[zenfishbike]

Hello everyone, 

I've taken deep dives in this awesome forum (and elsewhere) to learn all I can about OB systems in general and the NX-Otica (O), NX-Treme (T) & OB Subs in particular. I live in a remote location in SW Colorado and highly doubt I'll be able to hear any of these prior to purchase so please help me settle on the right choices. 

My dedicated home theater is 13x15.5x8 though 90% of the use is for 2 channel music. Genre's are rock, classic rock, new wave, reggae, a little country and a little jazz. My current active Linn system with dual REL Stadium III subs is very resolving but doesn't present natural vocals or provide punch from bass guitar or kick drums unless SPL's are very high or the subs are turned up too much. Speakers are along the 13' wall. The 5' entry to the room is adjacent to the left speaker and has sliding barn doors. Front baffle centers are 3' off the front wall (can go to 4') and 3.5' off the side walls. Ears are approximately 5' off the back wall. This configuration has the center of baffles 6.5' apart and 8.5' from my ears. 

Due to the relatively small size of the room I've been leaning towards the O's with double OB subs. Scale-wise these seem the best choice. Subs inboard of the speakers would fit the setup better though there would only be a couple feet separating them. Subs outboard of the speakers would put one nearly up against the right wall and leave a very narrow (18") entry pathway. If inboard, the height of triple subs would require raising the screen 6-8", a compromise but doable.

I found the sound comparisons from Ron's video very informative (https://youtu.be/i3SGjBL4Ffg). I found the bass and treble similar enough on both but the T's fleshed out the vocal midrange exquisitely and I can't let go of the difference. Danny said in the comments that "The NX-Oticas and NX-Tremes basically sound the same. They are really the same speaker in most ways. But in this case the NX-Otica had the base level crossover and the NX-Treme had crossover upgrades of Sonicaps in the mids high pass (big cap value), Copper foil inductors, and Miflex Copper by-pass caps on the tweeter circuit. Those crossover upgrades account for the difference that you are hearing. The higher end parts attribute to all of the differences that you noted."

So the questions I need to resolve are:
1. Can I expect the O's with upgraded x-over to give the exact same exquisite vocal midrange that I heard from the T's in the comparison video?
2. If so, then why even make the T? What do the extra 4 midrange drivers provide? I have to think they contribute as well, not only to vocals but to bass guitar and kick drum punch.
3. If I were to go with the T's would I be making a mistake in other ways given the size of my room? And if so, in what ways?
4. The comparison used triple subs. I'm still unclear if any OB system will provide the punch that I'm seeking from bass guitars and kick drums. I keep hearing they move air in a different way, back and forth instead of pressurizing. I want to feel it at loud but not concert level SPL's. Do they? And how important are the 4 extra mids and 2 extra 12's to get it? In other words would the O's and 2 dual OB subs suffice?

I'm willing to pack the T's with triple OB subs into this little theater if I have to in order to get what I seek; however the O's with double OB subs offer the best practicality and scale visually. Thanks in advance for sharing your knowledge and experience.

[mlundy57]

1. Can I expect the O's with upgraded x-over to give the exact same exquisite vocal midrange that I heard from the T's in the comparison video?

Yes, the O's and T's have the same midrange drivers. The two M165NQ drivers (with the copper phase plugs) are the midrange drivers.

2. If so, then why even make the T? What do the extra 4 midrange drivers provide? I have to think they contribute as well, not only to vocals but to bass guitar and kick drum punch.

The four or eight M165 drivers (either O or T) are basically bass drivers. This means the midrange between the O and T is the same but the T is going to out perform the O where bass guitars and kick drums are concerned.

3. If I were to go with the T's would I be making a mistake in other ways given the size of my room? And if so, in what ways?

As long as you have the ceiling height, the T's are 7-1/2 feet tall, and don't mind the size, the T's will give you more of what you want.

4. The comparison used triple subs. I'm still unclear if any OB system will provide the punch that I'm seeking from bass guitars and kick drums. I keep hearing they move air in a different way, back and forth instead of pressurizing. I want to feel it at loud but not concert level SPL's. Do they? And how important are the 4 extra mids and 2 extra 12's to get it? In other words would the O's and 2 dual OB subs suffice?

If you are going to have separate towers, I would go with the triples. My duals do a very good job but the triples are more effortless and have more presence. OB bass does load the room differently. It does not pressurize the room like sealed or ported subs do so while you don't get the heavy gut punch, the bass is clean and accurate while still being palpable. One thing you can do is have the OB subs up front and put your RELs in the back of the room if you want more punch. OB speakers can be placed very close to side walls because they have a null at 90 degrees horizontally.

All that said, if the O's fit your aesthetic tastes better, they will provide excellent performance for you. My room is small enough I have to use the NX-Otica MTM monitors on top of dual subs (a compromise on both ends) and still get performance that has been described as world class by people who would know.

In summary, I'd break it down like this:

If you want the maximum in performance and are willing to compromise on the aesthetics, go with the T's and triple subs

If the T's are too visually imposing, go with the O's and triple subs

If that is still to visually imposing, go with the O's and dual subs.

Mike

[Jaytor]

I have the NX-Oticas and triple subs in a room that is more than twice the size of yours. The bass from this system is the best I've every had (which includes a lot of reasonably high end speakers in the $10K to $20K range). In your smaller room, I would think that the double subs would be plenty, particularly for music.

I'm not using this system in my home theater, and it's possible that some low frequency sound effects that are common in action movies might be a bit of a challenge for the doubles (although I think they'd be fine). If it were me, I think raising the screen high enough to get over the triples would be too much of  a compromise. You could always augment the system with a small sealed sub for your LFE output.

I decided on the NX-Oticas because I thought the NX-Tremes would be visually overwhelming, even in my larger room. However, my ceiling height is a couple inches shy of 8', so the speakers would literally reach to the ceiling, particularly since the speakers are sitting on a rug and I'm using IsoAcoustics Gaia II footers which add a couple of inches. Even building the speakers would have been difficult for me since standing them up requires a few inches of extra clearance.

I think you would be more than satisfied with the NX-Oticas with the crossover upgrades. These speakers have a lot of gutsiness in the mid to upper bass and a beautiful midrange and top end.

[zenfishbike]

Thank you Mike and Jaytor for your thoughtful replies. Seems to me a version between the O and T would be quite interesting. One with 1 or 2 less bass drivers at the top of the T for those of us with 8' ceilings. I may reach out to Danny on that one...

[Captainhemo]

There is zero point of making  a speaker with  2 less   M165's.

Have " lived" with both these speakers and  various configurations of  OB h-frame (duals, triples, quads) since  since the first pairs were produced so know them  well.....

In that room,  I'd go with the NX-Otica/dual h-frames and with the money you save ,  go for the full copper cap  upgrade (might be  too costly to do the  mid highpass bundle but you  can still bypass the  Sonicaps with  a MiFlex copper) and  you will never   have an issue

You could go with the  triples but as mentioned above,  too much of a comprimise  with regards to your  screen.
In either case,  as Mike  stated, run the  current sealed subs in the back of the room   at  a low volume as Danny  used to do at  shows.

You  will be more than thrilled

jay

[Tyson]

NX-Ottica and dual OB subs is the way to go in your setup.

[zenfishbike]

There is zero point of making  a speaker with  2 less   M165's.

Thanks for your reply Jay. I'm curious about this one, why would adding 4 more bass drivers to the NX-Otica (to make the NX-Treme) make sense but not 2 or 3?  Wouldn't either of these be inching you closer to 4 in terms of the added sound quality that the 4 provide?

[Jaytor]

Getting the impedance and sensitivity to work with the mid-range and tweeter drivers would probably not be possible.

[zenfishbike]

For my room the concensus by those in the know seems to be NX-Otica's, upgraded x-overs, dual double OB subs, and my two REL's in the rear. Thanks to all who replied, this is exactly what I sought to learn. Now just need the drivers to be back in stock! I can start with the OB subs though...

[Captainhemo]

Thanks for your reply Jay. I'm curious about this one, why would adding 4 more bass drivers to the NX-Otica (to make the NX-Treme) make sense but not 2 or 3?  Wouldn't either of these be inching you closer to 4 in terms of the added sound quality that the 4 provide?

The differences would be  too subtle and I  know  Danny  likes to keep these at nice   , easy to drive load

jay