[Rooster19]

Hey everybody -

I'm thinking of joing the salk family with Songtowers and a Songcenter to start a HT setup.

Would anyone be able to offer advice on what type of amplification would be needed? Would a typical upper-midrange AVR be able to handle these, or would a pre-pro setup be the way to go?

[Meicheng]

I owned a pair of Songtowers and they are very easy to drive with anythign from a 40 watt/channel tube amp so about aby solid state amp with 80-100 watts/channel or better.  The main thing you might be giving up with a mid-line AV Receiver is a bit sound quailty.  But no problem driving them whatsoever. 

[Meicheng]

Wow, forgive all my typos!

[audiocrazy]

I drive my SongTowers and center with Outlaw Amp and Integra DTC-9.8 pre/pro.
I have a Cary Audio Tube amp that i sometime use for music and ST sounds really sweet with tube.
They are very easy to drive and i never find them power hungry.

[sfox7076]

I have driven them with a tube amp that is less than 30w per channel without any problem.  They are not power hungry at all.  They can take power, don't get me wrong, but they do not need it.

[rick240]

Actually, what I'd be interested in is a spec for maximum short term rated power.

The only negative I've ever heard about Salk speakers relates to low sensitivity and the ability to handle dynamics in HT applications (note that this has only ever been in theoretical discussions; I've never heard any Salk owners ever complain  ).

Since these dynamic peaks are very short term, providing a powerful enough amp to give the short term juice should be the answer - so long as the high power blast wouldn't damage the speaker.

Hence the need for a maximum short term power rating.

[jsalk]

Actually, what I'd be interested in is a spec for maximum short term rated power.

The ER15 is rated for a maximum 250 watts short term.

- Jim

[Big Red Machine]

The ST's are not low sensitivity and require little power to make them go.

As far as dynamics, all Salks are known for dynamics and you have to power them according to their sensitivity numbers and you will not skip a beat.  40 wpc for an HT3 is ridiculously low, but at 84 db you can see why, for instance.  But anyone who has fed them 150 watts or more know firsthand they do not lack dynamics.

Actually, what I'd be interested in is a spec for maximum short term rated power.

The only negative I've ever heard about Salk speakers relates to low sensitivity and the ability to handle dynamics in HT applications (note that this has only ever been in theoretical discussions; I've never heard any Salk owners ever complain  ).

Since these dynamic peaks are very short term, providing a powerful enough amp to give the short term juice should be the answer - so long as the high power blast wouldn't damage the speaker.

Hence the need for a maximum short term power rating.

[fsimms]

The ER15 is rated for a maximum 250 watts short term.

- Jim

Since you have 2 ER15's per speaker would that be 500 watts per channel short term?

Bob

[rick240]

The ER15 is rated for a maximum 250 watts short term.

- Jim

Thanks Jim.

Are the Wxx rated higher (i.e. W18 in HT1, W15 in supercharged Songs, or W12 in WOW1 or HT0.5)?

[srb]

The W15 has a little higher long term power handling than the E15 (70W vs 60W) but the short term power handling is actually lower at 200W vs 250W.

Steve

[jsalk]

Are the Wxx rated higher (i.e. W18 in HT1, W15 in supercharged Songs, or W12 in WOW1 or HT0.5)?

The W12 and W15 are rated at 200W short term max and the W18 at 250 watts. 

There are two things to think about here...

First, we have been using some of these drivers for almost a decade now and have never had a single failure in the field due to exceeding the power handling capabilities of the drivers.

Second, if you are driving them that hard, chances are it won't matter all that much as the hearing damage that would result would render you deaf in no time anyway.

- Jim

[rick240]

The W12 and W15 are rated at 200W short term max and the W18 at 250 watts.

Thanks

First, we have been using some of these drivers for almost a decade now and have never had a single failure in the field due to exceeding the power handling capabilities of the drivers.

This is a good thing, and speaks volumes over theoretical discussions.

Second, if you are driving them that hard, chances are it won't matter all that much as the hearing damage that would result would render you deaf in no time anyway.

Not really. It's the standard discussion (theoretical) you get into with high-sensitivity/dynamics/HT proponents.

If you're listening at 80db (which is far from harmful) many movies (and some music) will have a 25db peak on one of the speakers.

If you assume that you're 18 feet from 85db sensitivity mains, and that the two mains are primary for the 80dB, then you need 5W. Each speaker, at 18 feet, with 5W is at 77.2 db.

For that speaker to have a 25db peak it will need to hit 102db. That would take 1500 watts. For a 20db peak (more sane) it would take an instantaneous 500 watts.

At 250watts, the maximum peak is 17db. With a 5x250watt amp, listening at about 80db, all peaks over 17db will result in clipping. At 200watts it's 1db lower.

Now if your base level is good at 75db instead of 80db, then the 250watt amp supports 22.5db peaks without clipping.

And of course I have no idea how the subwoofer should impact all of these calculations  Wouldn't crossing over at 80Hz change either sensitivity rating or power handling?

Just trying to learn as I plan and dream.

Next step, figure out what kind of SPL I like listening to things at (when I feel like loud).

EDIT (Aug. 20): So did some more thinking (and will post questions on AVS for wider spread feedback), but the subwoofer and extra speakers must come into play with these instantaneous peaks.

So, an 85db sensitive speaker, at 18 feet, at 200watts will provide 93.2 db at the LP. To support an isolated 20db peak (or a 23 db peak assuming it is split with the sub) would have this speaker contributing 73.2db to the base level. If you assume that the front 3 plus the sub all contribute to the base, that's 79.2 db (damn close to 80db) which is probably just fine.

Pretty much confirms Jim's experience that unless you listen at insane volumes, 85db sensitive speakers should be just fine for HT dynamics