The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!

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Wayner

The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« on: 26 Jan 2008, 01:00 am »
As noted in an earlier post, I have been experimenting with the effects of static electricity. I have made a crude proto-type (reallllllly crude) and I am evaluating it. I don't have time to post photos now (I will tomorrow) but I think the results of my first experiment are interesting as the "wife" has made comments. The Earth stands still when she says something, believe me!!. The attempt is to use static electricity to make the stylus ride the grooves in a more controlled fashion, resulting in better detail via tracking. I hate to lead people on but......oh well.

Wayner aa

Jazz-Vinyl

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #1 on: 26 Jan 2008, 02:08 am »
Oh man!  We got plenty of static electricity in Colorado Springs! 
Anxious to see what ya have! 

And know about the "wife commented" deal...same happens here!!!




Wayner

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #2 on: 26 Jan 2008, 01:48 pm »
As you may know, the power of static electricity can simply overcome mass. An example of this is the Styrofoam peanut that clings to everything. I have been sampling different materials and have found a piece of EPDM closed cell gasket material that likes to stick to the record, even held upside down. There maybe many materials that will hold static charge, like Styrofoam.

My theory is that this charge can be used (insted of cursed) in a positive way, helping the cartridge track better, keeping the stylus in the grooves. I cut a small rectangular shape about 1/2" wide and 3/8" high out of this gasket material. I then used double faced tape and taped it to the back end of the cartridge with about 3/32" below the edge of the lower back edge. It looks flush in the photo, but it's not. This was done Wednesday night. After 3 sides of LP's the wife says "what did you do?". I showed her the new tweak. In my mind, the bass had been tightened up, say more in control. The high freqs were unaffected but the weird thing was that I heard more reverberation in the recording. She agreed.

Thursday night, I lowered the Mud Flap so that it was just above the record surface, never touching. After one song I thought what the hell, There is no life at all. The cartridge sounded like a Shure, dull lifeless no dynamics. Too much of a good thing. So I returned it to its original position and listened to music until late.

I'm sure the static attraction is adding some VTF to the situation but that is impossible to measure, or at least I don't know how to measure it. What I really think is going on is that the Mud Flap is positioning the stylus over the groove, stopping sideward sway of the tonearm. It may also be affecting anti-skate but can't see anything bad and the stereo image is well centered. Tracking is dreamy.

I will spend the rest of the day listening to old favorites to see if they sound different or not.



Wayner

TheChairGuy

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #3 on: 26 Jan 2008, 03:03 pm »
Cool experiment, Wayner!  De-staticising the process is likely to lead to good payoff for better vinyl reproduction.  Better tracking isn't paramount, but it's very important to getting it all right  :thumb:

Quote from: Wayner
The cartridge sounded like a Shure, dull lifeless no dynamics.
ha - this was my sentiments on the two Shures I had, too (including the much vaunted V15VxMR that, now discontinued by Shure, that sells for up to $400 in the aftermarket $200 more than I paid J&R Music in 2000 for it). The earlier M95HE I had was actually better, but not great.

John

ohenry

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #4 on: 26 Jan 2008, 03:38 pm »
Man... your version is not at all what I envisioned...


Wayner

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #5 on: 26 Jan 2008, 06:45 pm »
Yea, maybe it looks stupid but the design must start with a very rudimentary theory which I think it does, and at least so far, so good. It is doing somethings 'cause I can hear it. It's more of an experiment than a proto-type. Up here in the tundra, we get cabin fever about this time of year and have to start going into the abyss with the usual dark thoughts caused by the lack of sunlight and the dread of 5 months of winter. Thank God for TT's.

ohenry

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #6 on: 26 Jan 2008, 06:59 pm »
Yea, maybe it looks stupid but the design must start with a very rudimentary theory which I think it does, and at least so far, so good. It is doing somethings 'cause I can hear it. It's more of an experiment than a proto-type. Up here in the tundra, we get cabin fever about this time of year and have to start going into the abyss with the usual dark thoughts caused by the lack of sunlight and the dread of 5 months of winter. Thank God for TT's.


No, I was just making light of my hope for the mud flap silhouette that we often see on trucks around here.  Actually, I thought the gasket material would be cumbersomely mounted under the cart, parallel to the record.  Your idea looks pretty good to me.

Russell Dawkins

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #7 on: 26 Jan 2008, 07:14 pm »
My guess is that this is the outcome of either damping the cartridge body or the extra tracking force, either through the actual mass of the piece of material you are attaching, or static attraction.

Why would you think extra attraction to the groove would sound better achieved through static attraction than through simple gravity, Wayner? It would seem to come down to the amount of force with which the stylus is pressed into the groove.

Do you remember the brushes that used to come attached to the front of Stantons and higher end Shures? Most people took them off, but I thought they had a legitimate function as vertical bounce dampers, if not as dust gatherers.

Wayner

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #8 on: 26 Jan 2008, 07:55 pm »
I think this has more effect on tonearm sway rather then acting like more pressure on the stylus. As the static charges on the record attract to the static charges on the mud flap, there is a resistance to sidesway of the tone arm. I think that this helps take the tonearm and its reciprocating pulsations in the horizontal plane into a null movement. This allows the stylus to generate it's energy without the backlash from the arm which also cancels out some of the movement. In otherwords, I think the tonearm and stylus vibrate out of synchronization because its reactive, this helps to stop it. With a low mass tonearm, the effect is more noticeable. My big massive Empire tonearm just sits there. There is no way a cart is going to push this big boy around...and the Empire displays a great big soundstage that until now, the Technics couldn't. That is why it is apparently critical how close the mud flap is to the record surface. I want enough static cling to keep the arm from jigglin' without putting excessive force on the cantilever, like when I moved the flap real close to the record surface. I really don't want to increase VTF, I just want control.

W

Listens2tubes

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #9 on: 27 Jan 2008, 03:10 pm »
Very interesting stuff here Wayner. Do you think the EPDM flap is sucking up static from the vinyl as it passes/pulls over it? In regard to measuring the pull, I use n Audiotex Stylus Gauge which hooks under the front edge of the headshell measuring the downforce of the cart.

Wayner

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #10 on: 27 Jan 2008, 08:35 pm »
I think it's like opposite pole magnets attracting to each other. The trick is to get the attraction at just the right amount (allowing the stylus to do it's thing) without having it go into total squish. I had the flap closer at one time, only to quickly realize this was taking all the life out of the cart. Kind of like having your head in the vise.

Wayner

Folsom

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #11 on: 29 Jan 2008, 01:50 am »
How do you know that it is building static electricity? Are you sure it is not just similar to adding a "Long horn" modification?

Wayner

Re: The "MUD FLAP" is coming!!!!!
« Reply #12 on: 29 Jan 2008, 11:52 pm »
My little piece of gasket material really likes to stick to the record.

Wayner