[doctorcilantro]

Advanced Analog MG-1 (linear) owner thread

I'd like to discuss fluid damping which I'm going to try when I get set up.

We can devote this thread to any discussion on the arm of course.

DC

[guest4954]

Would be an interesting thread!
I do have one. I use it still without the oil damping option.

No time yet to experiment.

What oil to use?
Is it messy?
Do people have Pictures?


Michiel

[doctorcilantro]

And then there were 2!

I have the damping trough now; it is not very rigid and overtightening the screws can make it non-level.

I ordered some KAB damping fluid of 60000CST and Ada Lin emailed saying that people had liked 12000-16000 (CST?).

Ada stated be careful:

"But, In air bearing tonearm. The movement breadth of linear tracking tonearm is much longer than the pivot tonearm.
Therefore, You must be very careful with the consistency of oil. Cause the wrong choice may cause a unwanted result.
Some of MG-1 user had report to me which they mentioned the silicon fluid is kind of good choice to damp MG-1 at certain condition like provide a non-controlled air supply.
They also recommend a number between 12000 to 18000 of silicone fluid should be a good choice.
I do not realize the result of the damping on MG-1 at each kind of damping oil. But it cause different performance for sure.
I had been tried on few fluid for MG-1. They all provide a more solid sounding image. But limit the detail of "airy"."

KAB emailed me and said many underdamp arms to the point of achieving no damping whatsoever, but I need to call him back and remind him exactly what arm I am using. Also, he states a damping trough should be rigid. I was considering having my uncle machine a metal damping trough for me; not sure yet.

DC

[analognut]

Hey Doc-
IMO 60k cst is a little thick. It is my impression that 30k cst fluid would be a medium viscosity. My SME V tonearm has silicone damping in the lateral plane. When using my new DL-103R with it a small amount of damping (30K cst) improved the sound a little. So, over time, I kept increasing the damping factor until I had it maxxed out with as much damping as the arm would allow, and the sound kept improving by marginal amounts. So I then went to 50k cst fluid, which did not provide any noticeable improvement over the 30cst.

READ THIS:
I purchased an AT-OC9ML/II new  and mounted it on the SME V. Initially I used a damping factor of 2 or 3 on my own scale of 1-7, with seven being high and 1 being low. Over time the exact opposite happened with OC9ML/II as what happened with 103-R. As the cart broke in I kept reducing the amount of damping until at some point around 100 hours or more I reached the point of ZERO damping for the best sound! With OC9ML/II any amount of damping no matter how small just sucks a proportional amount of life outa the music. Dynamics diminish, bass guitar doesn't slam as well, certain high frequency sounds become subdued, etc.

Conclusion: Whether or not damping will help one out depends a lot on the cart you are using and the setting you will ultimately decide on will be reached after your cart is fully broken in. I do not doubt that the tonearm has an influence on this as well, although I have only the one arm. 

[analognut]

To answer earsandeyes questions:

Yes, it is really messy! Do not overfill the trough because the fluid has a tendency to "migrate" and it'll end up on everything. Recommended to use a syringe to put it in. You can use Q-tips to get it out, if needed. You can purchase enough to last you most of your lifetime for $10 (complete with syringe) at this address: turntablebasics.com

Cheers! 

[doctorcilantro]

Thanks. I'm leery of the 60K for a linear tracker. I'd like to source some other stuff but read too many nightmares about tbasics on audiokarma.

[doctorcilantro]

Anyone have any less viscous fluid they want to trade for my 60K? Or for a few backup preamp tubes? I won't buy from TB; to many horror stories on AudioKarma. Any other vendors....?

[doctorcilantro]

Finally got my tonearm back online after the addition of some silver litz wire.Haven't messed around with any damping fluid yet, as I want to do some needledrops w/o first and break-in my new Grado.

[neobop]

Anyone have any less viscous fluid they want to trade for my 60K? Or for a few backup preamp tubes? I won't buy from TB; to many horror stories on AudioKarma. Any other vendors....?

Hi,
I have a full syringe of 30K from TB. I could use some 60K for a unipivot. I bought stuff a couple of times from TB - no problems, just a little slow once.

I'm not an MG-1 owner but I was thinking about it recently. The only other "good" linear arms I'm familiar with are ET and Goldmunds. Any comparisons with those? Don't care for Souther. Sorry if I'm off topic. I'm curious though.
neo

[doctorcilantro]

Hi,
I have a full syringe of 30K from TB. I could use some 60K for a unipivot. I bought stuff a couple of times from TB - no problems, just a little slow once.

I'm not an MG-1 owner but I was thinking about it recently. The only other "good" linear arms I'm familiar with are ET and Goldmunds. Any comparisons with those? Don't care for Souther. Sorry if I'm off topic. I'm curious though.
neo

Sounds good. I'll have to dig up the syringe; it's unused. The MG-1 is a great bang for the buck. I've never had any issues with it and it is actually a great design and implementation. The tonearm components have been upgrade to carbon fiber whereas previously it was just the wand iirc.

I'll post some pics soon.

[ricmon]

I've been looking at this tone arm for quite some time.  So my first question to MG-1 owners is what comes with the tone arm?  Are all the parts need to mount this arm included in the purchase price (base, ect)?  Also what about the sound.  I know in theory that it should have some advantages of traditional arms but by what margin?

thanks
Ric

[doctorcilantro]

I've been looking at this tone arm for quite some time.  So my first question to MG-1 owners is what comes with the tone arm?  Are all the parts need to mount this arm included in the purchase price (base, ect)?  Also what about the sound.  I know in theory that it should have some advantages of traditional arms but by what margin?

thanks
Ric

The damping trough is free after one year. Don't ask me why; maybe if you really want it you could beg him. 

He upgraded the arm parts so I guess the new ones come stock.

You have to buy a pump. I have used dual aquarium pumps in the past with other homebrew arms; I'd just bite the bullet and pay the $140? for the pump or find an equivalent online.

Couldn't hurt to have a ballast tank; I had a DIY one in the past but we just had our 2nd baby so he built me one for about 40-50 dollars and it is top notch actually.

You get the stock arm which is great and can buy an upgraded one which I also have.

I haven't owned a zillion arms but I love this one; it's on my ClearAudio Innovation Compact now.

I'll put more pics in my gallery (sig) soon.

[doctorcilantro]

PM sent.

Hi,
I have a full syringe of 30K from TB. I could use some 60K for a unipivot. I bought stuff a couple of times from TB - no problems, just a little slow once.

I'm not an MG-1 owner but I was thinking about it recently. The only other "good" linear arms I'm familiar with are ET and Goldmunds. Any comparisons with those? Don't care for Souther. Sorry if I'm off topic. I'm curious though.
neo

[doctorcilantro]

I've been looking at this tone arm for quite some time.  So my first question to MG-1 owners is what comes with the tone arm?  Are all the parts need to mount this arm included in the purchase price (base, ect)?  Also what about the sound.  I know in theory that it should have some advantages of traditional arms but by what margin?

thanks
Ric

Decent discussion on linears.

[doctorcilantro]

Anyone ever work out the effective mass of the MG1?

In the past I have suspected it to be as low as 4 grams when I used the online tools. Had a Grado wood body at the time and the stock counterweight of the MG1. Based on the resonant frequency which I think was around 11.

wonder if I could safely use a Soundsmith Aida or Voice with 28 µm/mN to track at 1g.

I think it should be okay. I would have to add some Blu-tack to my counterweight but the added mass shouldn't really get me below 8hz I would think.

[neobop]

Trying to determine eff mass based on dynamic cu and res fr is risky business. Those calculators are only an estimate anyway. Another thing is that many arms have diff eff mass horiz than vert. This is much more likely with an air bearing linear arm.

Why don't you give Soundsmith a call? I'm sure they'll be happy to advise. Maybe they have previous cust with the arm, and already know what works.
neo

[doctorcilantro]

Good points. Forgot about the vert. vs. horizontal effective mass.

I'd really like to use their high compliance model; I think it would prove sonically fruitful to use that low VTF.