Help! My listening room sucks!

Ernest · « **on:** 17 Dec 2003, 05:23 pm »

After spending an enormous amount of time and a large amount of money putting my audio system together, I’ve finally decided to turn my attention to my listening room. I should have done this first, and I have several times started to take the room seriously, but it is just so much less fun than playing with equipment that I kept putting it off. So now that I finally want to do this, I really need help. I am so lost. I would so very much appreciate any help you guys can give me. Here are some issues I am having:

What makes for an ideal listening room? What is it exactly I should be trying to do in my room?

Can I make a good, general purpose, listening room, or do I have to tailor the room to the equipment that I have?

My room is a rectangle with a sloped ceiling. It is 11.75 feet wide and 15 feet long. The ceiling slopes from 7 feet to 13 feet. The whole room is part of an addition on the back of my house. The low part of the ceiling is on the outside wall and the high part of the ceiling is on the inside wall. The inside wall is very thick since it used to be the outside wall of the house. The left wall is an inside wall (just wallboard) and the right wall is an outside wall. The floor is carpet over top of concrete. I hope that all made sense.

Oh, and there is a sliding glass door in the outside wall, and two large windows in the inside wall. I have Tuning Dots from a company called, I think, Marigo Audio, and they helped a lot in dealing with the windows. That was the full extent though of my previous room treatment attempts.

I used to have my system positioned along the outside wall (where the low part of the ceiling is). This is where it sounds best. However, it puts my system in a high traffic area since this is right where the door is into the room. Also, I’ve had to add a desk into the room and the desk works best on that side of the room. SO, my system is now positioned along the inside wall. Here, the sound sucks! It’s terrible! I can’t stand to listen to it. There’s no low bass. The mid-bass is too pronounced. And the sounds that should be centered are coming from about 3 feet to the right. I’ve moved the speakers all around and it doesn’t help. And the sound is very lean. Yuck! I just hate it.

Help!

Ernest

Tyson · « **Reply #1 on:** 17 Dec 2003, 05:30 pm »

Put it back on the area of the low ceiling, this is where it will sound best, anywhere else is either going to imbalance the sound, or introduce more room problems. Next, invest in a room pack from 8th Nerve, and experiment with tapestries hung at the speaker end of the room.

DARTH AUDIO · « **Reply #2 on:** 17 Dec 2003, 05:39 pm »

Ernest, check out www.auralex.com 317-842-2600 ask for Gavin. I just sent Gavin my listening room diagram.

Also call Pierre @ Mapleshade 301-627-7922. Pierre knows alot about room acoustics and he should.. he owns a recording studio. He has some great tweaks..

hope this helps..

Carlman · « **Reply #3 on:** 17 Dec 2003, 09:07 pm »

The ceiling would provide a nice effect if sloping upwards from the speakers to you... kind of like a music hall is designed. However, if you went to a performance and sat on the stage and the band played up in the rafters, how would it sound?

The only option I know to keep the arrangement you have would be to add a drop-tile ceiling.... or somehow mimic a ceiling. However, I would love to have that kind of a sloping ceiling. Can you move the door so it's not a high-traffic area?

I think you've answered your own question as to which arrangement is best. Now you need decide on how important it is to keep that arrangement.

-Carl

JLM · « **Reply #4 on:** 18 Dec 2003, 12:44 am »

Don't forget "our own" 8th nerve folks.

And here is another real top drawer option: http://www.rivesaudio.com/

They provide design services that start at $900. For $1,950 they will measure the tweak the room after remodeling/construction is complete. Labor and materials are extra. This is a lot more than most have in mind to spend on the room, but most estimates state that the room can be a factor in 40% of you hear.

warnerwh · « **Reply #5 on:** 18 Dec 2003, 02:12 am »

Here's a good article by Brian Cheney of VMPS:
http://www.vmpsaudio.com/htt1.htm

You'll be pleased when done treating your room. It's very cost effective and extremely important, more so than most people seem to think. Your system certainly will only do it's best in a good acoustic environment. You can get acoustic foam from a number of places on the internet for fairly reasonable prices. Also you don't have to do everything at once but once you hear the improvement a little makes it gets easy to get carried away. You should see what I did to my living room and it was well worth it. Cheers

lkosova · « **Reply #6 on:** 18 Dec 2003, 04:43 am »

Ask Ten people what to do and you will get ten different answers.

Start reading and educate yourself then make a drawing of your room and send it out for a "free' analysis to the above mentioned and also go to AVS and the theater builder section and search and ask away.

Spend no money till you have an idea of what to buy etc but before that I would repostion your setup and see how it sounds. If possible move it to another room and see what happens.

The room being a component is bigger then most think. It amazes me that people will spend thousands on components and listen to it in a subpar room.

Good luck and ask away.

Larry

JLM · « **Reply #7 on:** 20 Dec 2003, 02:36 am »

Larry, boy do I agree you (that 10 people will supply 10 different answers).

As I reread Big B's advice it reminded me of some of the reasons why you can get so many different answers:

1. Each type of speaker produces sound differently (planner/dipole, MTM, rear firing horns/ports, built-in speakers, large multi-driver designs, front loaded horns, etc.)

2. All our rooms are different (size, shape, resonance, absorption, furnishings, WAF, etc.)

3. We each have different musical and listening tastes.

This 3rd reason is interesting. How can you expect to produce proper soundstage of a symphony in a 12 x 19 room? How can the room "adapt" from orchesteral to small jazz to rock? How does the room reflect studio versus live recordings? Some would say you must take the room completely out of the equation, leading them ultimately to using headphones, biaural (or manipulated) recordings, and wear a "bass blanket" to simulate the feel of bass.

lkosova · « **Reply #8 on:** 20 Dec 2003, 04:52 am »

JLM,

Isn't this a fun hobby????

BTW-My advice is always right!!!(heh,heh).

Larry

Kevin P · « **Reply #9 on:** 20 Dec 2003, 04:15 pm »

I would agree you need to spend some time educating yourself first. Otherwise you will send out that drawing of your room and get back a shopping list. Some of which you will buy and some not.... the end result will be a mess. You might want to consider getting yourself a measurement system also. The Rat Shack SPL meter at the very least. Otherwise you will be doing everything by ear, which takes much longer (and more experience) to get it right.

You have a difficult room to deal with. Simple rectangles are the easiest. If you have the budget building a room is a better investment than most people make in equipment purchases.

I'd list in order of importance:

#1. Loudspeakers
#2. Room
#3. Amplification
#4. Source
#5. Wires, tweaks etc......

That is probably the order in which you should prioritize your spending and it is scary to see most people (including me) are very lopsided in adhering to this.

warnerwh · « **Reply #10 on:** 20 Dec 2003, 05:12 pm »

One thing that is usually pretty consistent: If you use front radiating speakers, treating the wall behind your system and possibly at least coming out somewhat on the ceiling and sidewalls will very likely help immensely. This really cleans up the imaging and it will also make the room more quiet.