[Sonny]

Hi there, I am curious to hear what the thougths are on this aspect of listening position...
I see from photos on the circle that it seem lots of audiophiles are not into "near field" listening, meaning that the listening position is 9ft and greater from the speakers...I understand that some of you have large listening rooms, however, do you think that "far" field, for lack of a better word, listening is better off than near field?  My room is approximately 56ft long, but I live in a loft so, after my couch is the dinning room then kitchen...etc...  However, my speakers are only 8ft apart and I like to site about 8 ft from both speakers, making it a perfect (equal distance) triangle...  I find that for my set up, this is more intimate and imaging, staging and everything else seems to be best...

So, basically, what are your listening positions Near or Far, and why you like it or not like the other....

Thanks....

[JLM]

When on the computer I sit about 12 feet back, but "the" chair is nearfield ala Cardias.  So chair/speakers form an equalateral triangle with 68 inch long sides.  The room is 13 ft x 21 ft x 8 ft and the speakers are 46 inches from side walls and 68 inches from the front wall.  I quickly learned to really like nearfield.  Imaging is marvelous, the best way to describe it is half way between farfield and headphones.  8 and 10 year olds get wide eyed when they try it, like they "get" the whole stereo thing.  The second big advantage is that it reduces/eliminates many of the room effects (imaging size, bass boom, and side wall first reflections.  Of course less power is needed since you're sitting closer.  Obviously this setup can only be enjoyed by one person at a time and recordings do tend to sound quite "forward" (but the best recordings soundstage deeper behind the speakers anyway).

The primary equipment consideration is finding highly coherent speakers.  Any tendency for the sound to discernably jump from driver to driver as the frequency changes will be heard very easily.  That's another place where my single driver speakers have a big advantage.    aa

[WEEZ]

As JLM suggested...it depends on the speaker.

My speakers are 7' apart; and my optimum listening distance is just under 10'. (2-way stand mounts with 12db slopes)

WEEZ

[TheChairGuy]

I have found the 60% rule to work best speaker positioning (I forget who I plucked this from...it may have been PS Audio originally).

That is, my speakers are placed 60% of the distance of how far I am sitting from them - not canted inward.

So, when I am critically listening....I am about 8 feet from my speakers and my speakers are about 5 feet apart from one another.  I have tried a few other positions both wider and narrower positioning of the speakers, but seem to settle in right in that 60% range over and over again.  Planar and Dynamic speakers both have best fallen in that 60% range.

Like tvad4 and others - I sit relatively nearfield due to the length of my room (15 foot total...but speakers are 3 feet from the walls and I have filing cabinets taking up about 3 feet in back of me)

Food for thought, Sonny 

[Big Red Machine]

I am nearfield using a 7' equilateral triangle as my setup.  I would love to be farther away, or to have that option, but my room is intimate and it really is quite fun.

[WGH]

Mine are 7' apart & 10'-6" to the couch. Speakers are Von Schweikert VR2's in a 12' x 15' room with a 9' high ceiling. The front of the VR2's are 45" from the rear wall and about 24" from the side walls to the center of the drivers.

I use a Stereophile test CD with a mono pink noise signal to adjust toe-in. Start with the speakers facing straight ahead, listen, then toe-in a little, repeat as necessary just until you get a nice center hiss. Fine tune as needed.

I found a speaker placement article the other day, haven't had time to really check it out yet: http://www.soundstage.com/audiohell/audiohell200111.htm

Wayne

[rabpaul]

I have always understood nearfield listening to mean that the distance between speakers is always greater than the distance from the listener to either speaker.
See this Audio Physics method in this link:
http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos/speakerplacement.html
Am I wrong?

TGC,
Read somewhere many years ago that the distance between speakers has to be between 6-12ft for proper stereo integration. Notice you have this at 5ft.  I am now wondering if this 6ft minimum thing is not really true.

Placement always depends on the speakers, so in the absense of any guidelines from the manufacturer as to placement I guess you can use or adapt a method thats best for you and your room.

[Russell Dawkins]

I have always understood nearfield listening to mean that the distance between speakers is always greater than the distance from the listener to either speaker.
See this Audio Physics method in this link:
http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos/speakerplacement.html
Am I wrong?

TGC,
Read somewhere many years ago that the distance between speakers has to be between 6-12ft for proper stereo integration. Notice you have this at 5ft.  I am now wondering if this 6ft minimum thing is not really true.

Placement always depends on the speakers, so in the absense of any guidelines from the manufacturer as to placement I guess you can use or adapt a method thats best for you and your room.

Link doesn't work for me.

I don't know where you got these two bits of information.

Nearfield, as far as I know is not strictly defined, but is taken to refer to a distance from a sound source where the listener is hearing more direct than reverberant (or "room") sound, which would be 3 to 5', as in when the speaker is sitting on the edge of a mixing console.
In the same context, mid field is taken to mean 6 - 10' or so and the speaker is sitting on a stand or on the floor and is usually bigger and with more loudness capability. An example of a speaker that would be considered for midfield duty would be the B&W 801. I am using a pair of SP Technology Timepieces as midfields at a distance of 5.5', sitting on tall subwoofers for stands.

The standard for two channel stereo while mixing or mastering is a 60º included angle between speakers, regardless of distances. This means 30º left and right of the frontal axis for each speaker. If you want to have any hope of hearing what the engineer intended, that would be a starting point. For a Blumlein recording, this increases to 45º L & R of the frontal axis or a 90º included angle. Any decent speaker should be aimed inwards, I think, and if you want to achieve a sweet spot for more than 1, then they need to be aimed to cross just in front of the listening area!! This is unpopular, but I stand by it. Most speakers have a seriously compromised frequency response by 30º off axis.

As to your last point about distances for proper stereo integration, the only relevant distance is that from you to the speaker as different speaker "gel" at different distances. A speaker designed as a nearfield monitor has to "gel" close. Usually the larger or more complex the speaker, the farther away you need to be, whereas single driver speakers work very close.

[rabpaul]

Thanks Russell for clarifying. Learnt something new from you today.
My friend has a single driver in a horn enclosure. He sits close and thus calls it nearfield listening.
Try this link http://www.immediasound.com/Speakersetup.html

[Ethan Winer]

Nearfield ... where the listener is hearing more direct than reverberant (or "room") sound

Yes, this is the key. As a professional recording engineer I greatly prefer near field, even in a large room where "near" can be pretty far away. Otherwise, the room you listen in adds its own unique coloration to everything you play. And when that happens you have no chance to hear what the original mixing engineers intended.

--Ethan

[woodsyi]

Nearfield ... where the listener is hearing more direct than reverberant (or "room") sound

Yes, this is the key. As a professional recording engineer I greatly prefer near field, even in a large room where "near" can be pretty far away. Otherwise, the room you listen in adds its own unique coloration to everything you play. And when that happens you have no chance to hear what the original mixing engineers intended.

--Ethan

So, are you saying buy a pair of headset and forget the room treatment? 

[John Casler]

Nearfield ... where the listener is hearing more direct than reverberant (or "room") sound

Yes, this is the key. As a professional recording engineer I greatly prefer near field, even in a large room where "near" can be pretty far away. Otherwise, the room you listen in adds its own unique coloration to everything you play. And when that happens you have no chance to hear what the original mixing engineers intended.

--Ethan

Ethan is right on the money.

I was toying with the idea of posting a thread on the VMPS forum titled "RM40s the most expensive headphones I have ever heard",  because I too listen very close, and find that anything in the farfeild is so distracting because of the "reduced detail" and room distortion.

But...others as has been mentioned many times develop a sonic preference which involves "using and tuning" their room for SONIC SATISFACTION.

One is only better than the other "if" it is the one you like.

[Occam]

So, are you saying buy a pair of headset and forget the room treatment? 

Why headphones when a pair of LS3/5a (in the very nearfield), for all their faults, which are many, can provide an imaging/soundstaging experience that is mo' betta than reality????

[Daygloworange]

Every description of nearfield monitoring I've ever read described the set-up as an equidistant triangle with the tweeters at ear level and aimed towards you which works out the 60 deg thing. I've always started out that way in my studio, then tweeked a bit, but more or less it would work out best in the equidistant triangle config.

I've always had 2 to 3 speaker setups in my studio. Usually 2 small nearfield 2 ways, and a larger pair of 3 ways. I like to flip back and forth between speakers to check for Eq, and spatial cues, as they all image and perform differently, particularly in low frequency definition.

Cheers

[fajimr]

fyi... a similar thread based on a question I asked

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=31627.0

i've actually recently pulled my listening chair back a few feet to experience more of a farfield sound.  it is fuller... i'll have to go back to nearfield to see how much of the detail I am missing...

enjoy
jim

[Sonny]

Yes, I started this post just to get a feel of what all y'all are doing out there...
since I live in a loft with dimensions of 57'x18-30'x14' (length x width x height) and having sheet rock for walls, concrete floors and ceilings, you can imagine the reflection I have... I have placed some absorbers on the ceiling above the listening area as well as bass traps and other absorptions on the back and side walls, but still reflections...you just have to live with it, but sitting nearfield, you can great reduce the room modes...and I agree...

thanks for all the comments and experiences....

[Russell Dawkins]

So, are you saying buy a pair of headset and forget the room treatment? 

Why headphones when a pair of LS3/5a (in the very nearfield), for all their faults, which are many, can provide an imaging/soundstaging experience that is mo' betta than reality????

way mo' betta! I designed and built a pair of speakers that were intended to capitalize on this, plus be spouse-friendly. They worked exactly as intended.
They were slim floorstanding transmission lines with KEF B110 / T27 drivers and the standard KEF crossover (I know, but this was back in 1980!). Vertical listening axis was designed to be sitting ear height. The intention was for them to be slim enough to be placed anywhere - even the smallest space between chairs - so they could be positioned on either side of the arms of one chair and turned towards the occupant of that chair.

The pleasant result? Satisfying levels and wonderful imaging for the listener with very low levels throughout adjacent rooms - all the advantages of headphones and more.

For background listening they would be turned to face the room.