[dspgolf]

I know this topic has been broached before but I have been playing around with  the gain setting on the back of my 4bsst sq amp. I really think the sound jumps and comes alive with the higher setting but the problem is I don't have much room to turn the volume control on my bp 26 pre-amp.  I'm using balanced cables but 9:00 on the volume control is about as high as I can get it?

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions?  Your input would be appreciated.

Thanks
Dave.

[amblin]

i'm using the 29dB setting (BP26 -->14B SST2-->PMC MB2i) in my 40 m^2 room (around 430sq ft) ,I never turn the knob beyond 10:00, otherwise it'd be too loud for me and my neighbours

[SoundGame]

I use the 23db setting and that is with single ended / RCA - a lower input voltage than balanced / XLR and I'm able to get it up to 12:00 no problem with my typical listening at around 10:00 in a small 12' X 15' room, running into a pair of small bookshelf speakers.
 
The 29db setting will provide a higher volume for a given input signal voltage but will not actually "jump" or "come alive" more than the 23db setting, if you turn up the volume on the 23db setting to get to the same relative volume as when you listen at the 29db setting.  In fact, the 23db setting will result in a lower noise floor of about 3db - so you will actually get better sound, especially on quiet passages.
 
My recommendation is that you use the 23db setting (especially since you are running balanced) and get used to using a larger sweep of the volume.  I'm thinking at the 23db setting you'll be able to get that volume to almost 3/4 full (3 o'clock) before you hit the same volume level that your reaching at 9/10 o'clock with the 29db setting.
 
Problem solved...

[SoundGame]

I know this topic has been broached before but I have been playing around with  the gain setting on the back of my 4bsst sq amp. I really think the sound jumps and comes alive with the higher setting but the problem is I don't have much room to turn the volume control on my bp 26 pre-amp.  I'm using balanced cables but 9:00 on the volume control is about as high as I can get it?

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions?  Your input would be appreciated.

Thanks
Dave.

Oh, another suggestion, get a pair of earplugs and you'll be able to turn it up all the way until those lights start flashing red - it would be interesting to know what volume setting that would be....LOL.

[DaveNote]

I am running 7BSST squared, with balanced cables, and tried both the 1v and 2v settings. I was aware of the points made by SoundGame, which I understand are technically correct (James Tanner explained this to me), but I could not detect the advantage in the 2v noise floor.  In my case, I like the 1v setting, which seems to give me more punch. But it means that going much beyond 8:00 on the volume setting could result in waking the dead. In your case it's 9:00. The owner's manual and James point out that you should use the setting you prefer. Bryston has answered you question, Dave. Set it to yor preference.

Dave

[SoundGame]

I'll have to admit one thing and I'm sure this is true for others.  There is a psychological effect of having to turn up the volume level higher to get to your preferred listening level and that is that you feel as though your amp is not strong enough.
 
In other words, if you have to turn the pot up to 12 o'clock or higher to get to the volume you want, you feel as though that's turning your amp up all the way to get to where you want it to be and there is not much more - this is only psychological - in fact, the amp might not even be working that hard at 12 o'clock on the 23db setting - only a few watts.
 
There is something pschologically pleasing about only having to turn it to 9 / 10 o'clock to feel as though your ears are going to blow - the feeling is that you've got way more room on the volume to crank it if you want to - in fact, this may not be the case as the red lights may only be a couple notches to go.
 
I've been disciplining myself to get used to having comfort in turning it up higher on the pot to get to the desired volume - this allows me to use more of the sweep and get more variation in volume level - it's as though I've now got a 100 volume position settings rather than 10 to utilize.  All that and I'm also more content that from a technical perspective, I'm maximizing the signal-to-nose ratio on the amp.
 
I would say that if you haven't tried the 23db setting for at least a month or more - to truly get used to it - you really haven't given it a fair chance.  There is only more to "gain" by going with it...no pun intended...

[James Tanner]

The lower gain setting actually has a lower noise floor.

james

[SoundGame]

The lower gain setting actually has a lower noise floor.

james

Yes, and with everything else being held equal - should result in better performance.
 
James - I'm just now thinking what would be the combined impact when you factor in the required preamp voltage.
 
I recognize that the lower (23db) gain setting on the amp results in a lower noise floor (around 3db) on the amp but to achieve the same desidred in-room volume / amplifier output, the preamp would now need to provide a higher input voltage.  What impact would the higher voltage output demand on the preamp have on overall sound - typically, higher output voltage on the preamp will result in higher distortion.
 
In short, does the lower noise floor achieved on the amp outweight the potentially higher distortion on the preamp output signal, given the higher voltage output demand?

[James Tanner]

Yes, and with everything else being held equal - should result in better performance.
 
James - I'm just now thinking what would be the combined impact when you factor in the required preamp voltage.
 
I recognize that the lower (23db) gain setting on the amp results in a lower noise floor (around 3db) on the amp but to achieve the same desidred in-room volume / amplifier output, the preamp would now need to provide a higher input voltage.  What impact would the higher voltage output demand on the preamp have on overall sound - typically, higher output voltage on the preamp will result in higher distortion.
 
In short, does the lower noise floor achieved on the amp outweight the potentially higher distortion on the preamp output signal, given the higher voltage output demand?

Our preamps have plus or minus 30 volts of swing so no issues at all on that front.

james

[RLL1]

I have never looked at the gain setting from a performance perspective. I use the lower setting to enable a more manageable volume control with my remote.

Rick

[SoundGame]

Our preamps have plus or minus 30 volts of swing so no issues at all on that front.

james

James - would it be possible to share the distortion levels on one or more of the Bryston preamps at maximim output voltage (15 v SE / 30 v BAL)?  My preamps test cert. only shows the distortion at the 3 volts output. 
 
With the 23db setting on my 4B-SST/2 and 2v required for 100 watts, it would take about 6v I guess to reach the 300 watt rated output level.  It would be interesting to know just how much higher the distortion get between 3v output (rated voltage) and the max. voltage of (15v).
 
 

[DaveNote]

James I knew about the noise floor advantage at the 2v setting, but should I be able to hear the difference that this noise floor creates with my 7BSST2s?

SoundGame, I think you're right about the psychological effect, as well as suggestions about trying the 2v setting for a while. But I'll ask you the same question: Do you hear a difference with the noise floor being different?

Dave

[dspgolf]

Is there any sort of a filter on the 23db setting?  How are you cutting down on the amount of gain?  My old 4B st did not have this feature and the volume seemed to travel further up the control.  I have listened to the lower setting since I initially bought the 4B sst squared amp but thought the dynamics sounded a little constrained but maybe it's just my imagination playing tricks on me.  The bass seems more explosive and the dynamic swings seem louder and more intense. 

Maybe I should switch toi RCA connections and bump up the gain again? 
Just hate that I have to leave volume at 9 o clock and can't get it much past without blowing out my ears.

[SoundGame]

James I knew about the noise floor advantage at the 2v setting, but should I be able to hear the difference that this noise floor creates with my 7BSST2s?

SoundGame, I think you're right about the psychological effect, as well as suggestions about trying the 2v setting for a while. But I'll ask you the same question: Do you hear a difference with the noise floor being different?

Dave

Sorry Dave but no, I haven't tried the 29db setting and so haven't compared.  I trust there is a technical / spec. difference - whether that can be detected or not is another story.  As well, I like being able to use more of the volume control - easier to find the right level - so I think I'll stick with the 23db / 2v setting.

[dspgolf]

Thanks for the input sound game.  I think I'm going to have to stick to the 23 db output. The higher just won't allow for more use of the volume on my bp 26 pre-amp. I might hear a difference in the noise floor when listening to classical music and the quiet passages come in to play. My speakers are b&w 803's and they definitely love the power the 4B SST 2 can provide them! 

[SoundGame]

Thanks for the input sound game.  I think I'm going to have to stick to the 23 db output. The higher just won't allow for more use of the volume on my bp 26 pre-amp. I might hear a difference in the noise floor when listening to classical music and the quiet passages come in to play. My speakers are b&w 803's and they defiantly love the power the 4B SST 2 can provide them!

[DaveNote]

Sorry Dave but no, I haven't tried the 29db setting and so haven't compared.  I trust there is a technical / spec. difference - whether that can be detected or not is another story.  As well, I like being able to use more of the volume control - easier to find the right level - so I think I'll stick with the 23db / 2v setting.

Thanks, SoundGame. I think I'll try the other setting for a while as you suggest to see if I hear a difference, although I don't have trouble finding the right volume level with a lesser range of control.

Dave