Is it just me or is there more and more builders of Planar or Electrostat's?

medium jim · « **Reply #60 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 01:33 am »

Quote from: Rclark on 27 Oct 2012, 12:34 am

I have one Epik Legend right now. Dual opposed sealed 12's, totally inert, vibration free cabinet, musical, punchy up high, excellent midbass, but drops to 20. About the best MMG sub you could ask for, imo.

forgot to mention, American made, $500 for one, $900 per pair.

There should be no mid bass coming from your subs. Why? Mid bass is typically defined as 140-400hz.
Jim

Rclark · « **Reply #61 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 01:44 am »

Consider it double duty. It works here, I promise. I get my Ncores here on Monday and will end up crossing over much lower at that time. But as it stands now, this sub sounds more like a nice woofer than a sub up high. It's pretty cool. Tons of very fast punch.

BruceSB · « **Reply #62 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 01:47 am »

I remember a number of years back when I was buying a new pre amp.
The dealer had the proposed preamp set up on a top system with a very expensive monitor (proac).
The dealer was called away and told me to "have a good listen".
I listened and I listened and something was wrong.
I just could not pin point it.
The dealer came back and I remarked about it to him.
He said, "Bruce you are hearing the box!!!"
After the better part of 20 years with a full range electrostat I was just not used to listening to the box!

Let me add a few more planers to the list.
ER Audio
http://www.eraudio.com.au/
PIO Sound
http://www.piosound.com/en/
Liquid Base
http://liquidbase.com.au/
Soul Sonic
http://www.soulsonicspeakers.com/products.html
Audio Exklusiv
http://www.audio-exklusiv.de/

I think there are also a couple more electrostat manufacturers but this tops up the above list.
Regards
Bruce

medium jim · « **Reply #63 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 01:48 am »

Quote from: Rclark on 27 Oct 2012, 01:44 am

Consider it double duty. It works here, I promise. I get my Ncores here on Monday and will end up crossing over much lower at that time. But as it stands now, this sub sounds more like a nice woofer than a sub up high. It's pretty cool. Tons of very fast punch.

Most subs are only designed to go 120hz and lower, a few maybe from 160hz and lower, which barely touches into the mid bass. My guess is that releaving the bottom octaves from the mmg's has enhanced the mid bass on the panels and not from the sub. If you hear the sub at all, then the integration is not good....the sub should be invisable and just fill the room with energy.

Jim

SteveFord · « **Reply #64 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 01:55 am »

BruceSB,
Thanks for the links, I added them to the list.
I also put the manufacturer's list on the first post in Welcome To The Planar Circle as an easy to locate reference (hopefully).

medium jim · « **Reply #65 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 01:58 am »

Quote from: SteveFord on 27 Oct 2012, 01:55 am

BruceSB,
Thanks for the links, I added them to the list.
I also put the manufacturer's list on the first post in Welcome To The Planar Circle as an easy to locate reference (hopefully).

There was a maker that advertised on the AA and for the life of me cannot recall the name. I feel neglectful as I bought up the concept of there being more than ever before makers and allowed Steve, Bruce and a few others to do the naming and links.

Jim

wisnon · « **Reply #66 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 02:00 am »

Quote from: medium jim on 25 Oct 2012, 11:11 pm

Steve,

I guess it is taboo to say something is the best to the troll. But let me say it again, the planar is the best type of speaker at reproducing music. Disclaimer: YMMV

Jim

LoL

Keep up with the times...
along with Heil AMT : http://www.precide.ch/eng/eheil/eheil.htm
'Polite' is a word that too easily damns with faint praise, and in the first few moments of listening to these speakers I did wonder if it was appropriate in just that way. This is a sound not unlike that of the Quad ESL-63 - so clean and seamless in the HF as to seem almost subdued, until you realise that what is missing is the artificial edge imparted by so many conventional tweeters, even today.

You also have the LMT : http://www.6moons.com/industryfeatures/lmt/1.html
Options abound.

SteveFord · « **Reply #67 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 02:13 am »

There's a lot more of them than I thought.
I thought that there were more electrostats popping up recently (in both the speakers and headphones) and that list confirms it.

Rclark · « **Reply #68 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 02:15 am »

Naw Jim, the integration is excellent. Ever hear of a HSU MBM? This sub is capable of filling the same role as an MBM but also drops low. Same concept here, I have my Legend up nearfield and between my speakers. The integration is fantastic.

BruceSB · « **Reply #69 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 02:26 am »

A little bit of supplementary information.

I understand both ER Audio and SoundLab (both electrostats) will do customised work for people.

Soul Sonic make some very impressive planar ribbon speakers.

Here is an extra electrostatic manufacturer.
Solostatic another electrostat maker.
http://www.solostatic.com/

Hope this helps with the list.
Regards.
Bruce

medium jim · « **Reply #70 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 03:14 am »

Quote from: Rclark on 27 Oct 2012, 02:15 am

Naw Jim, the integration is excellent. Ever hear of a HSU MBM? This sub is capable of filling the same role as an MBM but also drops low. Same concept here, I have my Legend up nearfield and between my speakers. The integration is fantastic.

HSU mid bass module is completely different than a sub. I was just going off of what you posted, you noted mid bass from your sub, which cannot be the case. Again, by using a sub, you have lightened the load on your MMG's and this is why the mid bass has improved with more dynamic slam.

Jim

Rclark · « **Reply #71 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 03:29 am »

Jim, the midbass capability of the Legend is actually an advertised feature.. I don't know what to tell you, it sounds great.

medium jim · « **Reply #72 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 03:41 am »

Quote from: Rclark on 27 Oct 2012, 03:29 am

Jim, the midbass capability of the Legend is actually an advertised feature.. I don't know what to tell you, it sounds great.

Rclark:

That is what is so baffling, that they claim excellent mid bass yet the crossover points are 150hz and lower and with a useful range of 20-200hz. I suppose it touches the very lowest limits of mid bass. I have no doubt that your mid bass has improved because of the sub, again because you have in effect taken the sub bass and low bass away from the MMG's which allows them to be more effective in the mid bass.

Why? Because you have increased the usable mass on the panels to produce mid bass.

It is all good and I'm glad that you have an excellent sub. It will only get better once you do go to multiple subs.

Jim

Rclark · « **Reply #73 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 04:08 am »

Well with Virtue I've found I like it pretty high because the Virtue is highpassed at 80. I was skeptical to turn the sub up, but like I said, it's punchy, fast, and clean like a woofer. Sounds incredible. Buy like I said, Ncores are inbound and they are a whole different story, I'll be crossing much lower.

medium jim · « **Reply #74 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 04:36 am »

Quote from: Rclark on 27 Oct 2012, 04:08 am

Well with Virtue I've found I like it pretty high because the Virtue is highpassed at 80. I was skeptical to turn the sub up, but like I said, it's punchy, fast, and clean like a woofer. Sounds incredible. Buy like I said, Ncores are inbound and they are a whole different story, I'll be crossing much lower.

I don't know where you have them crossed at now, if you like the results, don't deviate too much no matter how many watts you are going to have.

My summer amp is over 400 watts per channel and I don't change the sub settings from my tube mono blocks. I have mine set at 80hz which allows some low bass on the panels to aide in the integration. I have plenty of slam even with the subs gain turned down and measure less than 3db+ at 40hz and are flat at 30.

Funny thing about bass is that less can be more.

Bottom line, it is good to know that your system is coming together and that you are pleased by it. I had the snitzle when I was in my 20's and it took me 30 years to come up with even a better system. And even then I went through a lot of trial and error to get system synergy. The last ingredient was the 2.5's.

Jim

Rclark · « **Reply #75 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 05:16 am »

Nice Jim. I think I'm pretty lucky and so far have made a lot of serendipitous choices, thanks to this forum.

Btw, hey planar guys, this has to be about the best deal going right now, check out this beast

http://www.srlacoustics.com/8-ft-wide-bare-diffuser/

persisting1 · « **Reply #76 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 06:27 am »

So are medium jim and Rclark pals now?

SteveFord · « **Reply #77 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 10:05 am »

Didn't you know? They're the same person.
I need to spend some time experimenting with room treatment for the MMGs as the L/H one is situated oddly and there's not much I can do about the placement but that is totally derailing this thread.

medium jim · « **Reply #78 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 03:46 pm »

Quote from: persisting1 on 27 Oct 2012, 06:27 am

So are medium jim and Rclark pals now?

I've never disliked Rclark....

Jim

OzarkTom · « **Reply #79 on:** 27 Oct 2012, 06:50 pm »

Don't forget all of those used Acoustats that are being sold for $500 or less. Add the Roger Modjeski Direct Drive amp, and any of these other ESL's are a mute point. The only way to get the best sound in an ESL is DD amps.