[FullRangeMan]

The 'stealing' on consumer end is bullsh*t excuse for an industry stalling and slow to change and embrace technology and distribution. Radiohead proved that with their online album where people paid whatever they want. Guess how they made out. Louis CK is proving that with his online tour and video sales. Guess how he made out. Ebooks are doing the same for publishing. 50 Shades of $$$$.

The traditional models are over and done but fat cats want to keep poickets lined at expense of the artists like they had through the 20th century. So they back legislation to keep control by crying piracy and theft. Yet independent artists are now carving their own niche out of the long tail and making more of a living than if they had to kiss industry @zz. They're too busy being successful for doing what they love to mention the rampant theft and stealing I guess. I suppose they're a bit... occupied.

Interest point of view. On Radio Head there is a minimum to pay??
I would like to know how much people have paid since then, seems this fact occur some years ago.
RH sell all his albums this way??

[doug s.]

The 'stealing' on consumer end is bullsh*t excuse for an industry stalling and slow to change and embrace technology and distribution. Radiohead proved that with their online album where people paid whatever they want. Guess how they made out. Louis CK is proving that with his online tour and video sales. Guess how he made out. Ebooks are doing the same for publishing. 50 Shades of $$$$.

The traditional models are over and done but fat cats want to keep poickets lined at expense of the artists like they had through the 20th century. So they back legislation to keep control by crying piracy and theft. Yet independent artists are now carving their own niche out of the long tail and making more of a living than if they had to kiss industry @zz. They're too busy being successful for doing what they love to mention the rampant theft and stealing I guess. I suppose they're a bit... occupied.

agreed, and i agreed when this topic came up prewiously, in an earlier thread.  the major record labels made this same argument in the 70's w/the adwent of the cassette tape; in fact tape sharing spurred sales of recorded music, as people got exposed to more music, and bought more music.  yet, the industry was still successful in getting the usa congress to pass a law that mandated a certain percentage of every blank cassette tape sold went to the riaa.

in the last thread where this topic was discussed, i linked an article written by courtney love, in 2000, which discussed, at length, the problem w/the major recording labels, and how the internet could turn everything on its ear.  the problem is not small-time copyright theft by end users...

it's a wery long article, but a good read:
http://www.salon.com/2000/06/14/love_7/

doug s.

[JerryM]

...the problem is not small-time copyright theft by end users...

it's a wery long article, but a good read:
http://www.salon.com/2000/06/14/love_7/

doug s.

I also agree with that summation.

Jeeze, think back to the old days when vinyl was all you could get. Do you have any idea how many albums I gave away, traded, or was given, all for free? That is verboten; it always has been.

If pop music has poor sales, maybe the industry should back off trying to sell it. It's obviously becoming a poor investment choice as a genre. Thievery is hardly to blame for the industry's poor purchasing or marketing ability.

[opnly bafld]

Jeeze, think back to the old days when vinyl was all you could get. Do you have any idea how many albums I gave away, traded, or was given, all for free? That is verboten; it always has been.

What?
Only a problem if you give it away and keep it. 

[doug s.]

I also agree with that summation.

Jeeze, think back to the old days when vinyl was all you could get. Do you have any idea how many albums I gave away, traded, or was given, all for free? That is verboten; it always has been.

If pop music has poor sales, maybe the industry should back off trying to sell it. It's obviously becoming a poor investment choice as a genre. Thievery is hardly to blame for the industry's poor purchasing or marketing ability.

besides, pop music has always sucked.  at least in my opinion.  i stopped listening to pop music about 45 years ago...  it has always tried to appeal to the lcd...

ymmv,

doug s.

[doug s.]

What?
Only a problem if you give it away and keep it. 

care to enlighten us as to what you mean?    

doug s.

[opnly bafld]

Title 17 "first sale"

[doug s.]

Title 17 "first sale"

ahhh, now i get it.

"the first sale doc­trine, also known as the exhaus­tion doc­trine, has long applied as a lim­i­ta­tion on copy­right and other forms of intel­lec­tual prop­erty.  The idea is that once a law­fully pro­duced (i.e. licensed) copy has been sold to a con­sumer, the copy­right owner can no longer con­trol the dis­tri­b­u­tion of that copy.  In other words, the dis­tri­b­u­tion right is “exhausted” by the “first sale” of a par­tic­u­lar copy..."
(this quote is from the following site, but it can be found in other places):
http://title17.net/2011/08/the-vanishing-first-sale-doctrine-second-circuit-joins-ninth-in-holding-first-sale-not-applicable-to-copies-manufactured-outside-u-s/

still, i don't see this as being a problem, in spite of what the riaa has argued, for years.  end-user copying and distributing of music, as i said before, has only served to spur exposure, and sales.  of course, if the content sucks, well, that's another issue...   

doug s.

[opnly bafld]

still, i don't see this as being a problem, in spite of what the riaa has argued, for years.  end-user copying and distributing of music, as i said before, has only served to spur exposure, and sales.  of course, if the content sucks, well, that's another issue...   

I was only clarifying the law, not offering an opinion.

[HT cOz]

In my mind, Pop is about having fun and living in the moment.  It is the exact opposite of serious music.  For the record, I like many different kinds of music that includes Pop.   

You don't hold McDonalds to the same standards as say Mark's (A fine Houston resturant)

[Tyson]

I'm with HTcOz.

[FullRangeMan]

Not wanting to be boring, but the recording industry also is with HTcOz, so they dont spend additional money in fine recordings or purist audiophile recordings for pop music, as sound quality not important(mainly for vinyl era) just the fun of the moment.

Then in consequence today we are hearing old recordings from great astist as Roy Orbison, ELP, Mike Oldfield and T.Dream with the worst possible sound quality.

[wushuliu]

In my mind, Pop is about having fun and living in the moment.  It is the exact opposite of serious music.  For the record, I like many different kinds of music that includes Pop.   

You don't hold McDonalds to the same standards as say Mark's (A fine Houston resturant)

Yeah but McDonald's is everywhere (shudder), and Mark's isn't.

[doug s.]

i am definitely into my share of "having fun and living in the moment" types of music.  pop simply ain't it.  i guess it has to do w/what you might consider "pop".  is elvis costello, little feat, the rolling stones, xtc, "pop"?

i equate pop w/what you hear on typical top-40 music stations.  which i stopped listening to when i was about 10...

ymmv,

doug s.

[FullRangeMan]

i am definitely into my share of "having fun and living in the moment" types of music.  pop simply ain't it.  i guess it has to do w/what you might consider "pop".  is elvis costello, little feat, the rolling stones, xtc, "pop"?

i equate pop w/what you hear on typical top-40 music stations.  which i stopped listening to when i was about 10...

ymmv,

doug s.

i equate pop w/what you hear on typical top-40 music stations.  which i stopped listening to when i was about 10...