TBI Millenia MG3 Class BD Integrated Audio Amplifier..A Modern Day Giant Killer!

rodge827 · « **Reply #240 on:** 25 Sep 2012, 02:21 am »

Hey, I tell it like it is.

Oops almost forgot my Demo List:

Various tracks from all below except where noted:

Miles Davis...Kind Of Blue
Cassandra Wilson..Blue Light Till Dawn
Tommy Emmanuel...Center Stage
Ray Brown...Walk On
Dave Grusin...Homage To Duke
Earl Klugh...Solo Guitar
Chris Tomlin...Amazing Grace (My Chains Are Gone) from the Amazing Grace Sound Track
Peter Gabriel...Scratch My Back
Eagles...Hell Freezes Over
Nils Lofgren...Acoustic Live
Janis Ian...Breaking Silence
Rusted Root...When I Woke

OzarkTom · « **Reply #241 on:** 28 Sep 2012, 01:47 am »

Thank you Chris for joining the tour. Chris was the first to try the amp with the new Cardas RCA mods. It sounds like they are working great.

rklein should have the amp now, so watch for a review after this weekend.

If anyone is curious about batteries and how to hook them up, here are two great sites to watch and read.

http://www.dekabatteries.com/assets/base/0139.pdf

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1Mqn6Ewvio

OzarkTom · « **Reply #242 on:** 29 Sep 2012, 01:33 am »

rklein's music server went down this week and unfortunately he could not get the server back up to listen to the TBI. He was very disappointed.

He might be shipping the amp out tomorrow, Gopher is up next.

Rclark · « **Reply #243 on:** 29 Sep 2012, 02:09 am »

damn, that's a bummer, I was looking forward to Rklein.

Gopher · « **Reply #244 on:** 3 Oct 2012, 01:33 am »

I recieved the TBI and have had it up and playing or about 20 minutes now. I will admit this is a definite overachiever for the money. My system consists of a Bolder modified SB Touch feeding a Metrum Octave going to the TBI which is then going to Zu Def 2 speakers with upgraded nanotech drivers... Wywires Silver series cables tie everything together.

It is less forward and voices are less palpable then my Melody AN211 SET amp and it doesn't seem to capture the texture and delicacy quite as well, nor do I have the same tonal saturation and image density, but keeping the cost in perspective, its really good. I will almost definitely be building a buddy a budget system with this as the amplification.

Its very resolved, balanced and seemingly pretty musically engaging. More to come as I spend more time with it.

Freo-1 · « **Reply #245 on:** 3 Oct 2012, 02:34 am »

Nice observations, Gopher.

The performance with the TBI is improved when using as monoblocks. There is better dynamics, less distortion, and subtle complexties are brought out more. Although it does add cost, it still is pretty reasonable by audio standards.

Looking forward to reading more of your observations.

wisnon · « **Reply #246 on:** 3 Oct 2012, 05:35 pm »

I wonder how it would compare to this:
http://www.templeaudio.co.uk/bantamgold.html

or this bridged monoblock version:
http://www.templeaudio.co.uk/monoblock.html

TNT did a review too....they seem similar and price is about the same in dollars, or even a bit cheaper.
http://www.tnt-audio.com/ampli/bantam_gold_e.html

I do have the Bantam Gold, but have only ever used it in my secondary bedroom system (tried with various bookshelf speakers like Davis Dufy, Vintage Celestions and finally some small Yamahas) It all sounds great, but I never did any critical listening and its all fed by a stock SB Touch. I will try them with the newly acquired Oskar Heil Aulos speakers later on and also probably try it in the main system one of these days. Main amp is a modded NAD SS integrated..

The TBI sounds very intriguing and is perhaps cut from the same cloth. The designer of the Bantam is a retired UK radar engineer.

electriceye · « **Reply #247 on:** 5 Oct 2012, 04:47 pm »

Has anyone heard this and a Red Wine Audio integrated? Wondering how they compare (if they compare at all, I realize there is a $1000 difference in price). Debating on saving up for a used red wine integrated or going with this.

Gopher · « **Reply #248 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 01:51 am »

I spent a few days with the TBI and its not a bad piece for the coin, but ultimately it wouldn't satisfy me long or even really mid term. Its just lacking too much weight, texture and emotion. My speakers are extremely revealing and perhaps more appropriate matches for the TBI would be a lot gentler on it, but its not quite there.

If lean, clean and highly resolved is your thing, this amp can please you, but my 211 SET has spoiled me.

Tom,

I really appreciate the loaner and will get it back to you this coming week---probably tuesday on account of the holiday monday.

mytubes211 · « **Reply #249 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 04:46 am »

electriceye,

I have RWA Signature 15 (in my opinion top of Vinnie work for the money) but have now waiting for costume build from Vinnie's big brothers monos. I was one of the guy's who have TBI home for test drive. I did not mention nothing about RWA in my review because price differential. I did feel that is not fair, but if you ask me I prefer RWA over TBI in seconds. I'm sure that other story is TBI after modifications, but that is now with price close to RWA. But as I always say: All is depending from your system synergy and your music preference. I know that my review is hard to read, but that was before this side was update. I have hard time to posted my thoughts. Now is much better.

Cheers Ritchie

JLM · « **Reply #250 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 09:49 am »

Tom is putting this amp out there (literally - thanks!) as a giant killer, so I plan on making an unfair comparison when it gets here (which will be when?).

The most useful comparisons will be against known pieces. Mine will be Channel Island Audio D-100's (Dusty's original modded Hypex based monoblocks with beefy power supplies).

cab · « **Reply #251 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 01:54 pm »

The title of the thread is "modern day giant killer" so it would seem only logical that it would be compared to giants...What is wrong with comparing it to amps that cost 4-5 times as much? If it only bests other amps at its price point, it can hardly be called a giant killer.

Freo-1 · « **Reply #252 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 02:35 pm »

The TBI on the battery does indeed compare well with amps costing several times more. It is one of a very few Class D offerings that I have found to sound musical as opposed to harsh/offensive. The vast majority of Class D amps I have heard do not sound all that good with my speakers.

Remember, synergy is always in play here. It is intended for usage in low wattage situations, where it (generally) sounds excellent. For those folks who wish to get the SET sound without having to worry about dodgy Chinese output tubes, this is a good option for consideration.

This amp is certainly not for everyone. For example, if the speaker is current hungry, this may not be the best option. I tried it with a 93db/w speaker, and while it sounded good, it was not an optimum match for it, as the speaker has eight drivers per side (including 3 10” woofers). However, when it was hooked it up to the high input (120 Hz and higher), it performed great.

Lastly, using two TBI amps in mono elevates performance to a higher level. Even if you have two amps, the cost is still very reasonable by audiophile standards.

OzarkTom · « **Reply #253 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 02:38 pm »

Thanks Gopher for joining the tour and your opinion.

I currently have an $8800 GIANT SET amp in house, but the TBI is the one I listen to the most. I am currently using the Rethm Maargas, AMR DP77 Dac/Pre, and the $2400 Rethm cables and IC's, a very revealing $17K system with the TBI amp. Rex has owned a lot of SET amps, OTL amps, and Class A amps including the First Watt F2. We both listen to the TBI the most.

Rex and I had the experience to hear the Ncores on tour, but the TBI had more transparency, more holographic imaging, bigger soundstage, and more emotion than the Ncores had in our systems. I never expected 100% of the tour members to agree with me, no amp in the world will ever get 100% approval because of system synergy. Synergy is the key to every system, I agree with Freo-1.

cab · « **Reply #254 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 03:53 pm »

Quote from: Freo-1 on 7 Oct 2012, 02:35 pm

The TBI on the battery does indeed compare well with amps costing several times more. It is one of a very few Class D offerings that I have found to sound musical as opposed to harsh/offensive. The vast majority of Class D amps I have heard do not sound all that good with my speakers.

Why qualify it? How does it compare to Pass, ML, Atmosphere, etc.?

Quote from: Freo-1 on 7 Oct 2012, 02:35 pm

Remember, synergy is always in play here. It is intended for usage in low wattage situations, where it (generally) sounds excellent. For those folks who wish to get the SET sound without having to worry about dodgy Chinese output tubes, this is a good option for consideration.

Could you expound a bit on "the SET sound"?

[/quote]

cab · « **Reply #255 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 03:56 pm »

Quote from: OzarkTom on 7 Oct 2012, 02:38 pm

Rex and I had the experience to hear the Ncores on tour, but the TBI had more transparency, more holographic imaging, bigger soundstage, and more emotion than the Ncores had in our systems. I never expected 100% of the tour members to agree with me, no amp in the world will ever get 100% approval because of system synergy. Synergy is the key to every system, I agree with Freo-1.

Not sure what the ncore has to do with anything here....

Freo-1 · « **Reply #256 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 04:36 pm »

As a fan of Nelson Pass gear for many years, I can state that the TBI compares very favorably with amps such as a Threshold 400A, SA/3, XA 30.5, and First Watt M2 with the right set of speakers. That is, a speaker that provides a non challenging load of sufficient efficency.

I am reasonably sure most AC members have a pretty good idea of what SET sound is. SET amps are a simple design that often has little or zero feedback, and generally sound more natural than a Class A/B or the vast majority of Class D.

OzarkTom · « **Reply #257 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 04:53 pm »

Quote from: cab on 7 Oct 2012, 03:56 pm

Not sure what the ncore has to do with anything here....

Sorry about that, I had been reading in the Hypex thread that the Ncores was a giant killer.

jackman · « **Reply #258 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 04:59 pm »

The criticism of this amp is unwarranted. No product is loved universally and the TBi seems to compare favorably with several more expensive amps. It's funny but there is a big thread on this site generally praising another well regarded amp. Occasionally someone prefers another amp and all of the fanboys are quick to point out systemsynergy, compatibility or personal preference. It is interesting some people are unwilling to extend the same courtesy to this amp.

Rclark · « **Reply #259 on:** 7 Oct 2012, 05:20 pm »

Well, FWIW Tom seems to have some hugely anamolous power conditions at his house that preclude anything but battery power. Must not watch much tv

I kid. Any AC powered amp it seems makes him run out of the room in less than five minutes.

There are a few with Ncores on this tour that will compare. Anand is one. I will be comparing them on my extremely easy to drive 8ohm GR monitors.

My hunch though, being as this is class D versus class D, not a pretend SET amp versus class D, that the claim of "more tranparent" etc, is, by the numbers alone, a physical impossibility. "Emotion" is largely subjective. We'll see.

If I do like this amp though I might pick one up for a headphone amp or system 2.