Preaching to the converted....

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Jim N.

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Preaching to the converted....
« on: 17 Nov 2005, 03:45 am »
Well, my Stratos Stereo Extreme survived its journey from Indy. UPS managed to avoid running over it with a forklift, knocking it off a multi-story conveyer belt or having it fall out of an open cargo bay over Nevada. Way to go, Teamsters! I hope they find Jimmy one of these days!

First impression: Klaus should include a truss with them. Damn, that sucker is bigger than I thought it would be! It is truly built like a tank and has the unmistakable feel of quality.

Second impression: Even in basic black it is an elegant piece of equipment. The blue Odyssey logo is pure class.

Third impression: It sounds great out of the box. Klaus said “if you think it sounds great now, wait a few months!” I can’t even imagine how it can sound better.

Fourth Impression: Karn Evil 9. Wait, wrong ELP CD ;-) . It’s the first one that is playing, a new 24 bit remaster from Japan. Carl Palmer’s drum solo on “Tank” sounded gigantic. Cymbals and double bass drums were incredible. “Lucky Man” was a revelation and the bass analog synth notes at the end were so phat!

Fifth Impression: Stratos and Loreleis are a match made in heaven. Well, Indianapolis anyway!

I am literally sitting here in stunned disbelief at the level of audio performance I have now. I always thought that it was beyond my means but thanks to Klaus it is a reality.

Amazing, simply amazing.

Still have some excessive bass but that is due to my listening area. I am taking Klaus’ advice and going plant shopping tomorrow. This is something that I NEVER thought I would do. Plants should be cheaper than bass traps and make me seem like a sensitive guy to boot! Woo hoo, SCORE! Gee, I should look in “The Absolute Sound” to see if there are any audiophile plants ;-). Hey, a new area for the snake oil charlatans to exploit! “Our custom bio-engineered battery charged plants open the soundstage, remove grain from the mid-range, tighten the bass and give solid state equipment a tube-like sound. Only $9,875.00 per plant plus shipping from Mexico via low flying Cessna to a remote spot in Arizona. Smoke first for best effect.”
 :P

Odyssey Loreleis / Odyssey Stratos Stero Extreme / Monolithic Audio PA-1 w/ HC-1B/  Rotel 1072 / Bel Canto DAC2 / Ultra bling bling Blue Jeans and Impact Acoustics cables / A couple of Ven Has, one Guerilla Audio and one cheapo Volex power cables/ Two Blue Circle B86 MKII Noisehunters (cuz my power sux and they help)/ one Labratory grade line conditioner / two authentic generic non-cryoed el cheapo Home Depot reject power outlets (thanks, slumlord)  / thousands of miles of cruddy power lines / San Onofre irradiated power

buckeyefanandy

$$$
« Reply #1 on: 17 Nov 2005, 01:09 pm »
Impact accoustics, what are your thoughts on these wires?  I have a ton of these in a bag.  My cousin works for them.
Never seen anyone else that listed them as part of the Odyssey system.

Enjoy!

Andy

hairofthedawg

Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #2 on: 17 Nov 2005, 06:35 pm »
The Nemesis blends pretty well with my Belcantos(SL) too.  That's partially the Odyssey amp that powers it, but it's a very nice little speaker in its own right.

cheers,

Dick

Jim N.

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Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #3 on: 18 Nov 2005, 03:03 am »
Andy.

The Impact Acoustics IC are decent. Appear to be well built and not bad looking. They are mentioned on Audioholics, which tries to stay away from snake oil. They are priced in the AR range and work fine in my system but then again I am not a believer in voodoo IC's. All I really look for in an IC are 1) quality materials, 2) quality assembly and 3) sensible prices.

I like the Blue Jeans Cables too, which are just Belden or Canare wire with Canare RCA jacks. They post the manufactorers specs and have a very informative website. I usually get my cables within 3 days via Priority Mail.

Jim N.

ScottMayo

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Re: Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #4 on: 18 Nov 2005, 05:18 am »
Quote from: Jim N.
Still have some excessive bass but that is due to my listening area. I am taking Klaus’ advice and going plant shopping tomorrow. This is something that I NEVER thought I would do. Plants should be cheaper than bass traps and make me seem like a sensitive guy to boot!...


Plants, if they are big, can do useful diffusion, but it takes BIG plants to do anything like bass trapping. (Think tree, not poinsetta.) It takes a sizable array of plants to absorb that kind of energy. With smaller plants, you might end up eating HF and keeping the LF - not what you want. Pick something with thick, heavy leaves and dense foilage if you want to give this a shot.

Jim N.

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Re: Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #5 on: 18 Nov 2005, 06:00 pm »
Quote from: ScottMayo
Plants, if they are big, can do useful diffusion, but it takes BIG plants to do anything like bass trapping. (Think tree, not poinsetta.) It takes a sizable array of plants to absorb that kind of energy. With smaller plants, you might end up eating HF and keeping the LF - not what you want. Pick something with thick, heavy leaves and dense foilage if you want to give this a shot.


Thanks for the advice, Scott. Your website has some very helpful information.  I had realized that given the force of LF it wound take some stout plants to have an impact. I picked up a couple of large, thick ones and it has helped a bit. Since I don't want to use a machette to get around the room or work on my Tarzan yell that's about all I can do in that area. I also need to let the gear break in to ensure that is not contributing. Next is covering some bare wall space with decorative hanging fabric followed by changing speaker / listening position (L shaped room with speakers / chair on opposite sides of the narrowest  section) which will be the difficult part. If I move the speakers  any further off the rear wall (now at 2 feet) in my current setup it will increase reflection off the wall directly behind my chair. Looks like I have some major furniture moving ahead of me to see if I can arrange it so speakers / chair can be on opposite ends of the longest part of the room.

Ah well, this is part of the hunt for great sound. I've got the gear now it's up to me to provide it with the proper environment! Also, I do appreciate you taking the time offer your advice. Thanks again!

Doublej

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Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #6 on: 18 Nov 2005, 11:36 pm »
buckeyefanandy,

The Impact Acoustics cables are toxic. Send them to me and I'll take care of them.  :wink:

Actually I've never heard them but if they work as well as the old Radio Shack Gold interconnects I have they will serve you quite well.

My Radio Shack Golds hold up quite well against Signal Cables which are supposed to compete against multi hundred dollar cables.

DeanSheen

Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #7 on: 19 Nov 2005, 12:03 am »
Quote
My Radio Shack Golds hold up quite well against Signal Cables which are supposed to compete against multi hundred dollar cables.


RS gold.  Thats some funny stuff.

bunky

Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #8 on: 19 Nov 2005, 12:38 am »
Quote from: DeanSheen
Quote
My Radio Shack Golds hold up quite well against Signal Cables which are supposed to compete against multi hundred dollar cables.


RS gold.  Thats some funny stuff.
Klaus sells several grades of Groneberg cables and they are all very good and he prices them way below thier suggested retail. the TS premiums are by far the best cables that i have ever heard. no snake oil here man!thanks....WCW III

ajzepp

Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #9 on: 19 Nov 2005, 09:00 pm »
Jim,

Aren't you the guy who had Maggies in-house and comparing them to the Lors?  Or was that John 151?

John151

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Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #10 on: 19 Nov 2005, 09:56 pm »
Quote from: ajzepp
Jim,

Aren't you the guy who had Maggies in-house and comparing them to the Lors?  Or was that John 151?


I have both, but I don't recall comparing them.

ajzepp

Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #11 on: 19 Nov 2005, 10:17 pm »
Quote from: John151
Quote from: ajzepp
Jim,

Aren't you the guy who had Maggies in-house and comparing them to the Lors?  Or was that John 151?


I have both, but I don't recall comparing them.


Maybe I am mistaken, then.....I thought for sure someone on here had both and was trying to decide which to keep.....that wasn't you?  

Even if it wasn't, can you comment on the comparison now? lol

John151

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Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #12 on: 19 Nov 2005, 10:56 pm »
Quote from: ajzepp
Quote from: John151
Quote from: ajzepp
Jim,

Aren't you the guy who had Maggies in-house and comparing them to the Lors?  Or was that John 151?


I have both, but I don't recall comparing them.


Maybe I am mistaken, then.....I thought for sure someone on here had both and was trying to decide which to keep.....that wasn't you?  

Even if it wasn't, can you comment on the comparison now? lol


Well, that may have been me.  

I actually haven't done a lot of critical listening, and I am not sure if the Lors are fully broken in. Also, I have not put much work into speaker position.   However, I will state my initial impressions.

First off, I think it is important to specify what change I was looking for.  The Maggies sounded great on accoustics and vocals, but were lacking punch (unless really cranked up), and just did not play most rock CDs very well.  Also, they really sounded best when cranked up - the more juice you give them, the better they sound. Another downside of the Maggies is that it seemed like some sounds were over stated, while others were understated.  The odd thing is that this was not accross the board - some CDs suffered from this, while others did not. I am not sure if the Maggies are just being accurate, or if this is a quirck.  The upside of the maggies is great imaging, and silky smooth highs.  I wanted to fix the short comings, while keeping the postivie attributes.  

Instantly it was clear that the Lors had the punch that I was missing, possibly even too much at times.  After breaking in for 20-40 hours, the imaging is very good, and the highs are outstanding.  They are not quite as 3-dimensional as the Maggies, but they are still very good in this regard.  I played the CDs that sounded great on the Maggies, and they sounded very good on the Lors as well.  Some sounded better, some not quite as good, but overall, I would call it a draw.  So, I feel that the Lors are achieving the goal of keeping the positives.  I then played several CDs that did not sund so hot on the Maggies, and the Lors did much better on these.  

My only issue with the Lors is boomy bass on some tracks.  This usually happens on simple tracks.  On really busy tracks, the bass is greatly reduced.  The woofer must get tied up making higher  freq sounds.  This could be solved by speaker position,  room config, or upgrading the amps (I am planning on upgrading the Stereo Stratos Extreme to Mono Extremes).  I also have not added the cones yet (I do, however, have little rubber feet glued to the bottom)  as the speakers are on a tile floor.

I should also point out that I suffer from listening fatigue, and I have not had any issues with the Lors (or the Maggies).  

I also watch a lot of HT, and with the use of a sub, the two speakers are very close to dead even.  I think the Maggies might have the advantage here as they excell at 3 dimensional imaging.  Note that I don't use a center channel, so I relly on the L/R speakers for handle the center channel.  Both do this quite well.  

Am I going to keep them?  Yes, if not for the sound, for the WAF.  The W really hates the Maggies, and I am tired of hearing about it (despite the fact that we agreed before the basement was finished that it would be my space to do with whatever I wanted).  

BTW - The Maggies are 2.5s (true Ribbons) with Oak sides, and off white cloth.  If anyone is interested in these (local pickup only), send me a PM.

Jim N.

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Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #13 on: 20 Nov 2005, 05:27 pm »
Quote from: ajzepp
Jim,

Aren't you the guy who had Maggies in-house and comparing them to the Lors?  Or was that John 151?


I've never owned Maggies. Had to be someone else.

Jim N.

John151

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Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #14 on: 24 Nov 2005, 06:57 pm »
I moved my speakers closer to the back wall, and the "boomy bass" issue went away, and the bass on busy tracks is now fine.

wisnerj

Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #15 on: 25 Nov 2005, 03:35 am »
John151,
I know I'll have some experimenting when my Loreleis arrive, but what is your distance from the rear wall? Can't wait to hear them from all the great reviews and, of course...Klaus!!!

John151

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Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #16 on: 28 Nov 2005, 06:30 pm »
Quote from: wisnerj
John151,
I know I'll have some experimenting when my Loreleis arrive, but what is your distance from the rear wall? Can't wait to hear them from all the great reviews and, of course...Klaus!!!


I first had them out about 3 feet or so (that is where my Maggies where).  I now have them around 1 foot from the wall. Also, note that the speakers are near the corners of the room.  In this room, there are traingular shaped closets in the corners, such that there are closet doors at a 45 degree angle to the back wall.  As a result, the back wall looks something like the following:

.... _______________________
....'...............................................'
../..X..........................................X..\
/..Y..............................................Y..\
|.......................................................|
|.......................................................|
|.......................................................|
|.......................................................|


In the above diagram, X marks the new location, and Y marks the old location.  Please realize that the above diagram is horribly inaccurate.  The conecpt is that moving them back, and in, improved the bass.  I really have not done any work on placement yet, and the reason I moved them was to get them out of the way for a party, but once I moved them, I thought I might as well take a listen, and I felt things had improved.

ajzepp

Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #17 on: 30 Nov 2005, 03:49 am »
That seems counterintuitive to me.....wouldn't the bass response typically be greater with closer proximity to a wall? I would think having them more out into the room would tame the boom more than moving them closer to a boundary......no?

John151

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Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #18 on: 30 Nov 2005, 04:11 am »
Quote from: ajzepp
That seems counterintuitive to me.....wouldn't the bass response typically be greater with closer proximity to a wall? I would think having them more out into the room would tame the boom more than moving them closer to a boundary......no?


I suspect that the closet doors may have been reacting to the bass coming out of the rear ports.

Jim N.

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Preaching to the converted....
« Reply #19 on: 1 Dec 2005, 06:02 am »
It could well be those closet doors, John151. I am still working things out with my oddly shaped room. I've broken down and ordered some Auralex bass traps and have been using foam or large pillows against some hard surfaces to cut down on reflected bass. I'm chipping away at the bass issue and think two corners are causing the most of the remaining bass accentuation (the Auralex are going up to the ceiling to see it the problem is partially megaphone effect). It's just a certain frequency that's causing the problem. Otherwise the bass is superb. I have the Lorelei's about 30 inches away from a picture window that has several 15x17x2 pieces of psuedo (and fire retardent) foam behind the drapes and below the sill. They were five bucks apiece at Michael's.

During the past week the Lorelei's and Stratos Extreme took a big leap forward. I had not listened closely for about a week (too much work!) but had them playing at a low level when I was not closely listening or away. I had a chance to sit down and listen to some high volume music and WOW!. The Stratos Extreme was pushing the 300 hour mark of continuous play and the Lorelei's were around 400 hours. I was listening to a lot of 70's prog that I had copied from my CD's to PC and ripped to a new CD using EAC: Pierre Moerlen's Gong, obscure kraut proggers SFF (Schicke, Fuhrs and Froehling) (sans umlauts here) and solo Chick Corea (Secret Agent, Mad Hatter, Leprechaun). It was like hearing them for the first time. What grabbed my attention was the sound of the various percussion instruments used by Gong (vibes, marimba, glokenspiel, etc) that rang, chimed and resonated so richly, smoothly and beautifully.

I had my doubts about break-in but Klaus was right about it. Regardless if it's the electronics, improved acoustics or my brain getting acclimated (or all three) it is a substantial improvement from out of the box. I just did not expect it to sound this good!

What Klaus / Odyssey / Symphonic are doing is simply amazing. I never could have afforded this level of audio performance otherwise.