

And there's not much sense on blowing the whole budget on a table & arm, then having little to nothing for the cartridge, preamp, IC's, etc.  How does that make sense?  Do people really think that a combo of a $50 cartridge on a $1K table and $100-200 preamp and whatever IC's is really going to be the best allocation of limited funds?   

As other have said, if you buy wisely - particularly used - then why not spread the money evenly & wisely among all the components of the vinyl playing system, then sell on for minimal loss as your taste & budget increases & refines?

[sharpsuxx]

Hey Jud, long time no see,

I completely agree about the Clearaudio Concept TT, they carry them at Enjoy the Music in St. Louis by me.  You should come out some time and give it a listen.  We could grab some beers afterwards, even better.  Either that or get some awesome retro job.

give me a call if you want to set up a weekend,

[saisunil]

I am looking for a TT, arm and cart modern or vintage around one grand ... Would appreciate suggestions or pointers or trade or sale ...

Thanks
Sunil

[neobop]

Right now I have the Music Hall 5.1 with the Goldring 1012 cart. I am looking for something that is a bit smoother on the top end and a little more in the mid range. It seems just a bit lacking to me. I don't find myself listening to my vinyl as much any more as it doesn't give me as intimate of sound as I am looking for. I would really like to rediscover my vinyl collection and start listening to it more.

Don't know what happened with your possible sale, but I think the biggest problem is with the cart.  That's the weak link IMO.  Isn't that the giveaway cart that came with the table?  If you're getting a new table, by all means get a better cart.  With a budget of 1.5 - 2K for a new set-up, you'll probably be going sideways if you include a cart.  If the sale isn't happening, a good cart will be a nice improvement and might keep you happy.  You can sample a bunch, including your Goldring, here:
http://daveyw.edsstuff.org/vinyl/cartridges/
neo

[neobop]

I am looking for a TT, arm and cart modern or vintage around one grand ... Would appreciate suggestions or pointers or trade or sale ...

Thanks
Sunil

Do you have records, phono stage, record cleaning?   Are you into tweaking, or more plug-n-play?     What do you have to trade?   

I would be inclined to get something like this:
http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649019445-classic_luxman_pd277_turntable/

This vintage Luxman (1980) has a brushless/slotless motor.  Stuffed with a few pounds of modeling clay this will outperform any $1K new table.  Nice sounding MM on there that will take any modern AT 120/440 stylus.  A new dust cover will run around $120.

If you don't want to mess with a 30 yr old table, maybe something like this:
http://app.audiogon.com/listings/turntables-music-hall-mmf-7-1-trade-in-turntable-2012-10-25-analog-30067

http://app.audiogon.com/listings/turntables-music-hall-mm7-turntable-plus-project-speedbox-2012-11-04-analog-97405-eugene-or

http://app.audiogon.com/listings/turntables-rega-rp6-turntable-2012-11-15-analog-84304   ??

http://app.audiogon.com/listings/turntables-micro-seiki-dq-3-vintage-audiophile-turntable-nos-2012-10-30-analog-91344-granada-hills-ca

http://app.audiogon.com/listings/turntables-rega-planar-3-with-grace-727-tonearm-and-audio-technica-cartridge-2012-10-19-analog-53156

neo

[jimdgoulding]

I am looking for a TT, arm and cart modern or vintage around one grand ... Would appreciate suggestions or pointers or trade or sale ...

Thanks
Sunil

VPI has a new entry at around $1200 with a 10" arm.  VPI makes both excellent tables and arms.  Have to add a cart, however.  I believe its name is The Traveler.

[Ericus Rex]

I'd go with Neo's rec of the Luxman.  That arm (maybe the whole table )is most certainly made by Micro Seiki.  No sloucher there.  If you really need to spend all of your $1k you could put a very good Ortofon or Dynavector cartridge on it and have very good sound.

I have owned Oracle tables as well.  You could definitely find an old Alexandria for under $1k (maybe even an old Delphi) but their setup procedure isn't for the faint of heart.   The Luxman would be far easier to deal with.

[Part-Time Audiophile]

At the sub $2k point, I've had luck with Pro-Ject. VPI is a big step up and that metal platter sounds really good -- I'm hoping to get a Traveler at some point, as I was very impressed with the sound of table in a direct comparison with a more expensive VPI table. Up from there, I've been impressed with the Funk Vector and Townshend Rock (may be able to find it used?).

[geowak]

Look at the Well Tempered Labs line. Great design, great sound, very musical and a good budget TT.

[saisunil]

Neo and others - thank you for your replies.

I like the luxman suggestion - don't know if that is a mc or mm cart - Signet 5Ea
Micro seiki also seems interesting
I am not very enthusiastic about Rega unless I go for their higher end model
Music hall - I have heard the same thing - that you need a better cart

I would rather have more plug and play than something which will make my life more difficult instead of enjoying the records

I will be getting a vista audio phono stage
I have been advised to go for an MC type cart
I read VPI traveller review and it sounds good to me
I am also hearing that I am better of putting my money towards a vintage table

Regardless I need the package deal table, arm and cart ... I do not mind piecemeal as long as putting it together would not require hours and hours or understanding and figuring etc.

I was a good sounding table that would not require too much thinking.

I have a el34 based tube amp, cables and bunch of "stuff" that I could trade or just buy the table on cash.

I am in jersey so would be great if there is a local seller.

Super thanks
Sunil

[brooklyn]

I have a VPI Scout for many years now, build quality is excellent. I put an Ortofon 2m Black on it and it sounds very nice.
I would think a used or new Scout with a cartridge of your choice would sound pretty darn good.. M2C

Jerry