[jtwrace]

JT going to bring these ti Rich's get together? Hopefully I'll see you guys there.

As long as I'm still able to make it, they will be there.  I got my second pair together last night so I'm back to NCore listening.   

[mgalusha]

As long as I'm still able to make it, they will be there.  I got my second pair together last night so I'm back to NCore listening.   

+1 

[ted_b]

Ric, once again please don't take my freaking impressions as "going head to head with Modwright".  Just because someone posts his/her listening impressions and compares it to his/her existing setup, doesn't mean it's a shoot-out!

Also, I thought this thread was about tour listening impressions.  My $.02 is that Ric ought to split his mod discussion off to an Ncore mod thread.  Edit:  oops, there already is a Ric Schultz modding thread
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=106382.0

Don't get me wrong; modding is a great topic, just not here on this tour feedback thread.

Edit:  I posted Ric's comments over on his thread, and then commented.

[genjamon]

+1

Ric, once again please don't take my freaking impressions as "going head to head with Modwright".  Just because someone posts his/her listening impressions and compares it to his/her existing setup, doesn't mean it's a shoot-out!

Also, I thought this thread was about tour listening impressions.  My $.02 is that Ric ought to split his mod discussion off to an Ncore mod thread.

[Jeffrey Hedback]

Just a supportive comment on Ted's description of his room as being "fifth row center"...YES INDEED.  Brilliant description of the listening experience in your room.

[Rclark]

I would love to see pics of the behemoths these little 4oz beasties are being compared to. More pics please!

[jtwrace]

Don't get me wrong; modding is a great topic, just not here on this tour feedback thread.

Edit:  I posted Ric's comments over on his thread, and then commented.

You're correct!  This thread is for Tour Listening Impressions. 

I have moved that post to the Tweaking Thread.

[earflappin]

It's two very different amps, doing very different things. 

When i first listened to the NCOREs i had a similar reaction to Ted...i.e. I immediately registered they were different than the other amps I was accustomed to hearing.  It took me several hours to be certain different was better.  It will be interesting to read his comments after more extensive listening. 

[Rocket_Ronny]

my standard is the fifth row, so this is going to take a little getting used to, but even later in the evening the new seats seemed much more comfortable to me already.

Thanks for sharing Ted. Have you tried to move your speakers closer to you and perhaps spread them out a bit? Or, for an easy try, move your chair closer so you get the 5th row effect?

Rocket_Ronny

[ted_b]

Thanks for sharing Ted. Have you tried to move your speakers closer to you and perhaps spread them out a bit? Or, for an easy try, move your chair closer so you get the 5th row effect?

Rocket_Ronny

Valid points, but no and yes.  My speakers are massive and are on Sistrum SP-101 stands (albeit 2 inches high) with points, so I move them only to make sure toe in is spot on (within half an inch).  I moved my listening chair up a bit but it introduces tradeoffs that I'm not willing to barter with.

[Rocket_Ronny]

Fair enough. I know the hassle involved. Often a system change requires new speaker placement, even dac and preamp changes, as you know. If it was me and I had bought the NCores to make the effort worth while, I would pull them out more, perhaps move my seat back a bit and spread the speakers a bit, as well as toe in. Then you should be able to get the 5th row with the same spread you had. Perhaps.

Anyway, always enjoy you comments and thanks for the review.
uNCore, uNCore. 

Rocket_Ronny

[*Scotty*]

ted_b, a couple questions come to mind after reading your listening impressions.
Would you say you listen in the far field or near field? Also is the fifth row center presentation from your system with the Modwright 150 amps consistent from one recording to another or does the perspective change depending upon the recording your are listening to.
Scotty

[ted_b]

Scotty, I listen technically in the far field, as my listening position is ever so slightly farther (10 to 10.5 ft) away from the speakers as they are from each others center (9 ft).  But the differences are close enough, and the speakers large enough, that the feeling you get sitting there is one of near field. 

My somewhat flippant "5th row center" explanation is certainly fluid, as many live acoustic recordings (especially classical) force one to "sit"  further in perspective.  My 5th row is best explained as a wide enveloped perspective, with somewhat aggressive dynamics and a feeling of being near the mix.  This is especially true of studio produced multi-miked recordings, anything from Radiohead to Patricia Barber.

I find many sources and amplification devices that don't allow this fluid nature to occur; i.e everything sounds from the same row!  I dismiss those demos fairly quickly. 

[*Scotty*]

ted_b, thanks for clarifying your description of what you heard. Does the Ncore's more distant perspective also change with the recording and did the perspective change after the amplifiers were left on overnight?
 I am unclear about how long the amplifiers are in peoples possession. I have heard amplifiers that take as long as three days to come back "on-line" after being powered down for five days during shipping. If the amps are powered down for a week during transit and then are powered up for only 24 to 48 hrs. during listening sessions, I consider it remarkable that they are acquitting themselves so well under what I would define as less than ideal circumstances.
Scotty

[cab]

I have heard amplifiers that take as long as three days to come back "on-line" after being powered down for five days during shipping.

What could possibly cause that?

[*Scotty*]

The electrolytic capacitors in the power supply can partially un-form in the absence of an applied DC voltage.
When the capacitors do this their dynamic impedance rises, especially at higher frequencies.
I have experienced this phenomena with amps that have power supplies using Jensen 4-pole electrolytic capacitors. They are fantastic caps, but they do like to have a DC voltage applied to them on a constant basis, which is why I leave my stereo system powered up all the time.
 While the Jensen 4-poles are the worst offenders, I have also heard the same phenomena from high resolution DACS and preamps utilizing very low impedance caps in their power supplies.
It's not beyond the realm of possibility that a similar thing could occur with the Ncore amps.
 Scotty

[lonewolfny42]

Scotty....

I see from the audition list the amps will be heading to DC next....maybe you can contact paul427 for a listen.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=profile;u=40211

[zybar]

The electrolytic capacitors in the power supply can partially un-form in the absence of an applied DC voltage.
When the capacitors do this their dynamic impedance rises, especially at higher frequencies.
I have experienced this phenomena with amps that have power supplies using Jensen 4-pole electrolytic capacitors. They are fantastic caps, but they do like to have a DC voltage applied to them on a constant basis, which is why I leave my stereo system powered up all the time.
 While the Jensen 4-poles are the worst offenders, I have also heard the same phenomena from high resolution DACS and preamps utilizing very low impedance caps in their power supplies.
It's not beyond the realm of possibility that a similar thing could occur with the Ncore amps.
 Scotty

FWIW, I didn't notice any significant change over time with the amps (unlike with my Atma-Sphere MA-1's which do get better within the first hour they are on).  The amps were on for over 24 hrs straight.

George

[ted_b]

The electrolytic capacitors in the power supply can partially un-form in the absence of an applied DC voltage.
When the capacitors do this their dynamic impedance rises, especially at higher frequencies.
I have experienced this phenomena with amps that have power supplies using Jensen 4-pole electrolytic capacitors. They are fantastic caps, but they do like to have a DC voltage applied to them on a constant basis, which is why I leave my stereo system powered up all the time.
 While the Jensen 4-poles are the worst offenders, I have also heard the same phenomena from high resolution DACS and preamps utilizing very low impedance caps in their power supplies.
It's not beyond the realm of possibility that a similar thing could occur with the Ncore amps.
 Scotty

Scotty, I agree 100% with your perceptions here.  Almost any DAC or digital source  I've owned or demo'd required 48 hours of "settling in" (on top of the hundreds of hours of break-in).  My Modwright amps seem to settle in about 12 hours.  With the Ncores I haven't noticed any real changes since maybe the first few hours.  The first hour or so was a bit veiled and slightly looser bass, comparatively, but also nothing like other gear settling changes, sonically.  The settling in is very subtle here.

I ship to Paul (Wash DC) first thing in the am, so I have tonight to finalize my listening notes, and thoughts. 

[hifial]

Scotty, I agree 100% with your perceptions here.  Almost any DAC or digital source  I've owned or demo'd required 48 hours of "settling in" (on top of the hundreds of hours of break-in).  My Modwright amps seem to settle in about 12 hours.  With the Ncores I haven't noticed any real changes since maybe the first few hours.  The first hour or so was a bit veiled and slightly looser bass, comparatively, but also nothing like other gear settling changes, sonically.  The settling in is very subtle here.

I ship to Paul (Wash DC) first thing in the am, so I have tonight to finalize my listening notes, and thoughts. 

Hi Ted. I need to post my listening impressions from the tour and will do so after this post but I would like to find out if you have tried any of the following during your listening.
First a little background;I had a chance to hear Jason's Ncore in three other and my system.

In your review you mention that when you (and a friend) first heard the Ncore you both were not impressed. Had the amp been on for some time with all connections already connected? I have a Nuforce Ref 18 and they must have a chance to be on for a while and they must have the cabling connected while they are on.
Did you use any after market footers under the amps? As that the amps are light any weight on top of them?
What if any after market power cabling did you use?
 
Please do not take my questions as an attack but as suggestions to try while you have them to review.
I also agree with the early posts that they need to be on (and played) for a few days to sound their best.

Regards, Al.