Comparison of Senn. HD650 and HiFiMan HE-500

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 8197 times.

hibuckhobby

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 641
  • On a search for audio nirvana
Comparison of Senn. HD650 and HiFiMan HE-500
« on: 5 Jul 2012, 11:22 pm »
Rather than try to write a long review of each phone (which has been done many times) I'm going to just write a few observations about the strengths and differences between the two.  As in all such instance, YMMV, IMHO etc. etc.

In terms of ease to drive, the HD650 is easier...although improvements in source and amplification do raise its' level of performance quite a bit.  It's not just about loudness, but clarity, impact and tonality.  I used four amps in this comparison...although most comments are restricted to just two of them.  The amps are a Headroom Supreme (about 1995 vintage), an ASL tube amp that has outputs both for transformer coupled and OTL.  It has a pair of EL-84's for the output and a vintage windmill-getter 5751 as the driver.  I also used my Pioneer SX-1250 and Marantz PM11-S1 integrated.

The 650's are a warmer, more romantic sounding phone.  There is a midbass/midrange bump followed by a gradual roll-off that gives them a lush, darker sound and the impression (not fully accurate) that the treble is lacking.   Actually, the lower treble is down a bit, but the high end is not.

The 500's are more neutral sounding, plus have the unique planar sound that you either love or you don't.  It goes deeper in the bass and has more apparent treble than the 650.  It is also harder to drive.  One example would be that the Headroom Supreme has enough power to get quite loud, but the tautness in the bass is not there like it is with the Marantz or Pioneer amps. 

Both sets of cans have a warmer sound with the ASL tube amp.  It lacks the grip in the bass that the solid state amps have, but the midrange is just lovely.  It brings the midrange forward a bit with the HE-500's.

The 650 is a more forgiving phone than the 500.  I listen to quite of bit of 60's/early 70's rock and a fair amount of that material is not recorded particularly well.  The 650 has a bit less emphasis on sibilants or harsh horns.

With that said, the impression of detail is more apparent on the 500's.  It is not detailed as in overly bright/analytical (although it can get close to that on the wrong material) it simply tells you more about what is going on in the recording.  On "Sinkin' Soon" by Norah Jones, there are a number of instruments both stringed and percussive that are in the background that I never noticed with the 650's.  To be fair, once I knew they were there...I could pick them out of the mix with the 650's as well...but it was with the 500's that I first heard them.

The soundstage width for both phones is, to me, similar...but the 650 has better depth.  You get a better sense of acoustic space with them.  The 500's on the other hand gives you a clearer sense of when the reverb is because of the space or is electronically induced.  They also help you pick out more individual voices in group recordings such as "Psalms" by the Turtle Creek Chorale.  The same songs on the 650 sound great, but are a bit more "of a piece" than a group of voices that you hear individuals in.

The bass is a bit more punchy on the 650's and the cans do sound a bit more dynamic.  OTOH, I love the tonality of the 500's and the ability to hear the organ well as it descends the scale in Symphony #3 for Orchestra and Organ by Saint Saens.

At the end of the day, it's hard to say which one is "best".  The 500 is more accurate and extended. The 650 is a bit more "fun" and forgiving.  The 500 is much heavier and the pads are firmer making the 650's more comfortable (to me).   I can wear either for hours, although I confess to doing a lot of my listening in a recliner.

So there you are.  The 500's are one of the new darlings and the 650 is a seasoned veteran. Both have their fan boys and their detractors for a reason.  I'm just happy I am fortunate to have both.

Hibuck....

dB Cooper

Re: Comparison of Senn. HD650 and HiFiMan HE-500
« Reply #1 on: 6 Jul 2012, 02:12 am »
Thanks for the comments, as I have been considering HD600s, HE500s, and HE400s. Right now the HD600 is the likely choice. I had a pair of 580s way back when and liked them a lot; don't even remember why I sold them. I'm pretty confident Sennheiser will be around in 10 years; who knows about Hifiman.

I am not clear on the differences between the 600 and 650 though. Maybe someone who has listened to both could comment?

saisunil

Re: Comparison of Senn. HD650 and HiFiMan HE-500
« Reply #2 on: 6 Jul 2012, 02:26 am »
Nice review Hibuck ...

Just to add to that - my experience is that Senn 650 is almost a decade old phone and 500 came out recently ... for me, 500 is clearly a few notches up and is a silly bargain at current reduced price ...

Senn 650/600 on the other hand is a known sound ... more people have heard these phones than perhaps any other phone ... ever ...

That said - there is no headphone that suits all - so it is good to have choices ...

Cheers
Sunil.

Noseyears

  • Restricted
  • Posts: 940
  • SS-Audio
    • Supreme Sound Audio
Re: Comparison of Senn. HD650 and HiFiMan HE-500
« Reply #3 on: 6 Jul 2012, 02:35 am »

I am not clear on the differences between the 600 and 650 though. Maybe someone who has listened to both could comment?

From my point of view, the 650's are more refined and have better bass response than the HD600. The 650's are more picky with amplification..they sound darker with the wrong gear, but they scale nicely if you find a good match.
The 600 on the other hand, are more forgiving with weak sources, has more treble with upper mids presence.

Thanks hibuck.

saisunil

Re: Comparison of Senn. HD650 and HiFiMan HE-500
« Reply #4 on: 9 Jul 2012, 12:54 am »
600 and 650 are very close - 600 are more neutral in character and 650 are both slightly more refined and slightly colored / euphonic ...  Most audiophiles / reviewers prefer 600 ... I preferred my recabled 600 over a friend's recabled 650 - he preferred his 650, I preferred my 600   :lol:

There are much better current production headphones (at their price points) today than these - but the old Senn are forgiving - means they are not as transparent ... for me, their biggest flaw was small sound-stage and lack of tight bass ... there are tweaks for all these ... I had a $1000? Mogami cable (that I bought used) that really did magic on tweaked 600 - but they still could not come close to recabled HE-500   but the 600/650 are so comfortable to wear ... thay have been tested and tried in the field for almost a decade ...

I think, the easiest way to get "affordable high-end" is through headphones ... getting used to the headphone sound and having something on your head is different challenge altogether ... along with personal sound preference

HD-800, Hifiman HE500, HE-6, Beyer T1, LCD2, Stax009 and some of the flagship phones that I have heard and are in another league altogether compared with HD-650 ... it is not just my opinion - one can easily borrow these phones from "the cable co." headphone library ... give them appropriate amplification and they give you true to "your" source experience ...

No offense, but most of the old school flagship phones don't hold a candle in front of the current flagship ... but it does not mean that someone could not enjoy music through any of the phones that they may have  :thumb:

Cheers

JohnR

Re: Comparison of Senn. HD650 and HiFiMan HE-500
« Reply #5 on: 9 Jul 2012, 12:36 pm »
Sunil, what amp/s are you using these days?

HAL

  • Industry Contributor
  • Posts: 5532
Re: Comparison of Senn. HD650 and HiFiMan HE-500
« Reply #6 on: 9 Jul 2012, 12:57 pm »
The HiFiMan HE-500's with the DIY Borbely SE HPA are a step up from the Sennheiser HD650's in the same setup.  The Borbely is easy to adapt to either low or high impedance style loads, by changing the output stage bias resistor and PS voltage.   

The Sennheisers are more comfortable to me.  The difference is not big to me and wear the HE-500's for long periods.   

I guess I am a planar guy after starting out with a pair of Magnepan MG-IIB's speakers back in the 80's. 

hibuckhobby

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 641
  • On a search for audio nirvana
Re: Comparison of Senn. HD650 and HiFiMan HE-500
« Reply #7 on: 9 Jul 2012, 01:23 pm »
"No offense, but most of the old school flagship phones don't hold a candle in front of the current flagship ... but it does not mean that someone could not enjoy music through any of the phones that they may have "

No offense taken.  I think the key word here is "most".  There is a reason that the 650 has been around as long as it has.  Not detracting from the 500 at all...it is clearly more detailed, transparent and extended.  It also is less gracious toward poor recordings.  The two are not "equal", but they are both "good".
Hibuck....

saisunil

Re: Comparison of Senn. HD650 and HiFiMan HE-500
« Reply #8 on: 9 Jul 2012, 02:33 pm »
Sunil, what amp/s are you using these days?


Actually I am not using headphones much these days - they are mostly sitting in the closet ...

In any case I have been using <a href="http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/aprilmusic8/1.html>Eximus DP1 DAC [/url] and Mytek DSD DAC
- both come with excellent headphone amps ...

Their headphone stages are worth the price of the DACs

I need to sell one of these DACs - but I am trying to justify keeping both ...

I have used Hifiman EF1, Headroom Max in recent past along with some others ... the headphone amp stages in these DACs is clearly better - for example - that those dedicated headphone amps ...

Cheers