What speakers work well for low watt amps?

eclein · « **Reply #20 on:** 10 Apr 2012, 01:40 pm »

As for speakers...when I had my 6.5 watt integrated I was using it with JBL-L830 3-ways/bookshelf and they are fine.. 90db sensitive-sound great.

Freo-1 · « **Reply #21 on:** 10 Apr 2012, 04:22 pm »

Quote from: JoshK on 10 Apr 2012, 02:09 am

That is fine. I am open for real discussion, but when your post consisted merely of a chart (which showed precisely what I was talking about), and an emoticon, it looked a though you were merely trolling. If you had a serious question, you could have simply articulated such rather than a passive aggressive bait.

Let me rephrase that. Did you actually have a question, or were you merely taking a stab?

There is no back slapping "in-crowd" that you suspect. I was in the "other" camp for most of my audiophiledom, but I learned that that wasn't what I find realistic in sound quality. Then again neither are a lot of hi-eff/low watt systems. Its a delicate balance. I also like other designs, but there is something special about a SET amp and the right system when it gels.

Well stated.

While discussion and differences of opinion are encouraged, need to ensure that postings that offer other views/questions don't come across sounding as being condescending or trolling. Just ask questions and offer viewpoints in a straightforward manner, and all will be fine.

As a First Watt owner, both tubes and transistors are at play here. The main emphasis is low power, regardless of the source.

Ericus Rex · « **Reply #22 on:** 10 Apr 2012, 05:44 pm »

I have very fond memories of my Bedini 25/25 (25 watts/channel pure class A SS). This was the amp that convinced me that pure class A is the only form of SS worth listening to. It was almost as involving as a tube amp and far more involving than many other ss designs I auditioned. I used it with somewhat efficient speakers; started out with Meadowlark Kestrel Hot Rods (89 db iirc), then traded them in on Meadowlark Shearwater Hot Rods (also 89 db?). While I had that amp a number of other speakers went in and out of my system as I had a very generous local hi-end shop who'd let me take all sorts of things home to try; Spica TC-50's (used in the shop - I bought the pair for my Mother), various Totem models, PSBs...I can't remember everything I took home. And that little champ of an amp always grabbed the speakers by the balls and told them what to do. I sold it only b/c the transistors were getting very rare, as they had been out-of-production for 15+ years by the time I got the amp, and required to be replaced in complete matched septets per channel. I didn't want to be stuck with a boat anchor so I sold it and got a much newer Pass Aleph 0s...which I didn't like as much. Now it's all tube for me.

macrojack · « **Reply #23 on:** 10 Apr 2012, 05:47 pm »

I know! I know! Choose me!

Efficient speakers?

saisunil · « **Reply #24 on:** 10 Apr 2012, 06:49 pm »

Our kids are growing and I want to go back to toobs ... actually I am expecting to receive a PP el34 based amp today - but love to get into SET with high sensitivity speakers - may be one of danny's upcoming designs ...

JoshK · « **Reply #25 on:** 10 Apr 2012, 09:22 pm »

PP EL34 amps with triode strapped and heavy into ClassA 10-11w sound awesome. I have one.

Freo-1 · « **Reply #26 on:** 10 Apr 2012, 10:43 pm »

What about a DIY SET with something along the lines of a 211, 805, or 845 tubes?

Which one of the above would work the best, and what driver tubes would be recommended?

saisunil · « **Reply #27 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 12:29 am »

I love the way big tubes like 211 or 845 look ... errr sound

I have also heard that for big tubes like that - you better have nice trannies and nice circuit to round it up ...

JoshK · « **Reply #28 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 12:42 am »

Quote from: saisunil on 11 Apr 2012, 12:29 am

I love the way big tubes like 211 or 845 look ... errr sound
I have also heard that for big tubes like that - you better have nice trannies and nice circuit to round it up ...

Indeed. Winding good transformers for those is no small order. I'd go for the gm70 myself. Cheaper. Copper versions available. Check out vinyl savor blog for a 211 circuit, would work perfectly.

JoshK · « **Reply #29 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 12:45 am »

http://vinylsavor.blogspot.ca/search/label/211

JoshK · « **Reply #30 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 12:48 am »

It's actually an amp I'm planning to build. Except I am going common cathode for the driver to overcome miller cap. Have almost all parts already.

doug s. · « **Reply #31 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 04:49 am »

synergy is definitely important. i had a 5wpc decware amp that would not drive my 14 ohm coincident victory's at all, even tho they were crossed over to subs at 80hz. that's cuz the amp had only 4 ohm taps, so it was effectively putting out only ~1.5watts into the victory's load. the decware amp wouldn't go loud, and it sounded like crap. my other low-power amps, did fine, even off 8 ohm taps. so yes, you need to match amp and speaker carefully, even more so when using low power amps and high-efficiency speakers.

regarding x-overs, i believe the low-power amp situation is where active x-overs beg to be used, so there are no issues of passive x-overs sucking power and/or dealing w/other possible phase/impedance issues... you can match a specific amp to a specific driver.

doug .

planet10 · « **Reply #32 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 05:01 pm »

Very good summary Josh. The importance of a benign impedance curve is often misunderstood

Quote from: Diamond Dog on 9 Apr 2012, 06:06 pm

The graph may be pretty, but it has been clearly shown that it has NO correlation to sonics and is pretty much meaningless. One has to go back a step and see the data before it was collaped to get any idea.

Do note that the rise at the bottom in a noise + THD chart like this is the noise becoming a greater proportion of the signal as the signal level drops.

dave

planet10 · « **Reply #33 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 05:03 pm »

Quote from: JoshK on 10 Apr 2012, 09:22 pm

PP EL34 amps with triode strapped and heavy into ClassA 10-11w sound awesome. I have one.

Me too.

dave

planet10 · « **Reply #34 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 05:07 pm »

Quote from: Freo-1 on 10 Apr 2012, 10:43 pm

What about a DIY SET with something along the lines of a 211, 805, or 845 tubes?

Scary high voltages usually and difficult to build/not very common OPTs (ie $$$). Not to mention HEAVY. I have a transformer suitable for PP 805.... one has to take care lifting just it.

There is a 211 SE at the local hifi emporium that has been collecting dust for years it would be nice to be able to afford.

dave

sebrof · « **Reply #35 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 07:41 pm »

In general terms, sensitive speakers with benign impedance, depending on the amp 8 ohms usually works best.
I have had KHorns with a 3-watt DIY 2A3 amp and it worked well (although I think in the end my room was too small for KHorns).
I have had the same 2A3 amp on Zu Omen, Tekton Katz Meow and Tekton Lore speakers. All sounded pretty good.
Currently running the Lores with an 18-watt PPP EL84 Manley Stingray and I think it's the best of all combinations I've been able to assemble.

So many ways to make good music, big watts, small watts and everything in between,
but I have found that in a small room (mine is 12' x 13' x 9') lower power/higher sensitivity works best.

ZENTISH · « **Reply #36 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 08:03 pm »

Hi, If you get a chance go and listen to Sonist speakers, they are designed to work well with low wattage amps. There are models ranging from 1700.00 to around 6000.00. I own a pair of the Concerto 2's which are stand mount and they work VERY well with my 5 watt amps.

Tish

planet10 · « **Reply #37 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 09:24 pm »

Quote from: sebrof on 11 Apr 2012, 07:41 pm

8 ohms

8 ohms is not the loudspeakers impedance ... it is the nominal impedance,and tells you VERY little.

dave

DavidS · « **Reply #38 on:** 11 Apr 2012, 11:54 pm »

I have spied that same 211 - think it is a Topaz?

My Decware 84zs is just barely enough power for my new Fruglehorns in a small room - now the 211 would be an interesting match with the FHorns - hmmm may have to do a weekend borrow although probably debate-able what would weigh more the amp or bags of silver to purchase the amp.

JoshK · « **Reply #39 on:** 12 Apr 2012, 12:01 am »

Speaking of 211...I just ordered a pair of 211 mono block (mentioned earlier) from Germany. Tax return was not expected, plus a friend paid back a loan, so I decided to splurge. I have followed Thomas's work for years and I really like how he builds things...and I don't seem to find the time anymore.