[Derockster]

Hi guys' I'm using a technics sp 25 turntable with an sme series 3 tonearm(fitted with a shure v15 type v cartridge) into an Ear 834 phono stage.I like the bass and the fullness of the shure but I'm not very happy with the midrange especially on vocals.I'm thinking of trying a ZYX RS 20h medium output mc cartridge.My only bother is I've never heard an MC cart before and all the comments I"ve hear on them have been negative.The remainder of my system consist of an Almarro A205A mk11 and a pair of Jericho Horns.Opinions please to go or not to go for the MC cart.Regard Derockster

[woodsyi]

Does your phonostage have MC stepup or not?

[TheChairGuy]

My only bother is I've never heard an MC cart before and all the comments I"ve hear on them have been negative.Regard Derockster

I think the preferred sentiment among committed vinylheads is that MC's are preferred, overall.  Keep reading and I think you'll find that so.

Nonetheless, I haven't found one that isn't a bit tizzy, shrill and less-than-natural sounding....but getting over that $1000.00 (as the ZYX sells for) retail mark may be the key to getting a real stunner of an MC.

[lcrim]

The fact that the mass that must react to the movement of the cantilever is less w/ moving coils, actually low output moving coils with few turns of wire in the coil hence the lower mass offers inherent advantages. The quicker reaction and also lowered resistance to the flow of current by the reduced length of wire involved is another inherent advantage in low output moving coils.  The lowered output does require more gain in the signal chain to work properly.  Of course,implementation is everything but the design does offer design advantages over moving magnet cartridges.
John's comments about the tizzy nature of sub $1000 moving coil cartridges is of course opinion.  Very high quality reproduction can be had for less than that figure.

[Derockster]

Thanks guys seem I'm going MC.Hey Woodsyi my phono stage has provision for MC carts.Warm Regards from sunny Barbados aa

[denjo]

I am using Denon's 103R, a very low gain MC cart. Its very good for the price but finding a phono stage to synergise with the low gain was a bit tricky. Finally settled for Lehmann's Black cube. So far so good!

[Derockster]

Sorry Woodsyi I misread your question.No my phono stage does not have stepup.I'm thinking the medium output cart will have sufficient output.If that fails I'll simply buy a stepup.Regards

[Bemopti123]

This is my opinion, but purchasing a medium sensitivity MC perhaps will not get you the sonic gains that you are looking for.  Personally, I would purchase the best, low sensitivity MC cart and then, also get a step up or a phono pre that can handle it. 

I have heard a few cartridges, the higher output ones did not have the pace or lightfootness of the lower output ones.

Of course, all of this is relative, as what I interpret as decent or pacy might not suit your taste.

In any case, prepare to spend some money.

[woodsyi]

Actually Rockster,

I think all of them come with MC step up transformer inside.  I thought that was an option but I think it's the volume control that is optional.  So you should have MC input and MM input in the back.  You should be good with Low Output MC.  I don't see why anyone would choose high or medium output MC if you have phonostage that will do LOMC except that you have a low mass tone arm.  Most LOMCs have low compliance.      I think I read somewhere that the Denons can be modified to have high compliance somewhere.  ZYX RS 20H has compliance figure of 15x10-6 cm/dyne horizontal, 12x10-6 cm/dyne vertical, which is medium.  You may have to increase the effective mass of your tone arm to make it work. 

[Wayner]

The one thing that stops me from getting into MC is the tracking force most MC's require. Some are up to 2 grams, some are at 2.8 grams! You might as well use a nail.

Wayner 

[hurdy_gurdyman]

The one thing that stops me from getting into MC is the tracking force most MC's require. Some are up to 2 grams, some are at 2.8 grams! You might as well use a nail.

Wayner 

2 grams is certainly not excessive. I've tracked this high with some MM carts with no problems.

Dave aa

[TheChairGuy]

2.5 grams with a conical/spherical Denon 103 IS excessive....but, most/many MC's have hyper-elliptical styli where 2 grams isn't critical to damaging your grooves. 

[lcrim]

I also have mixed feelings about the higher VTF associated with many LOMC carts because of the low compliance.  The tendency to go towards the lower end of the suggested range is also to invite mis-tracking which would cause even more groove damage.  Also, the low compliance carts can feed back their resonances into the arm and the arm must either be of sufficient mass to damp this or have a damping system installed such as the KAB damping trough I have on my Technics.

[Psychicanimal]

My take on this matter is to stay away from a low output MC unless you have an adequate high gain phono stage.  Unless one lucks out, it takes some serious $$$ to get a really good one.

I can guarantee this: you will get more out of a medium to high output cartridge if your tonearm has on-the-fly VTA adjustment and using a digital stylus force gauge than the other way around.  That's what I've done, using a KAB modded 1200 with a Monolithic Sound PS-1 phono stage w/ dual mono outboard power supply.  I use some classic moving magnet & moving coils...Ortofon X-5 MC (original version, 0.40 mg eff. stylus mass), Audio Technica AT25 toroidal core MM, KAB modded Stanton Trackmaster I (w/ NOS Stereohedron II stylus).

***

[royphil345]

I believe a spherical stylus is easier on records at higher tracking forces than an elliptical. I've heard you can track twice as heavy with a spherical stylus without increasing record wear. That's why many DJ cartridges are spherical and probably why they did away with the Denon 103 elliptical. An elliptical stylus is shaped much like a spherical, except that it's thinner front to back. It has a smaller contact patch in the groove for more focused sound, traces tiny high frequency modulations better. Tracking force is spread over less area and it "digs" into tight places a conical kind of glides over, increasing record wear at higher tracking forces. A line-contact or one of the fancier shaped styli has a similar front to back size as an elliptical (or smaller), but fits the groove better vertically to improve tracking and spread the tracking force over more area. A Denon 103 shouldn't be any harder on records than an elliptical that tracks at 1.25 grams.

[jimdgoulding]

Back in the day, I was using a MM Signet cartridge in a compatible mid mass arm.  Got a hold of a Denon 103D to audition.  Don't remember what I was stepping it up with.  By the end of the first track of some up tempo jazz I was listening to, I was pretty excited.  After repeating the comparison, I was pretty sold!   Much faster, cleaner transients, and better separation.

Thanks, Roy.  I've been wondering why Denon hasn't re-released the 103D.

[royphil345]

Don't thank me... I was dead wrong. The DL-103D tracked at 1.5 grams. Was a little higher compliance too.  Oh well... 

I guess Denon's just holding out on us to be mean then... LOL  Now I want one!!! Maybe they just liked the 103R better. Sure I'm wrong about that too... I just can't stop speculating sometimes.