[PaulFolbrecht]

Hello,

By way of introduction, I've been searching for the ideal SET amp for my Ref 3s for a couple months.  Art Audio Carissa came close, but at 15W/ch, didn't quite have the power for the higher listening levels I occasionally like. 

Had read of the little clari-t for ages but I have just found out about the Sig 30 and, well, I'm certainly very impressed with what the SET folks here have had to say as well as Srajan at 6Moons.  He's going to cover the amp with the Gallos, I'm sure, but the full review isn't out yet.

So, honest question for Vinnie or end users - would the Sig 30 drive 88dB/W speakers to 90dB listening levels?  On paper, it seems to work, with about 8W continuous being called for, but there's always the nebulous question of how much headroom is needed. 

The Gallos are SET-friendly speakers with benign impedance and phase curves, tho actually I don't think that matters at all with a t-amp...?

Anyway, if this is advisable, or better yet if somebody is doing it or real similar, I'd love to take the plunge.  But if not I will look elsewhere or perhaps wait for the higher power/monoblock versions that sure must be in the works...?

Cheers,
Paul

[pacifico]

Just curious...how do the gallos work with your cayin amp? 6 moons gave lots of love to this amp and is it really as good as they say? I am in a similar boat and am weighing my options (sig 30 vs. cayin). Looking for a good sounding integrated with something speacial. these units both seem to qualify.

[PaulFolbrecht]

Ok, I'll answer your question but then let's get my thread back on-topic, K? :-}

I loved the Cayin with the Gallos.  It's 22W in triode mode drove them extremely well.  I never tried it past what i usually listen at, though, around 85dB.  It's now at my girlfriend's place so I can't do it now.

But, for sure, if you do want to go past 90dB listening levels, switching to UL mode would do it, and maybe would not be necessary.

(Based on this, I might conclude that the Sig's 30W is plenty, but we all know that due to their very different overdrive behaviors, tube power <> SS power.  So, I think it's questionable, right on the line.  We'll see what Mr. Vinnie says.)

Paul

[Vinnie R.]

Hi Paul,

I actually had the opportunity to listen to the Signature 30 powering the Gallo Ref 3s (at a customer's home in Boston).  It drove them very well and will have no trouble driving them to *clean* 90dB listening levels. 

Srajan is planning on finishing and posting the full Sig 30 review this weekend and he will be trying the Sig 30 with his Gallos.  If he hears what I heard when driving the Sig 30 into the Gallos, I think he is going to like  the combo... like it a lot! 

Thanks for your post,

Vinnie

[PaulFolbrecht]

Thanks, Vinnie.

To all: I've taken the plunge.  Unit on order.

[PaulFolbrecht]

Vinnie,

Couple more quick questions, if you don't mind.  (Even tho the amp is ordered - for curiosity's sake.)

1) I realize power isn't speced into 4 ohms but you must have an idea what it does.  The reason I ask is that the Gallos do dip to 4.  Most analog switching amps do seem to be able to develop 50% more power or so into lower (4) impedance - are we in this camp?  Or something entirely different? 

2) Along those lines, at 30W RMS, do you happen to have an instantaneous (clipping) power figure? 

3) Ok, Ok, this is premature, I know, but any chance monoblocks might be offered at some unspecified point in the future?

Sorry if these have been asked already.  I read just about all the threads in the archive on the amp.  Thanks.

[GHM]

Paul here are the ratings on the TK2051 chip from Tripath's site. There are no ratings for 4 ohms just 6 and 8 ohms. Looking at the distortion ratings . I'm not sure you would want to run this chip harder than 30 watts at 8 ohms.

0.01% THD+N @ 30W 8Ω
0.05% IHF-IM @ 30W 8Ω
High Power:
60W @ 8Ω, 10.0% THD+N
46W @ 6Ω, 10.0% THD+N

[Vinnie R.]

Vinnie,

Couple more quick questions, if you don't mind.  (Even tho the amp is ordered - for curiosity's sake.)

1) I realize power isn't speced into 4 ohms but you must have an idea what it does.  The reason I ask is that the Gallos do dip to 4.  Most analog switching amps do seem to be able to develop 50% more power or so into lower (4) impedance - are we in this camp?  Or something entirely different? 

2) Along those lines, at 30W RMS, do you happen to have an instantaneous (clipping) power figure? 

3) Ok, Ok, this is premature, I know, but any chance monoblocks might be offered at some unspecified point in the future?

Sorry if these have been asked already.  I read just about all the threads in the archive on the amp.  Thanks.

Hi Paul,

1) I wouldn't expect much increase in power beyond 30 watts when using a 4-ohm load.

2) The best way to see the the power rating is by looking at the distortion graph of the TK2050 datasheet on page 9:
http://www.tripath.com/downloads/TK2050.pdf

You'll find that this chipset is sometimes referred to as a 50w chipset, but that is at higher distortion.  It is 30 Watts RMS into 8-ohms at approx. 0.04% THD+N

3) This is very possible down the road .  If I were to run the TK2051 chipset in paralled operation, it can achieve power output in the 70 to 80 watt range (RMS) into a 4-ohm load.  This is a result of the increased max output current. 

Best regards,

Vinnie

[PaulFolbrecht]

Thanks again.  *More* than 30W into 4ohms is not what I was after - at least it appears that the chipset doesn't fall apart into such a load and that is what I was curious about.

So, it does sound like the Tripath is indeed a full-on digital amp, meaning digital modulation.  Interesting.  Of course you are aware that all of the other major players in the switching amp game seem to tout their products as being *analog* modulated switching amps.  I thus find it somewhat curious that your new amp has garnered by far the most praise in the way of being not just in the "analog" camp but right alongside the holiest grail of direct-heated single-ended triodes.  Quite as far as anything the slightest bit "digital" might suggest. 

Ironic?

[Vinnie R.]

So, it does sound like the Tripath is indeed a full-on digital amp, meaning digital modulation.  Interesting.  Of course you are aware that all of the other major players in the switching amp game seem to tout their products as being *analog* modulated switching amps.  I thus find it somewhat curious that your new amp has garnered by far the most praise in the way of being not just in the "analog" camp but right alongside the holiest grail of direct-heated single-ended triodes.  Quite as far as anything the slightest bit "digital" might suggest. 

Ironic?

Hi Paul,

The Tripath modulation is what I would consider to be "switching."  According to one of the Tripath  white papers:

Tripath Class-T technology uses both analog circuitry and Tripath’s Digital Power
Processing algorithms that modulate the input signal with a high-frequency switching
pattern. Tripath’s proprietary algorithms are derivatives of adaptive and predictive
algorithms used in telecommunications processors. The modulated signal is sent to output
transistors then through a low-pass filter (external to the Tripath amplifier) that demodulates
it to recover an amplified version of the audio input.
In a Tripath amplifier there is an input stage that provides analog input signal buffering. The
output of this stage drives the Digital Power ProcessingTM block. This block contains an
adaptive signal conditioning processor, a digital conversion function, mute control, overload
handling, fault detection, predictive processing and qualification logic functions. The output
of the DPPTM block controls a power output stage that drives a speaker through an output
filter.

Of course implementation is key, as well as "voicing" the sound with all the external components (external to the chip), power supply, etc.   

The lower powered, surface-mount Tripath chips (especially the 2024 and 2051) seem to have that "special something" to their sound that has kept me hooked 

Cheers!

Vinnie